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2004-11-23 10:28 PM

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Subject: 13 weeks to a 13hr Ironman
I think that's the name of one of Gail Berhardt's training plans. I downloaded it from http://66.77.216.76/exec/triathlete/chart.cfm?publicationid=92

I was told that it is pretty much the same plan that appears in her "...Multisports Athletes..." book.

I plan on basing most of my training on this program. My Iron distance race is on May 15, 2005.

Is anyone following this program? Any opinions on it?

Thanks.

Felix

Edited by dragoman 2004-11-23 10:33 PM


2004-11-24 10:09 AM
in reply to: #86072

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Subject: RE: 13 weeks to a 13hr Ironman
I would be afraid to do a 13 week plan, but most triathletes are in better condition then I am.  I think she assumes that you have a really good base going in, and she sets forth some pre-existing criteria for this plan ( swim: 1:14 to 1:25 hours,  bike: 6:30 to 7:15 hours, run:  4:15  - 5:00 hours).  FWIW if I were to use this plan, I would duplicate some of the early weeks and extend it from 13 to 20 or more weeks.   (It seems like quite a few BTers are using a book called 'Be Iron Fit' by an author named Fink. )
2004-11-26 9:44 PM
in reply to: #86072

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Subject: RE: 13 weeks to a 13hr Ironman
Nice enough plan but what do the codes mean?  At the top of the page it says "to learn more, please click here.", which brings you to a page that is entitled "Thirteen Weeks to an Ironman Training" with no article.  It does, however, say: " clik here to view the 13-week Ironman training chart by Gale Bernhardt."   Hmmmmmm.....
2004-11-26 11:12 PM
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Subject: RE: 13 weeks to a 13hr Ironman
There used to be a link explaining the codes. Here's what I recall (not the exact Bernhardt wording though, but you get the idea) :

E1 Heart rate zone 1 (easy)
E2 Zone 2 (moderate)
E3 Zone 3 (aerobic)

This program includes no anaerobic or LT training. I will most likely do some harder training as other single sport races approach, but will base most of my workouts on this plan.

Thanks for taking a look.

Felix
2004-12-02 8:48 PM
in reply to: #86072

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Subject: RE: 13 weeks to a 13hr Ironman
Check out Going Long by Gordo Byrn as well as www.coachgordo.com for his tips.

He is THE coach for IM.
2004-12-03 8:32 AM
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Subject: RE: 13 weeks to a 13hr Ironman
trilover - 2004-12-02 8:48 PM

Check out Going Long by Gordo Byrn as well as www.coachgordo.com for his tips.

He is THE coach for IM.


Thanks Trilover. I've been reading some of Gordo's tips and bookmarked the page for future reference.

As for my IM training, I finally decided to purchase a copy of Gail Bernhardt's _Training Plans for Multisports Athletes_and am following the 26-week IronMan plan. This time span seems better for me than 13 weeks (following Drinking Buddy's advice). I am just in the first week which requires some sub-LT time trials in all three sports. The plan in the book is definitely more comprehensive than the one in the link I posted before.

Unfortunately, my local swimming pool has closed for holidays and maintenance until mid-January, so I probably will not be able to swim elsewhere more than once or twice per week till then.

Félix

Edited by dragoman 2004-12-03 8:35 AM


2007-05-15 12:59 PM
in reply to: #86072

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Subject: RE: 13 weeks to a 13hr Ironman

Here is a copy of the 13 hour plan: http://www.cluboceano.com/13.htm

 

I wonder how many have used this plan to complete an ironman and what they thought about it.

2007-05-15 3:01 PM
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Subject: RE: 13 weeks to a 13hr Ironman
I used the 13-week plan for IMFL in 2003 and it worked fine for me. I went 12:21 and would have gone well under 12 hours if not for GI problems in the later miles of the marathon. I would have to go back and see (if I had the time) how much, if any (I'm sure I did), I modified the plan to suit my needs, but I know that I based my training on the plan. I think if anything, I did more than the plan called for. Caveat: I did have a very good base going into it as I completed Eagleman in June prior to IMFL. Just my $.02.
2007-05-15 6:11 PM
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Subject: RE: 13 weeks to a 13hr Ironman

I have used this training plan as a guideline for my last 13 weeks of training for each of my IMs.  Well, actually I use her "13 weeks to a sub-13 hour IM" plan as was published in Triathlete Magazine a few years ago.  I don't follow it exactly, and tweak it to work for me and my life, but I basically follow the pattern of build up of long rides and runs.  I tend to dial up the cycling, and dial back on the swimming (you can tell Gale comes from a swimming background from her plans).

