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50k vs 50 mile
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 2012-08-29 8:41 PM |
Veteran  468   STATESBORO, GA |  Subject: 50k vs 50 mileAdvice on a question. I have done 2 IM races CDA and 2012 St george. I ran the goofy Challenge last year as well as 9 or so half IM (3 in 2 months) a few years back. I am going to do the Destin 50 (has 2 races in 1 a 50k and 50 mile) this Feb as well as the Goofy in Jan. My question is should i do the 50k for my first ultra or jump to the 50 mile. I want the 50 mile just because I know me and i work best when I am scared of something. I would plan on run 5, walk some if I did the 50 mile. Time is not my goal - finishing is. Any thoughts are appreciated. Ps the Destin 50 is on the beach at Destin, FL so is flat but on some sand. |
| 2012-08-29 11:21 PM in reply to: #4387295 |
Veteran 416 | Subject: RE: 50k vs 50 mile The "general" saying is that an Ironman is more or less similar to a 50 miler so you have that part covered, the difference of course that it's all running (maybe some walking). If you're looking at training plans there can be a decent difference in weekly mileage between a 50k and 50 mile. Also, you may find after the 50k mark that you have some nutrition/body issues you've never experienced before, but that's part of the experience I guess. (Personally, the balls of my feet blister. Ouchy! I'm still working on a solution.) I'm all about shooting for the stars. Do keep in mind that a lot of people will be doing a fair amount of walking depending on the terrain, something that may not have figured into the Ironman plans. Also, depending on the race there may be some challenging terrain (I count sand as challenging!) so go easy on yourself and don't even attempt to compare it to your "road" pace. I would do whichever race got me the most excited about training Edited by InnerAthlete 2012-08-29 11:22 PM |
.| 2012-08-30 3:32 AM in reply to: #4387295 |
Extreme Veteran 877 Pa | Subject: RE: 50k vs 50 mile I agree with doing whichever race gets your more excited and excited to train. I went straight to the 50m and didn't do a 50k; however, I did do around 50k once in training for the 50m - just wasn't an official one. I also consider sand a challenge - I've never run a race on sand but the little sand running I did I found to be difficult. I would expect to walk more than I would normally. I say go for it!!! |
| 2012-08-30 6:37 AM in reply to: #4387295 |
Expert 1145 Ann Arbor, MI | Subject: RE: 50k vs 50 mile Is the goofy challenge where you run a half-marathon one day and a marathon the next? If so, then I'd skip the 50k and go for the 50 miler. Not sure you're going to feel that a race that is 5 miles longer than a marathon is much harder than doing the goofy. I think a 50 miler is a bit harder than a HIM but not nearly as hard as an IM. |
| 2012-08-30 7:51 AM in reply to: #4387295 |
| 7 | Subject: RE: 50k vs 50 mile If your goal is to finish, then I would certainly go with the 50 miler. I am going for my first 50 miler in September at the VT 50, but have also completed a 50K (January 2012, official race) twice. The 50K that I just ran two weekends ago was all trail running and literally immediately after doing a sprint tri with my cousin. If you can do an Ironman, you obviously have both the physical capacity to do work, and the mental capacity to do work. If you were trying to set some land speed record in your situation, I would probably opt to tell you to try it out on the 50K first. But you are simply going to give it everything you've got and finish. You're an Ironman, you've already shown the capacity to do just such a thing. |
| 2012-08-30 7:57 AM in reply to: #4387295 |
Elite 3656 West Allis, Wisconsin | Subject: RE: 50k vs 50 mile |
| 2012-08-30 10:04 AM in reply to: #4387689 |
Veteran 468 STATESBORO, GA | Subject: RE: 50k vs 50 mile djdavey - 2012-08-30 7:57 AM 50 miler. man up dambit!
