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Marathon Long Run Question
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 2010-04-13 7:41 PM |
Member  52  Fort Wayne, IN |  Subject: Marathon Long Run QuestionTraining for my first marathon on May 2nd (Flying Pig). Unfortunately the start of baseball season (I work for a minor league baseball team) has put a serious pinch on the training. As I'm sure some of you can relate...sometimes life gets in the way. So Sunday, on what was supposed to be my 20 mile "peak", I only had time to get in a 10 mile. So the question becomes, do I try to do the 20 later this week, in place of the 12 scheduled for Sunday, or bag it? I'm still 19 days out... I've put in a couple of 16's and one 18...and hit 100 miles each of the last two months. Not world records, I know, but a lot for me. I've been using Higdon's plan (and missed only a couple of mid week medium runs), which I know makes me undertrained heading to the line anyway. Going with my wife who's running the 10k on Saturday and my daughter who's doing the 3 year old run. Any finish is a PR for me, so I'm just hoping to enjoy the weekend... Any advice would be appreciated! |
| 2010-04-13 7:47 PM in reply to: #2789733 |
Champion 7595   Columbia, South Carolina | Subject: RE: Marathon Long Run Question I think you could go either way. If it were me, I'd try to do the 20 miler. You have time to recover from it before the race. But 18 is enough to be your longest run in training. Just my opinion -- I'm not an expert. |
| 2010-04-13 7:50 PM in reply to: #2789733 |
Expert 1159  Charlotte, NC | Subject: RE: Marathon Long Run Question I think you're OK with going 20 this weekend (or maybe even 18) from a timing perspective. The bigger concern I have regarding your training is the mileage you're getting in during the week (or lack thereof). An 18 or 20 mile weekend run is an unusually large percentage of your total weekly mileage if you're "only" running 100 or so miles a month. Typically I'd want to see AT LEAST 40 miles a week. My advice would be to take your remaining long run very easy, on a good surface (i.e. no blacktop or concrete), get a good taper in and then take your marathon at a very conservative pace. I fear you may be risking injury or a very unpleasant experience with your race - 26.2 miles is indeed a long way to run, especially when you're under-trained. Best of luck to you. |
| 2010-04-13 7:57 PM in reply to: #2789733 |
Champion 7233 | Subject: RE: Marathon Long Run Question i might do another 15-18 mi one, but if you have nothing else long scheduled i prob would not do 20 now. just me though. |
| 2010-04-13 7:59 PM in reply to: #2789733 |
| Subject: RE: Marathon Long Run Question I'm not an expert, but if it were me, I would go for a 10-12 mile run later this week, and do a 15-17 miler this Sunday. That would leave you 2 full weeks to taper down. This of course assumes that doing so would not violate the 10% increase rule. |
| 2010-04-13 8:53 PM in reply to: #2789733 |
Member 52 Fort Wayne, IN | Subject: RE: Marathon Long Run Question Well, you guys hit on both things that will be going through my head at the start line. Lack of total milage (not being able to commit enought time to mid week runs) and the magic 20 mile mark. In my defense, I'm not that far off of the total milage in Higdon's beginner plan (something like 93% of the total to this point). Again, I know that leaves me undertrained, but thus far I've felt pretty good. Any other thoughts welcome! Thanks for the feedback, much appreciated. |
| 2010-04-13 9:20 PM in reply to: #2789733 |
Bob 2194 Binghamton, NY | Subject: RE: Marathon Long Run Question I would forget the 20 miler and continue with the plan as written. The mileage you've been putting in has been very good and stressing about whether you get a 20 miler in just isn't worth it. If it makes you feel any better I just did the Knoxville Marathon with 13 miles as my long run and felt pretty good overall. I'll be down there doing the race and there are a bunch of BTers who will be in the 3:45-4:00 range. Hope to see you there! |
| 2010-04-14 12:03 AM in reply to: #2789765 |
