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2011-01-25 10:49 AM
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Subject: RE: Pit Bulls and Pit Mixes
jmcconne - 2011-01-25 8:30 AM I would think a a breed ban/legislation would be too difficult to be worth it. I do believe that any time an animal is loose and within a hundred feet of a person, shooting the unknown animal is completely acceptable. No reason to risk someone being hurt.  If a loose animal does hurt someone, the owner should be held criminally liable.


Uuuh, no.
That is not acceptable. By any stretch of the imagination.


2011-01-25 10:54 AM
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Subject: RE: Pit Bulls and Pit Mixes
Just saw the neighbors kitten on the lawn. Now where did i put my 12 gauge...
2011-01-25 11:11 AM
in reply to: #3320412

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Subject: RE: Pit Bulls and Pit Mixes
lisac957 - 2011-01-25 10:49 AM
jmcconne - 2011-01-25 8:30 AM I would think a a breed ban/legislation would be too difficult to be worth it. I do believe that any time an animal is loose and within a hundred feet of a person, shooting the unknown animal is completely acceptable. No reason to risk someone being hurt.  If a loose animal does hurt someone, the owner should be held criminally liable.


Uuuh, no.
That is not acceptable. By any stretch of the imagination.


Why not?  Why should I be required to take on any risk of an animal hurting my child because the owner is incompetent?  Do I have to wait for the animal to attack my child before I am allowed to do anything?

Pit bulls can run at 30 mph (link), which translates to 44 feet/sec.  There would be some time to get up to full speed, but in a low estimate it would take 10-15 seconds for a pit bull to travel 100 feet. So in a scenario where a pit bull (or any animal with the strength to kill) wants to attack (I don't know who it was raised) your child in your front yard you have 10-15 seconds to protect your child.
2011-01-25 11:18 AM
in reply to: #3320474

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Subject: RE: Pit Bulls and Pit Mixes
jmcconne - 2011-01-25 11:11 AM
lisac957 - 2011-01-25 10:49 AM
jmcconne - 2011-01-25 8:30 AM I would think a a breed ban/legislation would be too difficult to be worth it. I do believe that any time an animal is loose and within a hundred feet of a person, shooting the unknown animal is completely acceptable. No reason to risk someone being hurt.  If a loose animal does hurt someone, the owner should be held criminally liable.


Uuuh, no.
That is not acceptable. By any stretch of the imagination.


Why not?  Why should I be required to take on any risk of an animal hurting my child because the owner is incompetent?  Do I have to wait for the animal to attack my child before I am allowed to do anything?

Pit bulls can run at 30 mph (link), which translates to 44 feet/sec.  There would be some time to get up to full speed, but in a low estimate it would take 10-15 seconds for a pit bull to travel 100 feet. So in a scenario where a pit bull (or any animal with the strength to kill) wants to attack (I don't know who it was raised) your child in your front yard you have 10-15 seconds to protect your child.


But that's not what you said at all. You said "any time any animal is loose within 100 feet" you should be able to shoot it.
If an animal is clearly attacking your child, yes.
If an animal is simply loose, no. Not at all.

You'll go to jail for that where I live.
2011-01-25 11:21 AM
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Subject: RE: Pit Bulls and Pit Mixes
jmcconne - 2011-01-25 6:11 PM

lisac957 - 2011-01-25 10:49 AM
jmcconne - 2011-01-25 8:30 AM I would think a a breed ban/legislation would be too difficult to be worth it. I do believe that any time an animal is loose and within a hundred feet of a person, shooting the unknown animal is completely acceptable. No reason to risk someone being hurt.  If a loose animal does hurt someone, the owner should be held criminally liable.


Uuuh, no.
That is not acceptable. By any stretch of the imagination.


Why not?  Why should I be required to take on any risk of an animal hurting my child because the owner is incompetent?  Do I have to wait for the animal to attack my child before I am allowed to do anything?

Pit bulls can run at 30 mph (link), which translates to 44 feet/sec.  There would be some time to get up to full speed, but in a low estimate it would take 10-15 seconds for a pit bull to travel 100 feet. So in a scenario where a pit bull (or any animal with the strength to kill) wants to attack (I don't know who it was raised) your child in your front yard you have 10-15 seconds to protect your child.


