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2012-05-21 12:08 PM

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Subject: Faster Without Wetsuit

Is it possible or even likely for a swimmer to be faster without a wetsuit?

I have always worn when when allowed under the assumption it is always faster.  Problem is that is does not feel good to me.  The one I have (Profile) fits but I still can't get a deep breath.  I feel like a cork and my balance is off.  I also get HOT.  I don't need one for floatation or confidence.  I like OWS and do it often.  

So, can a wetsuit make a swimmer slower?

Steve



2012-05-21 12:35 PM
in reply to: #4220696

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Subject: RE: Faster Without Wetsuit

While I'm not super experience in the water, my general opinion would be that if it makes you feel awkward or uncomfortable in anyway that it will have a negative affect on you. It sounds like you are comfortable with OWS and have swam in a wetsuit multiple times, so I would suggest just giving it a try.

What kind of wetsuit do you have? If you have full sleeve or full leg, you could go to sleeveless or short legged.

2012-05-21 1:05 PM
in reply to: #4220696

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Master
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Subject: RE: Faster Without Wetsuit

Great question.  I have a full suit and I always feel like my arms get more tired, almost as though it's harder from them to pull through with the suit on.

Yet so far my best times have been with the suit on so go figure.

2012-05-21 2:36 PM
in reply to: #4220696

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Subject: RE: Faster Without Wetsuit

I feel faster with the wetsuit but I am a total newbie.  The buoyancy helps keep my legs/hips from sinking so I feel like I am using all my energy for propulsion.

I suppose if you really are slower with the wetsuit you should pitch it, or find one that is more suitable.

2012-05-21 2:41 PM
in reply to: #4220696

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Subject: RE: Faster Without Wetsuit
If you are slower and/or uncomfortable in a wetsuit, it doesn't fit right.

The constriction may be a valid issue but you will be faster in a wetsuit.

(edit) If you don't like wearing one, don't wear one. There are very few races where it's mandatory. Don't kid yourself about being faster without one, though.



Edited by DanielG 2012-05-21 2:41 PM
2012-05-21 2:47 PM
in reply to: #4221101

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Olney
Subject: RE: Faster Without Wetsuit

The first wetsuit I had was a Long John back in 1995 and I don't remember having the same feeling.

Sunday was my last wetsuit legal race of the year so I have some time to figure it out.  Maybe when I swim next weekend in the river I'll set up a time trial with and without to see how it works out.



2012-05-21 2:49 PM
in reply to: #4220696

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Subject: RE: Faster Without Wetsuit
if you don't like it, don't wear it. There's no rule that says you have to. "swimmers" typically don't wear wetsuits in OW, even when it's cold. Last friday our tri club did an OW swim and the river was about 62 degrees. All of the people who do stand alone OW swim events arrived "naked", and all the triathletes arrived with wetsuits on. ( Guess which group coincidentally swim faster and/or longer than the other?)
2012-05-21 2:51 PM
in reply to: #4221110

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Olney
Subject: RE: Faster Without Wetsuit

You are most likely correct on fit.  I can't seem to find anything in tri clothing that fits quite right.  I'm built thicker then most people my height and weight.

 

 

DanielG - 2012-05-21 3:41 PM If you are slower and/or uncomfortable in a wetsuit, it doesn't fit right. The constriction may be a valid issue but you will be faster in a wetsuit. (edit) If you don't like wearing one, don't wear one. There are very few races where it's mandatory. Don't kid yourself about being faster without one, though.

2012-05-21 2:55 PM
in reply to: #4221129

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Olney
Subject: RE: Faster Without Wetsuit

I know I place higher in non WS races.  I always prefer those......

 

AdventureBear - 2012-05-21 3:49 PM if you don't like it, don't wear it. There's no rule that says you have to. "swimmers" typically don't wear wetsuits in OW, even when it's cold. Last friday our tri club did an OW swim and the river was about 62 degrees. All of the people who do stand alone OW swim events arrived "naked", and all the triathletes arrived with wetsuits on. ( Guess which group coincidentally swim faster and/or longer than the other?)