Master 1433 Calgary, AB Silver member | Subject: RE: Marathon Long Run Question newbz - 2010-04-13 6:57 PM i might do another 15-18 mi one, but if you have nothing else long scheduled i prob would not do 20 now. just me though. Your logs show 120.22 KM in 2h 52m last week - you're a machine so we can't listen to you anymore.  |
| 2010-04-14 12:45 AM in reply to: #2789733 |
| Subject: RE: Marathon Long Run Question He can teleport...you'll notice some of his runs he travels a given distance in zero time. |
| 2010-04-14 2:51 AM in reply to: #2789733 |
Expert 1484 | Subject: RE: Marathon Long Run Question If it makes you feel any better, I just did the Whidbey Island Marathon on Sunday in 3:30 and never ran more than 17 miles as my long run. That long run was at my wife's pace and included a lot of walking (I was really sick and bonked on mile 3 of the run...) When I went back and looked at my running volumes I was very surprised to see how little running I actually did for this race. Looks like my peak week was 5hrs and I was averaging more like 3 to 3.5hrs running a week. I've also been very sick recently (nasty flu that my whole family has). Over a week I tend to do one long run, one tempo or negative split run (some times some speed work) and then shorter runs below race pace. I'd just keep following the plan. Start the race healthy and rested, ease into your race pace, hydrate and eat early on, and stay focused on finishing. Remember that you may need to adjust your race strategy during the run. The one I just did was very hilly, on the first real climb I found I did not have the legs to keep my pace up. So I settled into the hills a bit slower than I wanted and made the time back up on the flats and gradual downhills. That kept my HR and effort levels in check and allowed me to track right into my goal time. |
| 2010-04-14 2:53 AM in reply to: #2789733 |
Expert 1023 Ft Gordon, GA | Subject: RE: Marathon Long Run Question More than anything, if you will "need" to have had that 20 miler completed for your mental fitness, then do it, but o/w, in my opinion, you have plenty of mileage and long runs in. Just do a decent run this week and start your atper. But, like I said, if you "need" it for you mental toughness, then knock it out. Never underestimate how much of a role mental toughness will play for those last 5 to 6 miles during the race. |
| 2010-04-14 6:12 AM in reply to: #2789733 |
Runner | Subject: RE: Marathon Long Run Question The importance of the long run is inversely proportional to the total amount of run volume you have. Of course, there comes a point where no matter how long it is, one run is probably not going to make or break you. You could compromise and make the 12 miler a 15-16 miler. |
| 2010-04-14 7:48 AM in reply to: #2789733 |
Champion 7547 Albuquerque, New Mexico Bronze member | Subject: RE: Marathon Long Run Question I'm in the same boat you are. Doing the Pig (my first marathon) and didn't get the 3+ hour run in last weekend per the plan (BT Marathon). Was planning to do an 18-20 miler this Friday or Saturday to "catch up." March was a 100-mile month, but I traveled for 10 of those days with only a single 3.5 mile run. About 80 of them were in the last half of the month. BTW, I'm putting together a BT gathering, check out the racetalk, http://www.beginnertriathlete.com/discussion/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=202620&posts=4&start=1
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| 2010-04-14 8:02 AM in reply to: #2789733 |
Pro 4277 Parker, CO | Subject: RE: Marathon Long Run Question everyone is different as you can see with the replies to your post. If you do a 20-miler this weekend you still have 2-weeks until your marathon. that is enough time to get your body rested assuming you taper well for the next 2-weeks. not ideal as if I was following a plan I would want a 3-week taper...but we don't do this for a living and like you said, sometimes life gets in the way. Physically, I don't know that the 20-miler will be helping you that much. But if you have never gone that distance before it will be a good mental boost in those later miles. |
| 2010-04-14 8:03 AM in reply to: #2790436 |