I probably came the closest to following the plan as written for my first IM, except I cut back on the swimming.  That still stands as my best IM to date (11:37).

I again plan to refer back to this plan to pattern my build up to IM this year.  It's taken me to the finish line in under 13 hours on 4 of 5 attempts.  My one failure in the 5 IM attempts was due to a combination of being severely undertrained due to an achilles injury, and an error in my nutrition on a very hot day.  That year, I wound up in an ambulance somewhere past mile 22 on the run.

-Steve

2007-05-15 6:28 PM
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Subject: RE: 13 weeks to a 13hr Ironman
Steve in IL - 2007-05-15 6:11 PM

I have used this training plan as a guideline for my last 13 weeks of training for each of my IMs.  Well, actually I use her "13 weeks to a sub-13 hour IM" plan as was published in Triathlete Magazine a few years ago.  I don't follow it exactly, and tweak it to work for me and my life, but I basically follow the pattern of build up of long rides and runs.  I tend to dial up the cycling, and dial back on the swimming (you can tell Gale comes from a swimming background from her plans).

I probably came the closest to following the plan as written for my first IM, except I cut back on the swimming.  That still stands as my best IM to date (11:37).

I again plan to refer back to this plan to pattern my build up to IM this year.  It's taken me to the finish line in under 13 hours on 4 of 5 attempts.  My one failure in the 5 IM attempts was due to a combination of being severely undertrained due to an achilles injury, and an error in my nutrition on a very hot day.  That year, I wound up in an ambulance somewhere past mile 22 on the run.

-Steve

Can't argue with that success. 

 

2007-05-17 11:25 AM
in reply to: #86072

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Subject: RE: 13 weeks to a 13hr Ironman

Wow - interesting plan.  I fit the description of the athlete profile in the plan, but I am wondering if it really works for a sub 13 hour race as desribed.  As a complete novice, the overall volume for peak weak (13 hours) appears light - AND a 2 week taper doesn't seem like enough to me.  However, I am making these comment with zero actual IM race day experience.  I am using the Beginner BT Plan for IM CdA as a ROUGH guide for my training and peak week hours are 18, with a 4 week taper. 

As I have a runner's background, this plan appears similar to the "Less is More" marathon training program, which I know a lot of people have had success with. 

So, Steve or others who have used this plan, is it really possible to train for a sub 13 IM with a peak week of 13 hours?  And, did you find you needed more than a 2 week taper?

Thanks!



2007-05-17 1:11 PM
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Subject: RE: 13 weeks to a 13hr Ironman

Please note that Gale has two similar sounding plans:

13 Weeks to a 13 Hour Ironman, and

13 Weeks to a SUB 13 Hour Ironman

I tend to align my plan more with the SUB 13 hour plan.  You'll find higher volume in the SUB 13 hour plan.

All that said, though, I tweak the plans around to work for me, which for me often means cutting back on, or eliminating some of the mid-week workouts.  In so doing, I cut back on the volume of her SUB 13 plan, and seldom ever achieve volumes of >13 hours.  I don't really care about total weekly volume.  For me, it's all about the key long sessions - particularly the long ride and long run.

Just looking again at her regular 13 hour plan, things I'd change are:

*  I'd bump up all those long bike rides by 1 hour each, building up to at least a 6 hour long ride.  If you can get in a couple 6 hour rides, that would be better.  I think topping out at one 5 hour ride is far too light on the bike.

* I'd pretty much stick with her run build-up, except, I wouldn't do that 3 hour run just two weeks out.  I usually do my longest run, of about 3 hours, 3 weeks out from race day.  I'd do my last long ride of 6 to 6.5 hours, 2 weeks out.  So, you might say I start my run taper 3 weeks out, and my cycling taper 2 weeks out.

*  I recall in her SUB 13 hour plan, she shows a 2 hour ride, 2 hour run brick....if I'm not mistaken...just one week before race day.  I thought that was crazy, and actually sent her an email asking about it.  I was surprised that she actually responded pretty quickly, saying she thought it would be just fine to dial back on that run, which I did.  I'd do something more like a 2 hour ride, 45 min. run at one week out.

* I cut way back on the swimming.  That might explain why I'm such an awful swimmer, but hey, there are other things in my life and if I'm going to cut back on a plan, swimming's the thing to go for me.