2012-05-21 2:58 PM
in reply to: #4221129

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Subject: RE: Faster Without Wetsuit

AdventureBear - 2012-05-21 3:49 PM "swimmers" typically don't wear wetsuits in OW, even when it's cold. Last friday our tri club did an OW swim and the river was about 62 degrees. All of the people who do stand alone OW swim events arrived "naked", and all the triathletes arrived with wetsuits on. ( Guess which group coincidentally swim faster and/or longer than the other?)

So why is that? IF the race is WS legal, and IF one swims faster when wearing a proper fitting one, why not? If the swimmers were faster as a group, wouldn't they be that much faster with wetsuits?

2012-05-21 3:04 PM
in reply to: #4221129

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Subject: RE: Faster Without Wetsuit

AdventureBear - 2012-05-21 3:49 PM All of the people who do stand alone OW swim events arrived "naked", and all the triathletes arrived with wetsuits on. ( Guess which group coincidentally swim faster and/or longer than the other?)

I did a practice OWS this past weekend.  I was one of the few people "naked."  I felt so legit and swimmer-ish, I almost busted out some lat slaps or counter-rotating arms spins.  Then, unfortunately, I started swimming.

 



2012-05-21 3:33 PM
in reply to: #4220696

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Subject: RE: Faster Without Wetsuit

I am just as fast without. I'm not a perfect swimmer. I think my full suit fits well. I do not feel my arms get fatigued more with it. It's a good suit.... but I have swam without and I cover my long distances in the same time.

I do feel my suit restricts my breathing. I don't feel like I can breath enough. I "think" it helps a little with boyancy, and without I think I can breathe more/go harder. So it is a wash. So with that, I always opt to wear the suit... does not save me time, but it saves me energy. If my time is the same, then why waste energy?

My races are in cold mostly so I don't get hot. If I got hot, then that would be different. I did my OW practice one day at the resivoir late summer, I peeled out of it after the first lap. I thought I was going to boil alive. No way I would race like that.

2012-05-21 3:38 PM
in reply to: #4221291

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Subject: RE: Faster Without Wetsuit
powerman - 2012-05-21 4:33 PM

So with that, I always opt to wear the suit... does not save me time, but it saves me energy. If my time is the same, then why waste energy?

Help me understand this.  It seems that if you are properly pacing your swim, your energy expenditure would be the same with or without the wetsuit, but your time would be faster with. 

 

2012-05-21 3:41 PM
in reply to: #4220696


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Subject: RE: Faster Without Wetsuit

The better swimmer you are the less benefit you will get.  I suppose if your a faster swimmer (in the 1:20 and below range), its possible your faster without if the fit is off a bit.  But either way, its probably a fit issue.

 

 

 

 

2012-05-21 3:49 PM
in reply to: #4221164

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Subject: RE: Faster Without Wetsuit
mrbbrad - 2012-05-21 3:58 PM

AdventureBear - 2012-05-21 3:49 PM "swimmers" typically don't wear wetsuits in OW, even when it's cold. Last friday our tri club did an OW swim and the river was about 62 degrees. All of the people who do stand alone OW swim events arrived "naked", and all the triathletes arrived with wetsuits on. ( Guess which group coincidentally swim faster and/or longer than the other?)

So why is that? IF the race is WS legal, and IF one swims faster when wearing a proper fitting one, why not? If the swimmers were faster as a group, wouldn't they be that much faster with wetsuits?



Because OWS races are not triathlons.

Swimmers cannot wear wetsuits and be in the race for podium overall. If they wear a wetsuit they are in the wetsuit category. Along with that is the social thinking that a wetsuit is not actually racing.

Think about it also, what condition do swimmers have to be in at the end of the swim race? None, they can drag their happy butts up the beach and pass out as soon as the swim is done.

When you're done with the swim, what are you going to then do? Oh yeah, go ride the bike for eternity then go run for eternity. No kidding we're not going to go all out on the swim, that's a given.

Cyclists tend to be faster on the bike than triathletes.
Swimmers tend to be faster in the water than triathletes.
Runners tend to run faster than triathletes.

There are different rules for our version of cycling and our version of swimming as well than there are in the competitions of single sport of the same type. That makes the way you train a bit different too.