Bob 2194 Binghamton, NY | Subject: RE: Marathon Long Run Question McFuzz - 2010-04-14 8:48 AM I'm in the same boat you are. Doing the Pig (my first marathon) and didn't get the 3+ hour run in last weekend per the plan (BT Marathon). Was planning to do an 18-20 miler this Friday or Saturday to "catch up." March was a 100-mile month, but I traveled for 10 of those days with only a single 3.5 mile run. About 80 of them were in the last half of the month. BTW, I'm putting together a BT gathering, check out the racetalk, http://www.beginnertriathlete.com/discussion/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=202620&posts=4&start=1 I've never liked the idea of "catching-up" missed workouts. Just continue the plan and enjoy the rested legs. You're going to "Rock the Pig!". On another note. I don't get in until 5pm Saturday (after Delta changed my flight a couple times, giving me a 5 hr layover in Detroit then flying over Cinci to Lexington only to fly back to Cinci!) I'll try to get over to the dinner after I pick up my race packet. |
| 2010-04-14 8:10 AM in reply to: #2790265 |
| Expert 618 | Subject: RE: Marathon Long Run Question Scout7 - 2010-04-14 7:12 AM The importance of the long run is inversely proportional to the total amount of run volume you have. Of course, there comes a point where no matter how long it is, one run is probably not going to make or break you. You could compromise and make the 12 miler a 15-16 miler. What he said ^^^. If you have a decent amount of volume then the long runs become less important. But 100 a month is not a very large amount of volume. There is a psychological benefit to doing a 20 however. And a 3 week taper can be too long sometimes. I'd say go for the 20 later this week or this weekend if you have the opportunity (or as an alternative if you can't fit in Scout's 15 - 16). |
| 2010-04-14 9:42 AM in reply to: #2789733 |
Expert 2555 Colorado Springs, Colorado | Subject: RE: Marathon Long Run Question For people who have a goal time in mind, I'm not a fan of these very low volume plans. IMO, the volume is so low that if a person misses a few runs here and there (especially key runs), their goal is difficult, if not impossible to reach. I don't know the specifics of the plan being used here, but it sounds more like something designed to just allow a person to finish and may not be well suited for a person with a goal time. That being said, I don't see any real benefit in doing a 20 miler at this point, other than a possible mental boost. IMO you would be better served to go with a run of 14-16 miles with the last 3-4 at goal pace. But if you're not feeling great when it comes time to push the faster pace, don't feel compelled to do it. No sense risking injury this close to the race. Use this race as a learning experience. As you said, it will be a PR no matter what. Often a good marathon is not who runs the fastest, but who slows down the least. |
| 2010-04-14 11:49 AM in reply to: #2790462 |
Champion 7547 Albuquerque, New Mexico Bronze member | Subject: RE: Marathon Long Run Question rstocks3 - 2010-04-14 8:03 AM I should probably listen to the voice of reason and experience...McFuzz - 2010-04-14 8:48 AM I'm in the same boat you are. Doing the Pig (my first marathon) and didn't get the 3+ hour run in last weekend per the plan (BT Marathon). Was planning to do an 18-20 miler this Friday or Saturday to "catch up." March was a 100-mile month, but I traveled for 10 of those days with only a single 3.5 mile run. About 80 of them were in the last half of the month. BTW, I'm putting together a BT gathering, check out the racetalk, http://www.beginnertriathlete.com/discussion/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=202620&posts=4&start=1 I've never liked the idea of "catching-up" missed workouts. Just continue the plan and enjoy the rested legs. You're going to "Rock the Pig!". On another note. I don't get in until 5pm Saturday (after Delta changed my flight a couple times, giving me a 5 hr layover in Detroit then flying over Cinci to Lexington only to fly back to Cinci!) I'll try to get over to the dinner after I pick up my race packet. 5 hours? You could DRIVE from Detroit to Cincy in less time! Not a problem. I was figuring an informal 6:30 and the place is very close to the venue. |
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