^^^That one sealed the deal. Thanks for the responses!!! |
| 2012-08-30 2:20 PM in reply to: #4387589 |
Champion 5312 Calgary | Subject: RE: 50k vs 50 mile yeats - 2012-08-30 5:37 AM Is the goofy challenge where you run a half-marathon one day and a marathon the next? If so, then I'd skip the 50k and go for the 50 miler. Not sure you're going to feel that a race that is 5 miles longer than a marathon is much harder than doing the goofy. I think a 50 miler is a bit harder than a HIM but not nearly as hard as an IM. Did you mean a 50k was no where near as hard as an IM, in that case I agree. A 50 miler though, assuming you like riding and swimming an IM is much easier than a 50 miler, although you may find they take similar time to complete depending on the elevations. I say if it is a choice, go with the 50 miler. There is nothing on the 50k that you haven't done before. |
| 2012-08-30 2:24 PM in reply to: #4387589 |
Expert 1279 Northern VA | Subject: RE: 50k vs 50 mile yeats - 2012-08-30 7:37 AM Is the goofy challenge where you run a half-marathon one day and a marathon the next? If so, then I'd skip the 50k and go for the 50 miler. Not sure you're going to feel that a race that is 5 miles longer than a marathon is much harder than doing the goofy. I think a 50 miler is a bit harder than a HIM but not nearly as hard as an IM. To each his/her own, but for me the 50 miler was much harder on my body than an IM and not even comparable to a HIM ... or is that the HIM is not comparable to a 50 miler??? oh well Oh, and to answer your question, I vote go for the 50 miler
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| 2012-08-30 2:41 PM in reply to: #4388568 |
Member 67 Maryland | Subject: RE: 50k vs 50 mile BigDH - 2012-08-30 3:20 PM yeats - 2012-08-30 5:37 AM Is the goofy challenge where you run a half-marathon one day and a marathon the next? If so, then I'd skip the 50k and go for the 50 miler. Not sure you're going to feel that a race that is 5 miles longer than a marathon is much harder than doing the goofy. I think a 50 miler is a bit harder than a HIM but not nearly as hard as an IM. Did you mean a 50k was no where near as hard as an IM, in that case I agree. A 50 miler though, assuming you like riding and swimming an IM is much easier than a 50 miler, although you may find they take similar time to complete depending on the elevations. I say if it is a choice, go with the 50 miler. There is nothing on the 50k that you haven't done before. Disagreement between two Ultra runners whom I have the utmost respect for? This is like a Bobby Flay throwdown! I am really looking forward to hearing this one play out. |
| 2012-08-30 3:15 PM in reply to: #4387295 |
Elite 3002 HURRICANE, Utah | Subject: RE: 50k vs 50 mile I've done 3 Ironman prolly 25 HIM a 50K and 1 50 miler with a couple more 50Ks and 1 more 50 miler coming this year. I was out there longer with the Ironman then the 50 miler but I actually run trained much better for the 50 miler so I was not hurting as badly at the end of the 50 miler as I was from the Ironmans. Toughness - I think thats mostly mental. Definitely go for the 50 miler! Edited by Jungle Jenn 2012-08-30 3:16 PM |
| 2012-08-30 5:16 PM in reply to: #4388613 |
Champion 5312 Calgary | Subject: RE: 50k vs 50 mile runamarathon - 2012-08-30 1:41 PM BigDH - 2012-08-30 3:20 PM yeats - 2012-08-30 5:37 AM Is the goofy challenge where you run a half-marathon one day and a marathon the next? If so, then I'd skip the 50k and go for the 50 miler. Not sure you're going to feel that a race that is 5 miles longer than a marathon is much harder than doing the goofy. I think a 50 miler is a bit harder than a HIM but not nearly as hard as an IM. Did you mean a 50k was no where near as hard as an IM, in that case I agree. A 50 miler though, assuming you like riding and swimming an IM is much easier than a 50 miler, although you may find they take similar time to complete depending on the elevations. I say if it is a choice, go with the 50 miler. There is nothing on the 50k that you haven't done before. Disagreement between two Ultra runners whom I have the utmost respect for? This is like a Bobby Flay throwdown! I am really looking forward to hearing this one play out. ha, perhaps it is due to our relative fitness levels. |
| 2012-08-31 2:20 AM in reply to: #4388904 |