And i suppose you go around assuming ALL animals in your vicinity are "out to get you"?

Like i said, if 1/2 animals were likely to attack, maybe i'd buy your argument, but with 1/10000 odds, i'd say your a goofball for wanting to kill all animals you see.

That's all i'll add to this thread, now i'm of hunting kittens, i heard about someone being severely scratched by a kitten once... must kill all kittens...

2011-01-25 12:33 PM
in reply to: #3320495

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Subject: RE: Pit Bulls and Pit Mixes
lisac957 - 2011-01-24 12:18 PM
But that's not what you said at all. You said "any time any animal is loose within 100 feet" you should be able to shoot it.
If an animal is clearly attacking your child, yes.
If an animal is simply loose, no. Not at all.

You'll go to jail for that where I live.


Maybe if you're out in public.  

If a dog wanders onto your property and you shoot it, there aren't many places that will put you in jail.

Any strange dog that wanders into my yard and doesn't respond to a stern "shooing" stands a decent chance of getting shot.


2011-01-25 12:38 PM
in reply to: #3320721

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Subject: RE: Pit Bulls and Pit Mixes
moondawg14 - 2011-01-25 12:33 PM
lisac957 - 2011-01-24 12:18 PM
But that's not what you said at all. You said "any time any animal is loose within 100 feet" you should be able to shoot it.
If an animal is clearly attacking your child, yes.
If an animal is simply loose, no. Not at all.

You'll go to jail for that where I live.


Maybe if you're out in public.  

If a dog wanders onto your property and you shoot it, there aren't many places that will put you in jail.

Any strange dog that wanders into my yard and doesn't respond to a stern "shooing" stands a decent chance of getting shot.


OK, but that's not what jmmconne said, or what I was replying to.
Personally I'd prefer to call animal services than just murder loose dogs. Maybe I'm alone on that.


Edited by lisac957 2011-01-25 12:38 PM
2011-01-25 12:40 PM
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Subject: RE: Pit Bulls and Pit Mixes
lisac957 - 2011-01-25 1:38 PM
moondawg14 - 2011-01-25 12:33 PM
lisac957 - 2011-01-24 12:18 PM
But that's not what you said at all. You said "any time any animal is loose within 100 feet" you should be able to shoot it.
If an animal is clearly attacking your child, yes.
If an animal is simply loose, no. Not at all.

You'll go to jail for that where I live.


Maybe if you're out in public.  

If a dog wanders onto your property and you shoot it, there aren't many places that will put you in jail.

Any strange dog that wanders into my yard and doesn't respond to a stern "shooing" stands a decent chance of getting shot.


OK, but that's not what jmmconne said, or what I was replying to.
Personally I'd prefer to call animal services than just murder loose dogs. Maybe I'm alone on that.


No. You're not alone on that.
2011-01-25 1:20 PM
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Subject: RE: Pit Bulls and Pit Mixes
lisac957 - 2011-01-25 11:18 AM

But that's not what you said at all. You said "any time any animal is loose within 100 feet" you should be able to shoot it.
If an animal is clearly attacking your child, yes.
If an animal is simply loose, no. Not at all.

You'll go to jail for that where I live.


I likely should have been more clear. 10-15 seconds may not enough time to react in a manner that will ensure you or your child are not hurt.  Which is why I believe it should be legal to use lethal force on an animal when there is a possibility myself or my child could be killed or injured.  We have to remember this is a an animal.  There is 0 reason for me to risk my child getting hurt because someone improperly secured their animal.

Secure the animal with a properly designed fence or a leash.  Then this is a non-issue.
2011-01-25 2:10 PM
in reply to: #3320835

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Subject: RE: Pit Bulls and Pit Mixes
jmcconne - 2011-01-25 11:20 AM
lisac957 - 2011-01-25 11:18 AM

But that's not what you said at all. You said "any time any animal is loose within 100 feet" you should be able to shoot it.
If an animal is clearly attacking your child, yes.
If an animal is simply loose, no. Not at all.

You'll go to jail for that where I live.