Oh, here's something that you can do for anyone who wants to "prove" the top swimmers are just as fast without a wetsuit. Find a picture of a start of any triathlon with Andy Potts or Julie Dibbens where it's wetsuit legal and they're not wearing one. I would be rather surprised if one existed unless they were just screwing around on the race.

2012-05-21 4:26 PM
in reply to: #4221356

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Subject: RE: Faster Without Wetsuit

DanielG - 2012-05-21 3:49 PM

When you're done with the swim, what are you going to then do? Oh yeah, fight to get the wetsuit off, go ride the bike for eternity then go run for eternity.  

Fixed it for me.  Good post, though.



Edited by Hook'em 2012-05-21 4:27 PM


2012-05-21 6:53 PM
in reply to: #4220696

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Subject: RE: Faster Without Wetsuit

When Olympian Sheila Toarmina first began doing triathlons coming off an Olympic Gold in swimming from Atlanta, 1996 she was initially slightly slower in a full wetsuit than no wetsuit.

Taormina's stroke is fine tuned from years and years of training and its likely the suit threw off her proprioception or sense of body position in the water and she mentioned she felt restricted by the suit.

To put this in perspective we're talking about a woman I saw do a 2 mile open water ocean swim... butterfly.

So this is an athlete with superb stroke.

People like you and I, not so much. I look like a weed whacker dropped in a toilet when I swim, and the extra floatation of a wetsuit speeds me up if I slow my stroke frequency down a little. Not only am I faster, I also have to do a little less work- or at least seem to travel farther pet stroke.

2012-05-21 7:26 PM
in reply to: #4221164

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Subject: RE: Faster Without Wetsuit
mrbbrad - 2012-05-21 1:58 PM

AdventureBear - 2012-05-21 3:49 PM "swimmers" typically don't wear wetsuits in OW, even when it's cold. Last friday our tri club did an OW swim and the river was about 62 degrees. All of the people who do stand alone OW swim events arrived "naked", and all the triathletes arrived with wetsuits on. ( Guess which group coincidentally swim faster and/or longer than the other?)

So why is that? IF the race is WS legal, and IF one swims faster when wearing a proper fitting one, why not? If the swimmers were faster as a group, wouldn't they be that much faster with wetsuits?



Many OWSwimmers are purists. Many races have wetsuit aNd naked divisions. For the national championship cable swims from USMS, wetsuits aRe not allowed in order to compete.

That the non wetsuit group was faster was just a little joke. They were faster because they like swimming more, and do more of it, than the others who "depended" on the wetsuit for warmth. They were just better swimmers overall.

Many people simply dont like the feel,of a wetsuit whether it fits or not.

Edited by AdventureBear 2012-05-21 7:27 PM
2012-05-21 8:06 PM
in reply to: #4220696

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Subject: RE: Faster Without Wetsuit
I have to admit that my swim times are the same whether I wear a wetsuit or not (e.g., 14-15 mins for 750/800 m, 29 mins for 1.5k) so a wetsuit making me faster is not an issue for me.  For me, it's purely comfort - because I'm an utter wimp when it comes to the cold, if the race is wetsuit-legal, then I always wear my full-sleeved wetsuit to keep warm.  However, my wetsuit fits incredibly well, and I hardly know I have it on, apart from that strange feeling of cold water strickling into it when I first get in the water.  I did a huge amount of research and reading reviews before I bought my wetsuit to try and get the right fit (I have very large shoulders for a woman), but I've been incredibly happy with it.  Not being able to take a deep breath sounds like a fit issue, or maybe even a slight panic issue (I know some people who have this problem with wetsuits, even after a fair amount of OWSing)?
2012-05-21 9:27 PM
in reply to: #4221308

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Subject: RE: Faster Without Wetsuit
Goosedog - 2012-05-21 2:38 PM
powerman - 2012-05-21 4:33 PM

So with that, I always opt to wear the suit... does not save me time, but it saves me energy. If my time is the same, then why waste energy?

Help me understand this.  It seems that if you are properly pacing your swim, your energy expenditure would be the same with or without the wetsuit, but your time would be faster with. 

 

Please understand I'm no expert and this is just what I think, not what is proven....

