General Discussion Triathlon Talk » New bike thoughts....bike Weight vs body weight Rss Feed  
Moderators: k9car363, alicefoeller Reply
 
 
of 2
 
 
2006-04-25 10:49 PM

User image

Champion
19812
50005000500020002000500100100100
MA
Subject: New bike thoughts....bike Weight vs body weight

I picked up my bike from the bike shop yesterday and of course started talking and looking at new bikes. I seem to have a very bad case of bike lust and I just keep thinking about which ones I want.

I ride a Softride because I had back surgery 10 years ago and wasn't even sure I could ride a road bike back 18 months ago. I love to ride and after becoming fitter and get a good bike fit, I have no problems.  The guy who used to design and fit custom bikes for Seven did my last fit and he thinks that the flexible beam of my Softride hurts my hill climbing as the beam moves you can lose power. So I have been thinking about getting a normal road bike.

At the bike shop for fun they weighed my bike 24.25 without the saddle. So we look at the mid-line road bikes...saw a nice full carbon Felt with Durace/ultegra 10 speed F4C that comes only in red and looks awesome...it weighs in around 17.75.  The bike guys says with some changes to stem and handle bars it would weigh 7 pounds less than my bike and that is huge. My thought was so what is the difference between losing 7 pounds and riding a bike that weighs 7 pounds less...any difference? Obviously doing both would be best...but how much difference does riding a lighter bike make if both fit you as well? I have lost around 80 pounds and hope to lose another 20 or so, but the going is slow.

The bike shop offered to order the bike in my size or a couple different bikes, let me bring them home for the weekend to ride it long to make sure that my back would be okay riding it for a couple hours...how cool is that?

 



2006-04-25 11:31 PM
in reply to: #406682

Champion
8903
500020001000500100100100100
Subject: RE: New bike thoughts....bike Weight vs body weight

Losing weight on the bike always seems more dramatic than losing body weight, probably because the latter happens over time and you slowly adjust to it.  Going down 7 lbs of bike weight overnight however will seem like you just dropped 30 lbs off your body!  You'll be able to toss the bike around more easily, it will seem like it climbs effortlessly, and acceleration will be brisk, like you had a mini motor attached!  What you'll definitely notice though will be the dramatic change in frame stiffness and how little it flexes compared to the Soft-Ride.  Take one out for a short ride and see if it's not true!

 

2006-04-25 11:46 PM
in reply to: #406682

User image

Extreme Veteran
707
500100100
pnw
Subject: RE: New bike thoughts....bike Weight vs body weight
Don't let anyone fool you...light bikes rock! Loosing weight is tough buying a light bike is fun and even more fun to ride. Nothing wrong with spending money to work less.

2006-04-26 4:43 AM
in reply to: #406682

User image

Resident Curmudgeon
25290
50005000500050005000100100252525
The Road Back
Gold member
Subject: RE: New bike thoughts....bike Weight vs body weight
Seven pounds is seven pounds, whether it's around your waist or in your frame it's still part of the mass you have to accelerate or haul up the next hill. How-eh-va... a lighter frame will always be lighter, at your current weight or at your goal weight, and seven pounds weight savings on a frame is pretty significant.
2006-04-26 5:34 AM
in reply to: #406682

User image

Expert
702
500100100
Manchester, NH
Subject: RE: New bike thoughts....bike Weight vs body weight

Too bad about the limited color choice though.... Wink

Congrats on the 80 of 100 lb weight loss!!!!!!

 

That's AMAZING!!!

I can relate - Bike Lust.... My 20 yr old Raleigh was a good bike in it's day but.....

I can imagine the difference 7 lbs would make....

2006-04-26 5:48 AM
in reply to: #406682

User image

Master
1932
100050010010010010025
Savannah,
Subject: RE: New bike thoughts....bike Weight vs body weight
I'm with ya, my sistah.  That was my big question....uh, what difference will a carbon seat post make if I am stashing extra weight in my "saddle"?  But I still  got the carbon bike....and I love her.