I likely should have been more clear. 10-15 seconds may not enough time to react in a manner that will ensure you or your child are not hurt.  Which is why I believe it should be legal to use lethal force on an animal when there is a possibility myself or my child could be killed or injured.  We have to remember this is a an animal.  There is 0 reason for me to risk my child getting hurt because someone improperly secured their animal.

Secure the animal with a properly designed fence or a leash.  Then this is a non-issue.


I agree about leash laws.  Dogs should always be on a leash out in public.  I get nervous when running and ANY dog is off leash.  Even more so when biking.

But I also understand Lisa's reaction to your statement...  and to the one above.

This would IMPLY, that when my neighbors let their Shi Tzus out in the front yard to play (and they wouldn't hurt a FLY)  they bark, but run scared if you even look at them funny.  That I can go in the house, get my .30-06, and blow it away if I personaly judge there is a "possibility" of injury?
2011-01-25 2:28 PM
in reply to: #3314811

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Subject: RE: Pit Bulls and Pit Mixes
FWIW, so far, I've never met a loose dog that did not run away when I yelled and moved TOWARDS it aggressively.   This includes a large, snarling dog that once charged me & Jazz from half a block away.   Same on the bike: charge TOWARD the dog, yelling, and it runs away.  No gun necessary.  And there seem to be a lot of loose dogs in Oklahoma.  (My caveat is: I've only run into single loose dogs, not packs.)


2011-01-25 5:54 PM
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Subject: RE: Pit Bulls and Pit Mixes
CitySky - 2011-01-25 9:28 PM

FWIW, so far, I've never met a loose dog that did not run away when I yelled and moved TOWARDS it aggressively.   This includes a large, snarling dog that once charged me & Jazz from half a block away.   Same on the bike: charge TOWARD the dog, yelling, and it runs away.  No gun necessary.  And there seem to be a lot of loose dogs in Oklahoma.  (My caveat is: I've only run into single loose dogs, not packs.)



Never mind that. Kill them! Kill them all!!
2011-01-25 6:12 PM
in reply to: #3314811

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Subject: RE: Pit Bulls and Pit Mixes
Hey what happened to all the posting of pictures of some awesome dogs? Almost two pages of people who just want to argue about how bad pit bulls are. How about you start your own page and let us who enjoy pits and would like to share pictures of our wonderful dogs. And please dont shoot mine if you walk onto my yard.
2011-01-25 6:53 PM
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Subject: RE: Pit Bulls and Pit Mixes
The issue is who gets to decide when a person feels threatened.  I'm not saying you should go around shooting dogs that are loose, but  if a person feels a loose dog could be a threat they should have the legal right to kill them.  No one outside of the specific situation should be able to decide it was the wrong choice.
2011-01-25 6:54 PM
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Subject: RE: Pit Bulls and Pit Mixes
CitySky - 2011-01-25 2:28 PM FWIW, so far, I've never met a loose dog that did not run away when I yelled and moved TOWARDS it aggressively.  


And I hope that always works for you.
2011-01-25 10:27 PM
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Subject: RE: Pit Bulls and Pit Mixes
jmcconne - 2011-01-25 6:53 PM

The issue is who gets to decide when a person feels threatened.  I'm not saying you should go around shooting dogs that are loose, but  if a person feels a loose dog could be a threat they should have the legal right to kill them.  No one outside of the specific situation should be able to decide it was the wrong choice.


*nm*

Edited by graceful_dave 2011-01-25 10:33 PM


2011-01-25 10:52 PM
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Subject: RE: Pit Bulls and Pit Mixes
jmcconne - 2011-01-26 1:53 AM

The issue is who gets to decide when a person feels threatened.  I'm not saying you should go around shooting dogs that are loose, but  if a person feels a loose dog could be a threat they should have the legal right to kill them.  No one outside of the specific situation should be able to decide it was the wrong choice.



Actually, that's exactly what you started out saying.

Edited by FlyBoy172 2011-01-25 10:52 PM
2011-01-25 11:07 PM
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Subject: RE: Pit Bulls and Pit Mixes
FlyBoy172 - 2011-01-25 10:52 PM

jmcconne - 2011-01-26 1:53 AM

The issue is who gets to decide when a person feels threatened.  I'm not saying you should go around shooting dogs that are loose, but  if a person feels a loose dog could be a threat they should have the legal right to kill them.  No one outside of the specific situation should be able to decide it was the wrong choice.



