Need some help

Forum guidelines BT super discount
General Discussion Triathlon Talk » Need some help Rss Feed  
Moderators: k9car363, alicefoeller Reply
2012-05-12 6:34 AM


9

Subject: Need some help

This is going to be a pretty long post, if you'd rather not read the whole thing I'll leave my questions at the bottom, feel free to skip there.  I'm looking to start doing some triathlons with the goal of completing an Ironman within a couple of years, shooting for finishing, not placing or anything.  I'm in pretty decent shape for distance running and have swam on a few teams.  My experience for cycling is pretty much limited to mountain biking and I've never owned a road or tri bike.  I've read quite a bit on the internet about various people's opinions/suggestions about what I should be looking for.  The one common theme is that the fit is more important than anything else.  So my problem is sort of a combination of budget and complete lack of experience.  I'm expecting my first kid in about three weeks so I'd like to keep the cost to around $1500 if I can.  I've searched for used bikes in my area but they're either out of my budget or completely the wrong size.  I realize that some people suggest using a road bike and clipping on aero bars but I've also read that the geometry is a bit different and that an actual tri bike saves the legs a little for when it's time to run.  I'd like to try out a few tri bikes at a LBS but it seems that the shops that carry them in my area have higher end bikes and are quite a bit more than I'm looking to spend.  I've found a number of discounted bikes online which have very good ratings and decent components but I have no way of trying them out prior to buying it.  I've taken my measurements and used a tri bike fit calculator and have a rough idea of the frame size and crank length but that's about it.  I'm leaning more towards a tri bike than a road bike as I don't really plan on doing any bike specific races and will just be using the bike for training.  I figure if I have no experience with either road or tri I may as well learn on the tri bike instead of changing in the future.  I'm also leaning towards a few of the bikes I've seen online (Kestrel, Motobecane) due to their cost and the better components.  I do have to admit my knowledge of the components comes only from what people have said but I do have quite a bit of experience with MTB components and am hesitant to use more entry level parts.  I don't know how one correlates to the other but I've had a number of cheaper parts break while under heavy load or just wear out relatively quick.  So here's a bunch of questions I have:

Can I get a fitting from a LBS without a bike and then use that info and compare it to the geometry specs for a bike online?

Assuming that I bought a bike that has the right frame size how much of the fit is from adjusting the seat, bars, etc.?  In other words, if the frame fits can the bike be fitted around me or can I potentially pick the wrong one from the beginning?  Once I purchase a bike I will certainly get it professionally fitted.

Am I being stupid in my assumption that higher grade components are important enough to stick to an internet deal (i.e. Ultegra/Dura Ace vs. 105)?

Is there a significant advantage to using a tri bike versus a modified road bike as far as keeping my legs a little more rested and time needed to complete the course?  Again, I don't plan on doing any bike specific racing, just training often.

Is the geometry relatively similar between higher end tri bikes and the ones I've found online?  I could see how a few bikes fit at the LBS and make my decision based off of that if possible.

 

I appreciate any help on this matter.  Thanks.

2012-05-12 9:52 AM
in reply to: #4205970

User image

Champion
6931
5000100050010010010010025
Bellingham, Washington
Subject: RE: Need some help

I completed two Ironman races with an Orbea Onix road bike with Syntace aerobars and Ultegra  groupset?     Had the LBS tweak the geometry and later had a Phsical Therapist (she was a former bike mech) tweak it some to the best fit.    Heck I couldn't feel the difference.

I never rode a Tri Bike so I can't tell you the difference.   Keep searching and asking.

2012-05-14 12:51 PM
in reply to: #4205970

User image

Pro
5892
5000500100100100252525
, New Hampshire
Subject: RE: Need some help
Ok, let's try to answer the questions in order...

Yes, you can, and should, have a bike fit BEFORE buying a bike. A bike fit is much, much more than a few simple measurements and then "here's your bike". It entails an interview (discussion about your current fitness level, current/previous injuries/issues, goals (current and future), race/rides, distances, riding experience, athletic experience); the measurements (all your body measurements, lower/upper leg lengths, arm lengths, upper body, flexibility, core strength); and only after all that will you be put on a bike or an adjustable fit bike where the fitter will determine your ideal position based on your input, etc.

This should all result in a printed (and video commonly) document with all your vital information. Many fitters will also recommend different brands/models that may fit you, but not all will.

Most important when you look for a fitter is to get someone that you trust their advise. Buy the fitter, not the technology they have available (i.e. just because they have some kind of fitting certification, doesn't mean that they actually know how to fit you, only that they went through the training and understand the tool). No tool is better then the user.

How adjustable is a frame... well, for a tri bike, you definitely have less adjustability since almost all the gains you get from a tri bike comes from the riders position. This is truly the compromise between aerodynamics, efficiency and comfort. And this is also why that interview part is so extremely important! If you are a newer rider with less riding experience combined with tighter hamstrings common with runners, and you're planning to do a few longer rides, then obviously, you shouldn't end up in the most aggressive position... same goes if you have great flexibility and core strength and only plan to do short time trials... comfort becomes the last item on the list... Basically, find the geometry that fits you the best so you only need very minor adjustments.