I just think I can swim harder w/o because I can breath more... but that the wetsuit does keep more of me out of the water and probably cuts down on drag more.... so when I have swam w/o the suit I feel free and go faster... but with the added drag of my hips lower I don't get a faster time. So in a race w/ the suit I go as fast I can maintain... which is about the same... So to me, I'm working harder, but it does not achieve a faster time, so why go harder and waste more energy?

That's just how I see it... it could all be nonsense.

2012-05-21 10:47 PM
in reply to: #4220696

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Subject: RE: Faster Without Wetsuit

If you really think you might be faster, it might be worth actually timing yourself either in the pool or OWS.

 

I actually did this last week, when I got to a regular OWS area, and had enough time to try the out and back both with and without a wetsuit, as I felt that my wetsuit was similarly making my breathing harder and altering my body roll.

 

Turns out I'm still faster with the wetsuit, by a decent amount, even with the variability in sighting. I was surprised, given I thought I 'felt' faster without.



2012-05-22 12:06 AM
in reply to: #4220696

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Subject: RE: Faster Without Wetsuit

If it does make you faster in the swim, but doesn't also add to your T1 time also? Always seemed like a wash to me.

2012-05-22 2:32 AM
in reply to: #4222045

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Subject: RE: Faster Without Wetsuit
ionlylooklazy - 2012-05-22 1:06 AM

If it does make you faster in the swim, but doesn't also add to your T1 time also? Always seemed like a wash to me.



To generalize, you'll have to time yourself to get your specific numbers:

A wetsuit gets you swimming about :10/100 faster
It takes 10 to 15 seconds extra in T1 to get out of the wetsuit
If the swim portion is 200 yards/meters or longer, you will spend less time in the swim if you wear a wetsuit than if you did not.

If you spend more than about :20 getting out of the wetsuit, you need practice

In all honesty I don't give a hoot if anyone wears a wetsuit or does not. Sleeveless, full sleeved, whatever. Don't care. Some seem to want to make a wetsuit slower by force of will rather than any real data that's ever existed, though. If you don't want to wear a wetsuit, don't wear one. Don't try to justify it with incorrect assumptions, though, at least be honest with yourself as to why you don't want to wear it.


2012-05-22 6:56 AM
in reply to: #4220696

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Subject: RE: Faster Without Wetsuit
svennn - 2012-05-21 2:08 PM

The one I have (Profile) fits but I still can't get a deep breath.


To me this sounds like it doesn't fit.

Beyond that, are you working the sleeves and legs up enough? I'm a bit on the tall side (6'2") and when I put on my wetsuit, I need to ensure that the sleeves end well above my wrists (about 1/3 of the way up my forearm) and the legs end just short of half way up my lower leg.

As to getting hot, did you flood the suit while you were swimming - simple and quick way to regulate temperature while swimming to stay comfortable.

Assuming the wetsuit fits and you've spent some time swimming in it, you should be faster than without. The best triathlon swimmers in the world will pretty much always wear a wetsuit in a wetsuit legal swim because they are faster.

That said, if you don't like or don't want to wear a wetsuit, then that is your choice and as long as you are happy with your decision, it doesn't matter what anyone else thinks or does.

Shane
2012-05-22 8:15 AM
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Subject: RE: Faster Without Wetsuit

gsmacleod - 2012-05-22 6:56 AM
svennn - 2012-05-21 2:08 PM The one I have (Profile) fits but I still can't get a deep breath.
To me this sounds like it doesn't fit. Beyond that, are you working the sleeves and legs up enough? I'm a bit on the tall side (6'2") and when I put on my wetsuit, I need to ensure that the sleeves end well above my wrists (about 1/3 of the way up my forearm) and the legs end just short of half way up my lower leg.

I'm slightly taller and seem slender by fit standards and have to do that as well. The sleeves end about half-way down my forearms, and that may not be pulled up quite enough. My extension is still affected some. I'm still getting figuring things out with it as I started open water with a sleeveless. Legs are well up onto the calves. Not close to the ankles.

svenn did say he seems more solid than others at his height, so may not need to bring up the sleeves or legs as far. But the point is that you need to get the fit right around the main sections of the body. Shoulders especially. The sleeves and legs end where they do. This is not a dress shirt where they should be at the wrist. It is ALL about the function. If they're too long, you may be able to trim some of the end off, but make sure to check on being able to do that first.

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