Actually, that's exactly what you started out saying.


Thanks. I was at a loss for words that would not get me banned.

Time for bed.

Edited by graceful_dave 2011-01-25 11:11 PM




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2011-01-26 8:47 AM
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Subject: RE: Pit Bulls and Pit Mixes
the kids Hoss, Milla, Annie,



(hoss_01.jpg)



(annie_01.jpg)



(milla_01.jpg)



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2011-01-26 10:09 AM
in reply to: #3321822

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Subject: RE: Pit Bulls and Pit Mixes
graceful_dave - 2011-01-25 11:07 PM
FlyBoy172 - 2011-01-25 10:52 PM
jmcconne - 2011-01-26 1:53 AM The issue is who gets to decide when a person feels threatened.  I'm not saying you should go around shooting dogs that are loose, but  if a person feels a loose dog could be a threat they should have the legal right to kill them.  No one outside of the specific situation should be able to decide it was the wrong choice.
Actually, that's exactly what you started out saying.
Thanks. I was at a loss for words that would not get me banned. Time for bed.


x3 I was gonna say the exact same thing.
 
2011-01-26 10:41 AM
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Subject: RE: Pit Bulls and Pit Mixes
I love it when dogs do "The Junk Cooling Pose" :D Very cute pups!


2011-01-26 11:19 AM
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Subject: RE: Pit Bulls and Pit Mixes
jmcconne - 2011-01-25 7:53 PM The issue is who gets to decide when a person feels threatened.  I'm not saying you should go around shooting dogs that are loose, but  if a person feels a loose dog could be a threat they should have the legal right to kill them.  No one outside of the specific situation should be able to decide it was the wrong choice.


When I saw that pickanese run away from it's owner, I felt threatened, so I shot it!  You never know...
2011-01-26 9:46 PM
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Subject: RE: Pit Bulls and Pit Mixes
FlyBoy172 - 2011-01-25 10:52 PM
Actually, that's exactly what you started out saying.


I said it was acceptable. For me that means that I would understand if it happened to one of my dogs.  It would be 100% my fault if one of my dogs was loose.  They are my property and my responsibility.  If you took what I wrote to mean that I would go guns blazing, you misunderstood.

If I feel there is a more than 0 threat to my child from a loose animal that I do not know, then I believe it would be acceptable to kill the animal.  In this scenario it is a freakin dog that has owners who were negligent. Why would I possibly allow this risk if I could stop it?
2011-01-26 9:48 PM
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Subject: RE: Pit Bulls and Pit Mixes
Marvarnett - 2011-01-26 11:19 AM
jmcconne - 2011-01-25 7:53 PM The issue is who gets to decide when a person feels threatened.  I'm not saying you should go around shooting dogs that are loose, but  if a person feels a loose dog could be a threat they should have the legal right to kill them.  No one outside of the specific situation should be able to decide it was the wrong choice.


When I saw that pickanese run away from it's owner, I felt threatened, so I shot it!  You never know...


What specific legal jargon would be required killing an animal? Feeling any kind of threat should be enough, when the animal is loose.
2011-01-26 9:54 PM
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Subject: RE: Pit Bulls and Pit Mixes
jmcconne - 2011-01-26 9:46 PM
FlyBoy172 - 2011-01-25 10:52 PM
Actually, that's exactly what you started out saying.


I said it was acceptable. For me that means that I would understand if it happened to one of my dogs.  It would be 100% my fault if one of my dogs was loose.  They are my property and my responsibility.  If you took what I wrote to mean that I would go guns blazing, you misunderstood.

If I feel there is a more than 0 threat to my child from a loose animal that I do not know, then I believe it would be acceptable to kill the animal.  In this scenario it is a freakin dog that has owners who were negligent. Why would I possibly allow this risk if I could stop it?


a 16 year old black male that looks like a crip or blood gang member is walking towards your child... do you shoot them?

prejudice is the same... prejudging something based on appearance.

the difference here [I trust you said no to my scenario] is that you seem to put little value on a dog's life.


Edited by bullyboy 2011-01-26 9:57 PM
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