General Discussion Triathlon Talk » Clipless Pedals or NORMAL pedals for SUPERSPRINT Thriatlon Rss Feed  
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2012-11-19 5:09 AM


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Subject: Clipless Pedals or NORMAL pedals for SUPERSPRINT Thriatlon

Hi,

Ive searched on the web and I can nowhere read if clipless pedals are really faster than normal pedals.

For a supersprint triathlon (10k bike) I loss extra 15 seconds wearing the clipless pedals. Do I win more than 15 seconds riding with the clipless pedals than with the normal pedals or do I have other benefits that justify the clipless pedals and loss this extra 15 seconds aside they dont slip?

 

thanks for the answers and if you have some links of case study please post it

 

 



2012-11-19 6:19 AM
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Subject: RE: Clipless Pedals or NORMAL pedals for SUPERSPRINT Thriatlon

I'm no bike expert but the 1st time I did a run/bke/run, with cages I cramped up so bad during the 2nd run.  After that I got the clipless and have not had that problem again.  The shoes give your legs a lot of support.  You can also pull with the clip and can't to that with the rubber pedals.  In my opinion, clips are safer too.  I just started biking this year and started off with rubber pedals.  It was fine as long as they were dry but let them get wet and my feet were slipping off.

good luck

2012-11-19 6:44 AM
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Subject: RE: Clipless Pedals or NORMAL pedals for SUPERSPRINT Thriatlon

Hi KWdreamum, thanks for your answer.

you wrote "You can also pull with the clip and can't to that with the rubber pedals" Thats right, but do you really do it when you are in a race? thats my question? if there is a proved increase of power with the clips than with the rubber pedals?

2012-11-19 7:11 AM
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Subject: RE: Clipless Pedals or NORMAL pedals for SUPERSPRINT Thriatlon
I'm confused... how do you lose 15 seconds with clipless pedals vs. flat tops? It can't be the time it takes to clip in... And I've never had a run out of T1 long enough that I would lose that much time.

Let's say that you did lose 15 seconds in T1, you will easily make that up on the bike.

The fastest way to get on the bike and off the bike is flying mount with shoes already attached to the pedals. My wife shaved 30-45 seconds off her T1 by learning that skill alone...
2012-11-19 7:33 AM
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Subject: RE: Clipless Pedals or NORMAL pedals for SUPERSPRINT Thriatlon

Hi Audioja,

I loss 15 seconds, because if I use the clipless pedals I loss 10 seconds wearing the bike-shoes and 5 seconds taking them out.

I can improve this seconds but if I dont really need the shoes to improve my bike-time, why to use them? I could use directly my running shoes.

2012-11-19 7:52 AM
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Subject: RE: Clipless Pedals or NORMAL pedals for SUPERSPRINT Thriatlon
You will be more efficient on the bike when clipped in. You will gain the most when you have undulating or technical terrain, but your efficiency will be higher on pancake flat and long straights terrain as well.

Commonly, you will see somewhere between 10-25% increase in efficiency with clipless pedals versus flat tops. Let's say you increase the efficiency by 10% and that translates to a 10% increase in speed (it's most definitely not a 1:1 ratio, but let's make the math simple...). If you were averaging 18mph (200sec/mile)before and that would bring you up to 19.8mph (182sec/mile), that saves you 18 seconds per mile! As long as you're bike leg is longer than 7/8 mile, then you're ahead of the time loss.


2012-11-19 7:56 AM
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Subject: RE: Clipless Pedals or NORMAL pedals for SUPERSPRINT Thriatlon

thanks audiojan,I will make some tests and check my times. Do you know a website where they write about this improvment?

2012-11-19 8:13 AM
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Subject: RE: Clipless Pedals or NORMAL pedals for SUPERSPRINT Thriatlon
Just keep in mind that you need to train your body to pedal more efficiently, so just slapping on a pair of clipless pedals and expect big gains simply won't happen. You should expect that it takes the body somewhere between a few weeks and a few months to adapt.

Here's an article describing the advantages. If you do a google search, you will find many more.
http://www.livestrong.com/article/347867-advantages-clipless-cyclin...
2012-11-19 8:45 PM
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Subject: RE: Clipless Pedals or NORMAL pedals for SUPERSPRINT Thriatlon

I'd put the speed advantage at somewhere between 0 and 3%.  Comfort will be much better, but most of the "potential" loss of power is if your foot is constantly slipping or moving on the platform pedal.  If it currently isn't, there's not much to gain.  10% would be an extreme example.  I seriously doubt I would lose 10% (and no way in heck 25%) speed if I slapped on my platforms and went for a ride.  Possibly in extreme situations like sprinting or climbing out of the saddle (where your foot is more likely to shift or slip), but not for steady time trial riding.  I've seen a girl who showed up for a 20k TT and forgot her bike shoes.  She did the race in her flip flops and still posted a very respectable time well within the range I would have expected her to come in even with her bike shoes (about 21.6 mph)  There's no way she goes 23.77 mph (10% faster) in her bike shoes as she would have finished among a very different caliber of riders she has never been able to keep up with in training.