2006-04-26 6:21 AM
in reply to: #406682

User image

Expert
647
50010025
Sarnia, Ontario
Subject: RE: New bike thoughts....bike Weight vs body weight
Wow, I guess I am not the only one with a 20 yr old Raleigh that has a bad case of bike lust.
2006-04-26 6:54 AM
in reply to: #406682

User image

Expert
1070
10002525
North Carolina
Subject: RE: New bike thoughts....bike Weight vs body weight
7 pounds is 7 pounds. With that said, if you have extra $$$ and want a new bike that weighs 7 pounds less then get it. However, do not let the guy at the LBS lead you to believe it is the Softride's fault!! I have seen a lot of guys on Softrides negotiate the hills with no problem. Of course, they would be faster with a "lighter" bike. In the end the lightest bike with the "best" engine is the best combination. Both can almost always be improved!!
2006-04-26 7:02 AM
in reply to: #406741

User image

Giver
18426
5000500050002000100010010010010025
Subject: RE: New bike thoughts....bike Weight vs body weight

the bear - 2006-04-26 5:43 AM Seven pounds is seven pounds, whether it's around your waist or in your frame it's still part of the mass you have to accelerate or haul up the next hill. How-eh-va... a lighter frame will always be lighter, at your current weight or at your goal weight, and seven pounds weight savings on a frame is pretty significant.

Gonna disagree with Bear here, but just a little. Losing 7 pounds of body weight, especially by dieting will negatively affect power output (but, unless it's from crash dieting where you lose muscle mass), it's very slight. Losing 7 pounds of bike weight has no affect on power output.

But, the loss of power is most likely so slight it's nearly negligible. So for all intents and purposes, Bear's right. Except not really.

2006-04-26 7:11 AM
in reply to: #406682

User image

Cycling Guru
15134
50005000500010025
Fulton, MD
Subject: RE: New bike thoughts....bike Weight vs body weight
I have always been a firm believer that a pound or two off the bike is significantly more important than a pound or two off the body.

Think of the big picture:

- maneuverability of the lighter bike underneath you ("flickability")
- drop in rotational weight of the wheels/tires (acceleration)
- physical aspect as it relates to you loading/unloading and transitioning (much easier to pick up a 17 lb. bike than it is a 25 lb. one)
- psychological aspect - a lighter bike "feels" faster, and perception makes a bit of a difference in abilities (mind over matter)

The bike has constantly moving and adjusting parts on it, and the lighter those parts are (and the better the bearings that are moving) the easier it will be for you to manipulate the tool.

I would go to the Philly Interbike (gone now) trade show every year just looking for the next lightest part that I could buy for my own personal rides. I was a gram hunter and would spend hundreds just to drop a little weight off the bike.

But that's just my opinion ...... and what the heck do I know .....
2006-04-26 8:11 AM
in reply to: #406682

User image

Extreme Veteran
454
1001001001002525
PR
Subject: RE: New bike thoughts....bike Weight vs body weight

Hi,

I would say that if you have the money, go for it...  7 pounds it's a lot on bike weight.  Mine weight 20 pounds with aerobars, saddle and cages...  so if I bought a mid rage road bike, will be like 18 pounds +/-.  For me investing $1,500+ to loose 2 pounds, is not significant, but 7 weight it is.



2006-04-26 8:22 AM
in reply to: #406682

User image

Champion
19812
50005000500020002000500100100100
MA
Subject: RE: New bike thoughts....bike Weight vs body weight

Wow...lots to mull over. Hey I want a new bike....probably going to get one....just trying to decide what type I want to get first.

 

 

2006-04-26 8:24 AM
in reply to: #406776

User image

Resident Curmudgeon
25290
50005000500050005000100100252525
The Road Back
Gold member
Subject: RE: New bike thoughts....bike Weight vs body weight
run4yrlif - 2006-04-26 7:02 AM

the bear - 2006-04-26 5:43 AM Seven pounds is seven pounds, whether it's around your waist or in your frame it's still part of the mass you have to accelerate or haul up the next hill. How-eh-va... a lighter frame will always be lighter, at your current weight or at your goal weight, and seven pounds weight savings on a frame is pretty significant.

Gonna disagree with Bear here, but just a little. Losing 7 pounds of body weight, especially by dieting will negatively affect power output (but, unless it's from crash dieting where you lose muscle mass), it's very slight. Losing 7 pounds of bike weight has no affect on power output.

But, the loss of power is most likely so slight it's nearly negligible. So for all intents and purposes, Bear's right. Except not really.

I'm down 26 since the first of the year. I would defy you to detect a loss of power here, especially relative to the weight (i.e. strength-to-weight ratio)

2006-04-26 8:34 AM
in reply to: #406758

User image

Champion
7542
5000200050025
Albuquerque, New Mexico
Bronze member
Subject: RE: New bike thoughts....bike Weight vs body weight
KRCSWO - 2006-04-26 6:21 AM

Wow, I guess I am not the only one with a 20 yr old Raleigh that has a bad case of bike lust.


Hah! My Raleigh is only 19 years old!

