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2012-07-19 4:02 PM

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Subject: Trail vs. Road

My new dog's unending supply of energy is making me into a runner. We're doing it right and building slow. I'm actually starting to enjoy it and my PF isn't acting up. 

We'll be spending a few days in Babcock State Park in WV next week, and I would like to continue our morning runs. They tell me the park has more than 200 miles of trails, but I have no idea what the quality will be like. I've done a lot of hiking over the years but little (ok, zero) trail running, so I was hoping I could get a few tips from the veterans here. 

Thanks in advance.



2012-07-19 4:17 PM
in reply to: #4320743

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Subject: RE: Trail vs. Road

Go easy, and be ready to "pull your punches" so to speak with your stride. A lot of minimalist runners will talk about proprioreception -- being able to feel the ground and what it's doing to your feet. What it really means is being able to feel terrain and sense what's going to happen before it causes damage, by unweighting the foot and going on to the next stride.

But I'd suggest leaving the Garmin behind and just go by time -- if your regular runs are 40 minutes, go for a 40 minute trail run, regardless of the actual distance.

2012-07-19 4:24 PM
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Subject: RE: Trail vs. Road
Agreed w/ above. Go by time and not distance.
2012-07-19 5:47 PM
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Subject: RE: Trail vs. Road

THE SHORT LIST, which borrows from the hiking basics: Watch for roots and rocks that will trip you or jam your knees and twist ankles. Your agility will be tested when avoiding these, which is part of the fun. Expect to add 3-7 or more minutes per mile to your average road running pace depending on terrain and elevation gain. Bring a trail map, whistle, a phone, water, some athletic tape (fixes everything from people to shoes), put it all in a fanny pack. Be aware of the weather. Tell someone where you plan to go and when you will be back and also write it down on paper. DON'T leave an itinerary note on your vehicle, it will be like telling thieves when the best time to rob you will be. A 'be back by' time and a 'call the police' time can be two different times, so make sure that trustworthy person knows them. Bring a camera if you plan on stopping (or walking) at vista points. Smile and say 'hi' to everyone you see. Be out of the woods way before dark, unless you are going night running which I don't recommend for trail virgins but do recommend you try some time. If you are going with the dog, bring his leash to use at your discretion and be prepared to dispose of his 'business' properly. 

OH YEAH...have a great time. Trail running is my most favoritest thing in the world. You may give up the road after this. If any of these tips need to be made more clear, let me know.

Edit for grammar. 



Edited by skibummer 2012-07-19 6:07 PM
2012-07-19 7:42 PM
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Subject: RE: Trail vs. Road
X 2 on the above.
But more specifically for Babcock. I was at pipe stem state park last year. The state park trails are good for running. Not great for mtn bike. Lots of hills and elevation changes. But it sure is fun. Ive done a few trail races too and they are a blast. I'm doing xterra Saturday. But Indiana trails are a little milder than mountains.
2012-07-20 7:49 AM
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Subject: RE: Trail vs. Road
Pretty much what has already been mentioned, when running trails you will want to focus your attention of the trail roughly 6 to 8 feet in front of you but down the trail as well, keep you head up eyes down,  after a while your feet will just naturally hit the open spots between the roots and rocks without  you having to think about it, you should also start strengthing your ankles with various exercises, because if you run trails long enough sooner or later you are going to roll an ankle or hook a root it's inevetible and the stronger the ankle the faster the recovery. running trails will generally be slower but not always on a good  relitively flat single track once into a good rythym I am actually faster then on the road mile per mile. when going downhill run with a slightly forward lean or perpendicular  to the slope of the hill and your hands out wide for balance shorten your stride if necessary, don't lean back into the hill  to much this will eat your quads very quickly and in many cases you will be on your butt sliding down the hill in no time, overall I find that running trails necessetates a higher level of fitness then road running because of the terrain variencies and the extra balance required to do it right. Running trails is the best running I have ever done when I started on trails I didn't go back on the road for almost 4 years and found myself traveling hundreds of miles to try out different trails and terrain types, the scenery is generally much better as well , now I am about 50/ 50 trail road mix. definately try out a trail race, they tend to be much more layed back and easy going and usually a crap load of fun.

Edited by RRH_88 2012-07-20 8:02 AM


2012-07-20 8:09 AM
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Subject: RE: Trail vs. Road

There was a good article in Runners World I believe that spoke to Trail Running and how it should be included as part of your regular training.  Besides the obvious that it the fun factor is night and day to road running the main point that trail running is good for strength and speed.  The reason is that running trails will have built in intervals with hill climbs, technical sections and on some trails going downhill is just as taxing as going up.  All of this needs to be done while remaining "light on your feet" which requires much greater effort than road running.  I have found that my feet/ankles gain a lot of strength from trail running which pays off on the road as well.

Don't over think it, just go run a trail and wait for that big grin that is sure to follow, you will be hooked.  It's like being a kid again.

2012-07-21 10:43 AM
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Subject: RE: Trail vs. Road
Thanks for all the great advice. this is just what I was looking for. Now here's hoping the trails are still passable after all this rain.
2012-07-21 12:26 PM
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Subject: RE: Trail vs. Road

my addition to this is..

be very aware of TREES and anything you can get beaned on.

Especially if you wear a hat. If you are running in an area where there are a lot of trees, I suggest rotating your hat brim to the back until you are out of that spot.

you tend to be really focused on the trail and for good reason, but that can be a problem if you don't see the overhanging tree branch ! doh!