2012-11-20 12:08 AM
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Subject: RE: Clipless Pedals or NORMAL pedals for SUPERSPRINT Thriatlon
Notice that I did write in the explanation that you would be 10% more efficient and I also noted that it's not a 1:1 ratio between efficiency and speed. I tried to make it easy to answer without going into a long equation...

If you use this site, you can play with the numbers:
http://www.analyticcycling.com/ForcesSpeed_Page.html

If you use all the assumed parameters (0.5 frontal area and the same for drag, 1.226 for air density, 75kg rider, 0.004 for rolling resistance and 0.03 for slope), and assume that the rider can produce 150W with flat top pedals, that would give you a speed of 5.16m/s or 11.5mph. Assuming that you can produce 10% more power (as you engage the upstroke on the pedal cycle as well), you would now have 165W, which translates to a speed of 5.55m/s or 12.4mph according to the model.

Edited by audiojan 2012-11-20 12:14 AM
2012-11-20 1:51 PM
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Subject: RE: Clipless Pedals or NORMAL pedals for SUPERSPRINT Thriatlon

And I doubt you would produce 10% more power with clipless pedals while time trialing.  Again, maybe if you're comparing out of the saddle efforts that may result in more foot slippage or flex in the sole of the shoe.

If I can find my platforms, I'd love to experiment with this using a power meter.  A 10% difference in power would be very noticeable during something like 5 minute intervals.



2012-11-23 6:48 AM
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Subject: RE: Clipless Pedals or NORMAL pedals for SUPERSPRINT Thriatlon

bernardocom--here is another answer to your question:

1.  If I doubt that something really is better, I check to see what the best people in the activity (triathlon) are doing.  If the best people are using clipless peddles, then that is what I want.  I may not fully understand why it is better, but usually my full understanding comes later with more experience.  

Hope this helps

2012-11-25 7:23 AM
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Subject: RE: Clipless Pedals or NORMAL pedals for SUPERSPRINT Thriatlon
tri808 - 2012-11-20 2:51 PM

And I doubt you would produce 10% more power with clipless pedals while time trialing.  Again, maybe if you're comparing out of the saddle efforts that may result in more foot slippage or flex in the sole of the shoe.

If I can find my platforms, I'd love to experiment with this using a power meter.  A 10% difference in power would be very noticeable during something like 5 minute intervals.



You would easily produce 10% more power with proper cycling technique... and it could actually be even higher than that, but let's stick with the 10% for now... There's no way to engage the hamstrings without being able to utilize the upstroke. Yes, you do generate the vast majority of the power on the downstroke, but additional power from the upstroke shouldn't be completely ignored...
2012-11-25 12:00 PM
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Subject: RE: Clipless Pedals or NORMAL pedals for SUPERSPRINT Thriatlon

Lets make this simple (at least for me) if you plan on doing the supersprint then giving up Tri's then stick with whatever you have.  If you plan on doing more races, get the pedals and practice with the shoes mounted to the bike and leave them there. 

Another way to put it, if you are planning on winning (outright or AG) the SS then get the pedals and practice, practice, and then train, train, etc.  Otherwise get the pedals when you can and then practice, practice, train, train, rinse and repeat.

2012-11-26 1:28 PM
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Subject: RE: Clipless Pedals or NORMAL pedals for SUPERSPRINT Thriatlon
Agree Gary!
2012-11-26 2:42 PM
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Subject: RE: Clipless Pedals or NORMAL pedals for SUPERSPRINT Thriatlon

Purely anecdotal and I am a newbie riding for less than six months so take my experience with a grain of salt.  I just got my bike shoes and pedals a few months ago.  I certainly took me a few weeks to get comfortable with them (and a bit longer to get comfortable getting out of them). 

However, I did notice two things.  First, i was ascending hills much better.  No big climbs but what I had to do was noticably easier.  Second, although likley more psychological than physical, I was much more confident pushing myself than with my regular pedals & cages. 

Bottom line for me was I was training harder so I am happy I made the switch.  I have no idea what it will mean in a race itself but the journey to the race has been a big benefit for my improvement.

 



2012-11-26 9:13 PM
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Subject: RE: Clipless Pedals or NORMAL pedals for SUPERSPRINT Thriatlon
Practice your transitions! Perfecting your T1 & T2 is the best route to time savings. You should not lose any time in transition by using clipless pedals. Learn to mount/dismount your bike w/o stopping. Use speed laces on your running shoes. Your routine should be so clean by race day that it requires no thought, just autopilot. I have no data to back up the statement that clipless pedals are faster but I would never choose to use platform pedals in a race of any distance.
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