Kathy,

Can't answer your question exactly, but...

how much of the 7 pounds could you pick up by switching to some of the same components on your existing ride? If you could drop 2 pounds of rotating mass (like wheels & tires), you'd notice that much more than dropping 2 pounds from the frame. So...if you could get half the weight savings by upgrading your components, you'd probably get more than half the benefits (especially if you like the ride/layout of the Softride). As for hill-climbing...didn't Softride achieve some fame by one of the Kona winners riding one (10-15 years ago)? Doesn't Kona have at least one monster climb?
2006-04-26 9:19 AM
in reply to: #406682

User image

Expert
878
500100100100252525
Carmel
Subject: RE: New bike thoughts....bike Weight vs body weight
Seven pounds is a lot of weight whether its off you or the bike. This isnt just changing a saddle and wheels to save a few hundred grams. I think you would def. feel a huge difference while riding especially up hills.
2006-04-26 9:23 AM
in reply to: #406840

User image

Giver
18426
5000500050002000100010010010010025
Subject: RE: New bike thoughts....bike Weight vs body weight
the bear - 2006-04-26 9:24 AM
run4yrlif - 2006-04-26 7:02 AM

the bear - 2006-04-26 5:43 AM Seven pounds is seven pounds, whether it's around your waist or in your frame it's still part of the mass you have to accelerate or haul up the next hill. How-eh-va... a lighter frame will always be lighter, at your current weight or at your goal weight, and seven pounds weight savings on a frame is pretty significant.

Gonna disagree with Bear here, but just a little. Losing 7 pounds of body weight, especially by dieting will negatively affect power output (but, unless it's from crash dieting where you lose muscle mass), it's very slight. Losing 7 pounds of bike weight has no affect on power output.

But, the loss of power is most likely so slight it's nearly negligible. So for all intents and purposes, Bear's right. Except not really.

I'm down 26 since the first of the year. I would defy you to detect a loss of power here, especially relative to the weight (i.e. strength-to-weight ratio)

I lost a bunch of weight really fast last year because of my jaw issues, and despite heavy training, I know I lost power. I'm guessing your weight loss wasn't soley from diet (like mine was). I know I lost muscle mass. 



2006-04-26 9:26 AM
in reply to: #406682

User image

Champion
9407
500020002000100100100100
Montague Gold Mines, Nova Scotia
Subject: RE: New bike thoughts....bike Weight vs body weight
I have recently dropped a similar amount of weight off my setup - I had an old steel framed bike (about 28lbs with everything) and have upgraded to a Trek 2000 (19lbs). Although there are many upgrades that the new bike brings (9 speed vs 7, lighter wheels, better bearings, etc) I am sure that much of the new speed I have found (27km/h average in April on the new bike vs 25km/h average in March on the old bike) was due to the 9lbs difference.

Shane
2006-04-26 12:17 PM
in reply to: #406901

User image

Champion
19812
50005000500020002000500100100100
MA
Subject: RE: New bike thoughts....bike Weight vs body weight

gsmacleod - 2006-04-26 10:26 AM I have recently dropped a similar amount of weight off my setup - I had an old steel framed bike (about 28lbs with everything) and have upgraded to a Trek 2000 (19lbs). Although there are many upgrades that the new bike brings (9 speed vs 7, lighter wheels, better bearings, etc) I am sure that much of the new speed I have found (27km/h average in April on the new bike vs 25km/h average in March on the old bike) was due to the 9lbs difference.

Another good example of what buying a new bike might do! Like I need more incentive.

2006-04-26 12:20 PM
in reply to: #406848

User image

Champion
19812
50005000500020002000500100100100
MA
Subject: RE: New bike thoughts....bike Weight vs body weight

<< My Raleigh is only 19 years old! Kathy, Can't answer your question exactly, but... how much of the 7 pounds could you pick up by switching to some of the same components on your existing ride? If you could drop 2 pounds of rotating mass (like wheels & tires), you'd notice that much more than dropping 2 pounds from the frame. So...if you could get half the weight savings by upgrading your components, you'd probably get more than half the benefits (especially if you like the ride/layout of the Softride). As for hill-climbing...didn't Softride achieve some fame by one of the Kona winners riding one (10-15 years ago)? Doesn't Kona have at least one monster climb?>>

I don't really want to put more money in my bike....I have 105 parts and a big weight saving would be wheels but that is like more than 50% cost of the new bike I'm looking at. Softride frames are heavy. The other issue is Softride just went bankrupt 10 days ago...now it will be hard to get parts or warranty issues that may come up from beam technology.