2012-07-29 3:07 PM
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Subject: RE: Trail vs. Road

None of you thought to warn me about the spiderwebs. Shameful.

This advice was very helpful and you were right. The dog and I are hooked.

2012-07-29 5:16 PM
in reply to: #4336214

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Subject: RE: Trail vs. Road
yeah, spiderwebs no fun. we have these little worms that spin webs across the trails in the spring..glad they aren't spiders but can't stand when they cover your face with webs and worms.


2012-07-29 5:21 PM
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Subject: RE: Trail vs. Road
I exclusively switched to trail running after the pavement wasn't so kind on my knees.  I found that after a trail run my muscles were more sore than on pavement, but that my joints, bones, and ligaments were fresh.  The opposite was true for pavement, my knees and ankles hurt, but the muscles were ok.  After running for only a couple weeks I  noticed a massive difference in the strength in my legs and how toned there were in fact.  Not sure if you got trail shoes, but I'd definitely invest in some.  I have an acquaintance that does the 100 milers and he exclusive runs trails now.  In fact now that I think about it, trail running is kind of taking off and we have some Xterra Races out here that are gathering a lot of momentum.
2013-02-04 12:18 PM
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Subject: RE: Trail vs. Road

Figured I should revive this thread rather than start a new one.

The dog and I are now running seven days a week, six of those on roads. If I stick to my plan, this will be our first ever 20 mile week. On Sundays, we get to run the trails behind one of the local high schools. We've been doing 4 short (~2-2.5), 2 medium (~3.2), and one trail run each week. As we build miles, I would like to move toward a more structured 4:2:1, with the trail run being a medium or the long, depending on which high school we are behind. Should I just count the trail runs by miles, or should I be estimating an equivalent mileage based on time (i.e., yesterday's 3.3 mi/43 min would count as 4 miles for the plan based on my usual road pace)? Or should I toss out mileage altogether and just plan all my runs by time?

Since we do the trail runs on Sundays and I have all of my weekly miles to give, I haven't been  worrying about it too much, but I'm trying to be more thoughtful about run training.

"Just run, dummy!" is also an acceptable answer. I've been known to overthink.

2013-02-04 12:37 PM
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Subject: RE: Trail vs. Road

At the moment i do all my runs by time, and my pace is set based on heart rate.  Makes it easy, just split the goal time in half, run that long, then turn around and head back.  No thinking involved, which is good for me.  Some times I go further, sometimes not so much.  But 30 minutes is 30 minutes regardless.  It also makes it easier to plan around other things during the day because I know exactly how long my run will be.  

Most of my running is trail running, btw.  I just use regular running shoes, but you definitely need at least 2 pairs since trail runs = mud!  

Another advantage of time based is when you are running in the trees and lose GPS reception, it doesn't matter since the clock just keeps on ticking away. Smile

2013-02-05 7:42 AM
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Subject: RE: Trail vs. Road
metafizx - 2012-07-21 12:26 PM

my addition to this is..

be very aware of TREES and anything you can get beaned on.

Especially if you wear a hat. If you are running in an area where there are a lot of trees, I suggest rotating your hat brim to the back until you are out of that spot.

you tend to be really focused on the trail and for good reason, but that can be a problem if you don't see the overhanging tree branch ! doh!

 

x2 on this.  I almost bit it on a low hanging big limb on a night trail run because I was focusing on the trail 3 feet in front of me.

 

What has already been said about leaving your road running time expectations at the door.  If you keep your expectations you will be very disappointed.  Just have fun.

2013-02-05 7:46 AM
in reply to: #4320743

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Subject: RE: Trail vs. Road
mrheathen - 2012-07-19 5:02 PM

My new dog's unending supply of energy is making me into a runner. We're doing it right and building slow. I'm actually starting to enjoy it and my PF isn't acting up. 

We'll be spending a few days in Babcock State Park in WV next week, and I would like to continue our morning runs. They tell me the park has more than 200 miles of trails, but I have no idea what the quality will be like. I've done a lot of hiking over the years but little (ok, zero) trail running, so I was hoping I could get a few tips from the veterans here. 

Thanks in advance.

Speaking from my own experience, expect incredibly sore ankles when you're done.  When I was new to trail running my ankles would hurt for days after. Perhaps the trails I ran were more technical than most, they were narrow, single track trails, but just keep that in mind. I higher top type of shoe wouldn't be the worst idea in the world. But I'd suggest some ice/ibuprofen when you get done to try and eliminate some of the swelling.  

It can be a fun change of pace though, especially with the dog if its well behaved and you can turn him/her loose.  Kind of like mountain biking when you're used to road biking.  Plus the constant attention to the terrain tends to take your focus off of how much time you have left.



2013-02-05 7:51 AM
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Subject: RE: Trail vs. Road
norcal_SAHD - 2013-02-04 1:37 PM

At the moment i do all my runs by time, and my pace is set based on heart rate.  Makes it easy, just split the goal time in half, run that long, then turn around and head back.  No thinking involved, which is good for me.  Some times I go further, sometimes not so much.  But 30 minutes is 30 minutes regardless.  It also makes it easier to plan around other things during the day because I know exactly how long my run will be.  

Most of my running is trail running, btw.  I just use regular running shoes, but you definitely need at least 2 pairs since trail runs = mud!  

Another advantage of time based is when you are running in the trees and lose GPS reception, it doesn't matter since the clock just keeps on ticking away. Smile

and if you do this and happen to use auto pause make sure to turn it off. It's incredibly annoying to have that thing constantly reminding you you are running so slowly that it thinks you've stopped!  

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