Member 67 Maryland | Subject: RE: 50k vs 50 mile BigDH - 2012-08-30 6:16 PM runamarathon - 2012-08-30 1:41 PM BigDH - 2012-08-30 3:20 PM yeats - 2012-08-30 5:37 AM Is the goofy challenge where you run a half-marathon one day and a marathon the next? If so, then I'd skip the 50k and go for the 50 miler. Not sure you're going to feel that a race that is 5 miles longer than a marathon is much harder than doing the goofy. I think a 50 miler is a bit harder than a HIM but not nearly as hard as an IM. Did you mean a 50k was no where near as hard as an IM, in that case I agree. A 50 miler though, assuming you like riding and swimming an IM is much easier than a 50 miler, although you may find they take similar time to complete depending on the elevations. I say if it is a choice, go with the 50 miler. There is nothing on the 50k that you haven't done before. Disagreement between two Ultra runners whom I have the utmost respect for? This is like a Bobby Flay throwdown! I am really looking forward to hearing this one play out. ha, perhaps it is due to our relative fitness levels. Class act. |
| 2012-08-31 11:09 AM in reply to: #4387295 |
Champion 6993 Chicago, Illinois | Subject: RE: 50k vs 50 mile Do the 50k because everyone is right when they say do the 50 miler but someone has to disagree.  |
| 2012-08-31 1:57 PM in reply to: #4387295 |
Veteran 310 Kansas City | Subject: RE: 50k vs 50 mile I did the Goofy for my first marathon! How do you like the Disney races? I guess I shouldn't be at all surprised at the number BTErs that did that race. There, my completely off topic post for today is done. ;-) |
| 2012-09-04 2:23 PM in reply to: #4388568 |
Expert 1145 Ann Arbor, MI | Subject: RE: 50k vs 50 mile BigDH - 2012-08-30 3:20 PM yeats - 2012-08-30 5:37 AM Is the goofy challenge where you run a half-marathon one day and a marathon the next? If so, then I'd skip the 50k and go for the 50 miler. Not sure you're going to feel that a race that is 5 miles longer than a marathon is much harder than doing the goofy. I think a 50 miler is a bit harder than a HIM but not nearly as hard as an IM. Did you mean a 50k was no where near as hard as an IM, in that case I agree. A 50 miler though, assuming you like riding and swimming an IM is much easier than a 50 miler, although you may find they take similar time to complete depending on the elevations. I say if it is a choice, go with the 50 miler. There is nothing on the 50k that you haven't done before.Hmmm, not sure why I said "a bit" harder, for what I should've written is I think that the difficulty of a 50 miler is usually somewhere between a HIM and an IM, and it depends on the course profile, conditions, elevation, etc. There are 50 mile courses that are more difficult than IMs, but not very many that I know of. Below is my rigorously scientific method of assigning difficulty values to these races and distances. Provided that I'm adequately trained on race day for the distance and I'm racing within my fitness and my fueling is on point, I ask myself, for what portion of the race am I saying things like, 'this is pure suffering, I can't take any more, I'm not sure how I can go on, I cannot go any faster than I am going right now, I've never been in so much pain, I don't think I'll ever be able to run (or bike or swim) again, I think this is crushing my will to live, I hope a car hits me so I can stop racing' etc. Ryan's suffermeter: 5k = .5 miles (of pure suffering) HM = 4 miles Marathon = 8 miles HIM = 15.5 miles (last .5 miles on the swim + last 10 miles on bike + last 5 miles on run) 50 miler = 20 miles IM = 31 miles (last 1 mile on the swim + last 20 miles on the bike + last 10 miles on the run) 100 miler = 40 miles |
| 2012-09-04 5:24 PM in reply to: #4387295 |
Veteran 740 The Woodlands, TX | Subject: RE: 50k vs 50 mile I went from marathon distance right to 50-miles....no big issues with making that jump, so I agree with the advice to do whichever race draws you in the most. From my perspective, 50-miles has a much greater physical impact on most people than a typical IM - both on race day and for weeks after. The most compelling stat to compare them might be DNF rates. I'd be willing to be that the DNF rates for most 50-milers are quite a bit higher than for most IM's. |
| 2012-09-04 9:18 PM in reply to: #4395220 |
Champion 6993 Chicago, Illinois | Subject: RE: 50k vs 50 mile That is one reason I like tris. More effort less pain. |
| 2012-09-07 4:45 PM in reply to: #4387295 |
Veteran 468 STATESBORO, GA | Subject: RE: 50k vs 50 mile Corey, I liked the disney races. I enjoyed the distractions on the road. However, it was for sure more for the family. They LOVE DISNEY. My wife is the one who is nuts over it. However, be prepared to lay down some serious money if your wife enjoys the whole experience as well as mine does. The kids enjoy it, and it will be something they remember - so its worth it. Ill be there again this year. My wife is running her first half. Ill run it with her so we will go slow. Hopefully I will be able to pr the mary after a good slow pace on the half. PS I am registered for the 50 mile. I hopefully will join the cool kids club Feb, 17, 2013!! yeah I'm pretty friggin pumped. You guys are awesome - thanks for the input from all! Edited by kstater39 2012-09-07 5:04 PM |