2006-04-26 12:20 PM
in reply to: #406840

Elite
2458
20001001001001002525
Livingston, MT
Subject: RE: New bike thoughts....bike Weight vs body weight
the bear - 2006-04-26 5:24 AM

run4yrlif - 2006-04-26 7:02 AM

the bear - 2006-04-26 5:43 AM Seven pounds is seven pounds, whether it's around your waist or in your frame it's still part of the mass you have to accelerate or haul up the next hill. How-eh-va... a lighter frame will always be lighter, at your current weight or at your goal weight, and seven pounds weight savings on a frame is pretty significant.

Gonna disagree with Bear here, but just a little. Losing 7 pounds of body weight, especially by dieting will negatively affect power output (but, unless it's from crash dieting where you lose muscle mass), it's very slight. Losing 7 pounds of bike weight has no affect on power output.

But, the loss of power is most likely so slight it's nearly negligible. So for all intents and purposes, Bear's right. Except not really.

I'm down 26 since the first of the year. I would defy you to detect a loss of power here, especially relative to the weight (i.e. strength-to-weight ratio)



Likewise, I've lost 40 pounds and I'm much stronger now than I was then. Weight loss on its own doesn't mean a loss in power, how the weight is lost does.

I'd add to Daremo's post that not only does the rotational weight go down, but so does the rolling resistance.

While you can lose bodyweight, your bike can't. So all things being equal, the lighter bike is better and seven pounds is a lot of weight (go lift seven pounds of hamburger at the supermarket).

You guys notice that there are fewer Softrides out there? Is it just me? They look friggin sweet and I'd really like to try one, but nobody around here carries them.
2006-04-26 12:21 PM
in reply to: #406682

User image

Champion
19812
50005000500020002000500100100100
MA
Subject: RE: New bike thoughts....bike Weight vs body weight
My coach Will says 7 pounds is 7 pounds like Bear says...but the other reasons listed here are good reasons to get a new bike. I want to atleast take it out for a long ride and see how it feels to ride.


2006-04-26 12:24 PM
in reply to: #407122

User image

Cycling Guru
15134
50005000500010025
Fulton, MD
Subject: RE: New bike thoughts....bike Weight vs body weight
I've been cycling a long time and I will always disagree with the "a pound is a pound" belief. But that's just me and my experience. :shrugs:
2006-04-26 12:40 PM
in reply to: #406682

User image

Elite
2421
2000100100100100
Subject: RE: New bike thoughts....bike Weight vs body weight
KathyG - 2006-04-25 9:49 PM

I ride a Softride because I had back surgery 10 years ago and wasn't even sure I could ride a road bike back 18 months ago. I love to ride and after becoming fitter and get a good bike fit, I have no problems.  The guy who used to design and fit custom bikes for Seven did my last fit and he thinks that the flexible beam of my Softride hurts my hill climbing as the beam moves you can lose power. So I have been thinking about getting a normal road bike.

A side note based on the above:

While this has no bearing on the lighter frame, which is certainly a help on the hills, one of the big perks of the softride is the fact that the carbon fiber is only in the beam.  If you get up out of the saddle just a little bit the give of the carbon fiber becomes a moot point. 

It is fairly commonly accepted that you lose something in the hills with a Softride.  They will always weigh more than a comprably equipped "regular" bike.  What you lose in the hills you get back in overall ride comfort and slightly improved aerodynamics (for a similarly priced bike).

You basically have to decide which is more important to you.  Good luck.  Oh, and of course many congrats on the impressive weight loss.

bts

2006-04-26 12:55 PM
in reply to: #406682

User image

Champion
6786
50001000500100100252525
Two seat rocket plane
Subject: RE: New bike thoughts....bike Weight vs body weight

 

7 pounds is a lot of weight.  If you do a lot of climbing, you'll definately notice, and appreciate the difference. If you ride mainly on flat ground, not so much.

 

 

2006-04-26 5:03 PM
in reply to: #406682

User image

Extreme Veteran
474
1001001001002525
Sydney
Subject: RE: New bike thoughts....bike Weight vs body weight
Never forget that we're Triathletes and 7lbs off body weight is 7lbs you're not lugging around the run as well...

Additionally (and I'm not sure about the physiology of this) but losing fat can also improve your aerobic capacity. Thinks its either due to the same plasma volume in a smaller space or that you're system doesn't have to pump blood through all that wasted fat.

Have to be honest and say that buying a hot and sexy new carbon toy was my reward to myself (and the motivator behind) dropping 14kgs (31lbs), hopefully the guilt factor will take me through the next 10kgs as well!
New Thread
General Discussion Triathlon Talk » New bike thoughts....bike Weight vs body weight Rss Feed  
 
 
of 2