*  I don't sweat the mid week workouts too much.  I try to follow the plan as best I can, but if life gets in the way, I don't hesitate to cut back on, or eliminate, some mid-week workouts.  The long stuff is the key.

 So, in summary, I have found that I can definitely achieve SUB 13 hours on total training volume similar to Gale's regular "13 hour" plan, sometimes even less.  The year my son was born, for the last 6 weeks of my training I cut my training back to just one long workout per sport per week.  That was it.  And still was able to come in under 13 hours, this time carrying my 2 month old son :-)  Perhaps it's an individual thing, and other's may have different results.  But for me, using Gale's plans as a guideline and tweaking them around as described, has worked just fine.

-Steve

2007-05-17 5:22 PM
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Subject: RE: 13 weeks to a 13hr Ironman
We are switching over from the beginning BT IM plan to the 13 weeks to 13 plan. The 13 week plan is more flexible for our schedule (we have a 7 yr. old & 4 year old and my husband and I are doing the race together). We will likely not hit the 13 hour time, my bike is a little weak for that, but I really like the plan. We have built our training to around 8 - 11 hours per week over the last few months. I think you need to have a solid knowlege base to do this plan, it doesn't give the detail the BT and other plans provide, but I am a personal trainer & soon to be USAT certified coach so I feel like we can give it our own structure.
Having said all that, we will be adding an extra hour a week to our long bike rides and will include atleast one double metric century ride in mid July.
So, for a long tirade, I really like the plan for anyone who has a pretty good knowlege base & knows their limiters & can suppliment that part of their training.
I'll let you know how it goes after 8/26!!
2007-05-17 5:55 PM
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Subject: RE: 13 weeks to a 13hr Ironman
This plan is interesting. I have used the BT IM plan before but not this one. This seems simpler and easier to fit in all the workouts. To me the heart rates seem low to me(only based on my experience), to those of you who have done this plan, do you really keep your HR in zone 2 on all of your long runs and rides? unless i am crawling on a run (under 6mph- i know running is my biggest limiter) i cant keep my heart rate in z2. Or is this a problem with my fitness/training? how close do you follow the HR zones for the workouts?


Travis
2007-05-18 12:02 PM
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Subject: RE: 13 weeks to a 13hr Ironman
We live in a hilly area, so I find that I can keep my HR at the mid to top of z2 for a run until I hit the hills, then it climbs. I just work on my recovery after the spike. I also look at my avg. hr rather than watching it at all times. I am doing a run - walk for the 26.2 (which was very highly reccommended by a former pro that has finsihed Kona multiple times) so while I might have spikes the recovery during the flats & my 1 min. walks gives me an avg. in z2. (having said all that my z2 runs are around a high 9 - low 10 min. mile so that would qualify as crawling at 6 mph!!)
2007-05-21 8:27 AM
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Subject: RE: 13 weeks to a 13hr Ironman

HI, I based my first IM, Lake Placid, completely on this training plan. My time was 12:40, so the title of the plan is correct!!

Good luck!!

Chris



2007-05-21 10:08 AM
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Subject: RE: 13 weeks to a 13hr Ironman

I don't follow the HR guidance exactly to the plan, but I do try to be disciplined in my HR control on the long bike rides.  Typically I try to control my HR on long rides much as I need to do on race day, capping my HR no higher than zone 2 for the first 1/2 to 2/3 of the ride, then pushing the pace a bit spending some time in zone 3 for the latter 1/3, or so, of the ride.

I really like this article Rich Strauss put together on IM race day execution, and try to follow the HR guidance for the bike as described here.

http://www.cruciblefitness.com/etips/IMHowTo.htm

You will see that Gale's plan shows some zone 3 work in several of the long runs.  I don't pay as much attention to HR on my long runs as I do on my long rides.  I go a bit more by feel on the run, and try to mix things up with some short intervals of higher intensity.

-Steve



Edited by Steve in IL 2007-05-21 10:10 AM
2007-05-21 6:17 PM
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Subject: RE: 13 weeks to a 13hr Ironman

I second following anything that Gordo says in his book.  He uses a lot of common sense.  You have a good background already Felix, I just think you need to "top off the gas tank" so to speak and you'll be fine.  The big secret to a successful Ironman is coming off the bike with enough left in reserve to run the entire marathon.  And this isn't just from me...it's Gordo's main philosophy!

 

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