| 2012-09-07 5:11 PM in reply to: #4387295 |
Champion 6993 Chicago, Illinois | Subject: RE: 50k vs 50 mile if you do a 50 miler your cool? sweet I am cool for once. |
| 2012-11-27 7:17 AM in reply to: #4394885 |
Expert 1091 | Subject: RE: 50k vs 50 mile yeats - 2012-09-04 3:23 PM BigDH - 2012-08-30 3:20 PM yeats - 2012-08-30 5:37 AM Is the goofy challenge where you run a half-marathon one day and a marathon the next? If so, then I'd skip the 50k and go for the 50 miler. Not sure you're going to feel that a race that is 5 miles longer than a marathon is much harder than doing the goofy. I think a 50 miler is a bit harder than a HIM but not nearly as hard as an IM. Did you mean a 50k was no where near as hard as an IM, in that case I agree. A 50 miler though, assuming you like riding and swimming an IM is much easier than a 50 miler, although you may find they take similar time to complete depending on the elevations. I say if it is a choice, go with the 50 miler. There is nothing on the 50k that you haven't done before.Hmmm, not sure why I said "a bit" harder, for what I should've written is I think that the difficulty of a 50 miler is usually somewhere between a HIM and an IM, and it depends on the course profile, conditions, elevation, etc. There are 50 mile courses that are more difficult than IMs, but not very many that I know of. Below is my rigorously scientific method of assigning difficulty values to these races and distances. Provided that I'm adequately trained on race day for the distance and I'm racing within my fitness and my fueling is on point, I ask myself, for what portion of the race am I saying things like, 'this is pure suffering, I can't take any more, I'm not sure how I can go on, I cannot go any faster than I am going right now, I've never been in so much pain, I don't think I'll ever be able to run (or bike or swim) again, I think this is crushing my will to live, I hope a car hits me so I can stop racing' etc. Ryan's suffermeter: 5k = .5 miles (of pure suffering) HM = 4 miles Marathon = 8 miles HIM = 15.5 miles (last .5 miles on the swim + last 10 miles on bike + last 5 miles on run) 50 miler = 20 miles IM = 31 miles (last 1 mile on the swim + last 20 miles on the bike + last 10 miles on the run) 100 miler = 40 miles Yeats, I clearly need to step up my suffermeter! I laughed out loud when I read the "I hope I get hit by a car so I can stop racing" bit. |
| 2012-11-27 3:37 PM in reply to: #4387295 |
Champion 7547 Albuquerque, New Mexico Bronze member | Subject: RE: 50k vs 50 mile I did a 50-miler in April 2009 with my previous longest running race being a 15K in 2006. I did it as a long training day for IMCdA that year figuring if I could keep running 11 hours into the day, it'd be similar to the run of an IM. If the 50-miler is what you want to do, do it. No need to feel like you have to "progress" from a 5K to a 10K to a HM to a Marathon before going completely off the deep end. I can tell you I was far more sore after my stand-alone marathons than I was after my ultras or IM's. |
| 2013-01-26 9:49 PM in reply to: #4387295 |
Veteran 468 STATESBORO, GA | Subject: RE: 50k vs 50 mile 50 mile is in 4 weeks. How comfortable do you guys get with your 20+ mile runs. I seem to feel light until the 20 mile mark. Just wondering how bad my a?? Is going to get kicked. No problem with recovery it just the distance. |
| 2013-02-01 2:18 PM in reply to: #4387295 |
Extreme Veteran 391 Olive Branch, MS | Subject: RE: 50k vs 50 mile I did Destin 50m last year(I have a RR in my race log) as my first distance over 26.2(although I had done 11 marathons). Destin 50 is not just on "some sand", it IS on sand. I had never done IM at the time, but did Louisville this August. I actually thought 140.6 was tougher, but running is my strong point. You will do fine with the 50m just keep it easy. 20m training runs are tough, but you should probably run few over 20-I know it's a little late now. The toughest part of Destin(aside from a 30mph headwind for 25 miles last year) is the toll the sand takes on your muscles. It's hard to factor that in if you haven't trained on it much. I'll be there again this year. It is a first class race. |
| 2013-02-02 9:17 AM in reply to: #4604755 |
Veteran 468 STATESBORO, GA | Subject: RE: 50k vs 50 mile Thanks man. I've hit several 20+ during training. Just was hopping or thinking they would get easier as I progressed. I've been running only on sandy georgia dirt roads so we will see. Look forward to,seeing you there. Nursing a anterior tibialis tendon this weekend so hitting the bike today and Sunday. |
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