For a road bike, you will have a bit more flexibility. Stems can range from 80-140mm, but try to stay within the range of 100-120mm, most frame designers design the bike around that. Also, try to get a frame that you only need one or two spacers under the stem. Seat posts can be very adjustable (compact geometry bikes for example will by nature use longer seat posts). Handlebar width should be roughly the same widths as the distance from the bony protusion on your outside of the back of your shoulder to same point on opposite side. You also have some personal preference here... some prefer slightly wider to open up the lounges, others prefer them slightly narrower to reduce frontal area. Again, there's limits how much you can adjust a frame... you should buy one that is close to perfect for you.

Don't worry too much about components... in general, they get lighter and slightly prettier as you go up the line chain. Shimano 105 is perfectly raceable. Same thing goes for Campy Centaur or SRAM Apex.

Last point of advise... you really need to understand the geometry charts when you look at them... there's no standard way to measure a frame, so it can be measurement center-center, center-top, bottom-top, center-imaginary point, etc. In other words a 55 cm top tube from one manufacturer may be exactly the same as a 57 from another... or 53 from a third... There's also no "name standard" so a 55 from one, might be a medium from a second, a small from a third, a 58 from a fourth, 52 from a 5th, etc. etc. etc.

Arm with a good fit and an understanding of what to look for (and talk to your fitter! you already paid for their advise, so use it!), you can get the perfect bike for $1500.



2012-05-14 6:35 PM
in reply to: #4205970

User image

Extreme Veteran
335
10010010025
Straight outta Central Flurrrrrida
Subject: RE: Need some help
Can I get a fitting from a LBS without a bike and then use that info and compare it to the geometry specs for a bike online?

 

Maybe, you might have to call them up and just have them measure you. Sometimes if you go to a bike retailer and tell them your measurements, they can tell you the proper size. (Nashbar.com is a good example)

 

Assuming that I bought a bike that has the right frame size how much of the fit is from adjusting the seat, bars, etc.?  In other words, if the frame fits can the bike be fitted around me or can I potentially pick the wrong one from the beginning?  Once I purchase a bike I will certainly get it professionally fitted.

 

Usually they fit the bike to you.

Fit:  Seat fore/aft, seat angle, stem angle and length, handlebar positioning, crankset length, shoe cleat angle, seatpost height, and generally anything that a part of your body touches will be measured.

 

Am I being stupid in my assumption that higher grade components are important enough to stick to an internet deal (i.e. Ultegra/Dura Ace vs. 105)?

Sora/Tiagra are similar, 105 is kinda its own thing, ultegra and dura ace are the high end. You can do whatever you want, maybe even mix/match. You can be just fine with racing in 105. The main noticable difference is weight, but you being brand new that shouldn't be much of a concern.

 

Is there a significant advantage to using a tri bike versus a modified road bike as far as keeping my legs a little more rested and time needed to complete the course?  Again, I don't plan on doing any bike specific racing, just training often.

 

Geometries are different, there's tons of articles here and on google explaining the differences. Generally you use less energy/watts due to aero positioning and also use a different muscle group while cycling as opposed to the same group you would use on a road bike when you would get off and run.

I've done bricks on a road bike and if you're only doing a sprint or even an oly tri, I would say stick to getting a road bike.

 

Is the geometry relatively similar between higher end tri bikes and the ones I've found online?  I could see how a few bikes fit at the LBS and make my decision based off of that if possible.

 Yes, relatively. Each bike has different methods of measurement and different geometries.




Get a road bike. You can more readily sell it if you dont like triathlon, or swap over to road cycling, or do group rides, while tri bikes are frowned upon in group rides, but acceptable.

If you're gonna be doing less than 3 tris a year I'd say get a road bike only.

For what it's worth, 1500 is PLENTY for a nice road bike.



Edited by flashpoint145 2012-05-14 6:36 PM
2012-05-15 8:34 PM
in reply to: #4205970


9

Subject: RE: Need some help

I appreciate all of the information everyone.  I'm going to a shop on Thursday to check out some road bikes and get fitted.  It'll be at least a year before I'm ready to do some serious distance and from what it sounds like a road bike will be fine for sprint and olympic distance races.  It seems a road bike will be easier to train with and quite a bit more versatile.  I'll worry about upgrading or a tri bike down the road after some shorter races and a lot more experience. 

I do have one other question I haven't been able to find much information about regarding indoor trainers.  With a newborn arriving soon I have a feeling that I'll need to stick around the house for a while and won't have a great deal of opportunity to get out to go riding.  To my understanding the main differences between a fluid trainer and a magnetic trainer is the cost and the wear on the tire.  What I can't seem to find out is how significant the difference in wear.  Is there a big difference?  About how many miles or hours do you think it might take on a trainer to justify the increase in cost to offset the price of replacing tires?  Thanks again.

2012-05-17 8:05 PM
in reply to: #4205970


9

Subject: RE: Need some help

Based on all of the advice I picked up a road bike today.  Got a good deal at Cycle Fit, very pleased with the price.  Carbon frame, 105 components, seems to fit really well.  They changed out the stem and gave me a decent discount on new pedals and shoes.  It moves a lot faster than I'm used to.  The guy at the shop did the fit with the seat in the middle and didn't drop the handle bars too much.  He told me as I get some more experience it'll give me the option of adjusting the bike to get more aggressive down the road.  I'll be looking forward to taking it out for a while after work tomorrow.  Thanks again for all the help.





(New Bike.jpg)



Attachments
----------------
New Bike.jpg (65KB - 17 downloads)

New Thread
General Discussion Triathlon Talk » Need some help Rss Feed