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Do you believe? (Page 5)
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 2013-01-29 12:37 PM in reply to: #4599739 |
Veteran  698   |  Subject: RE: Do you believe?Left Brain - 2013-01-29 9:53 AM sesh - 2013-01-29 11:03 AM Left Brain - 2013-01-29 10:38 AM What is it that holds a person to a moral standard? I'm asking.....I don't know. I think it's a higher power, God, whatever you want to call it. Moral standard as in code of conduct? Like "rules" to being "good?" Institutions that scare you into thinking you need them to be saved do that. Moral standard as in the ability to have compassion, care, concern, and love for others? I think a higher power is involved, but could just as easily see it as some evolutionary marker that separates us from nearly every other species. I think it's the combination of our ability to care and love coupled with all the other motor functions and brain abilities that separates us. For example, dolphins and dogs can show compassion, but they can't do much to help another injured dolphin or dog. In the end though, I even find my belief that there is a higher power somewhat frivolous. There either is or isn't, and maybe I'll find out when my life ends or maybe I won't. It holds no bearing on how I should treat others in the present. Exactly, but you still do what's right even though it holds no bearing. That's the point I'm trying to make.....and that leads me to believe in a greater power than man.
And I fully support your right to believe in this. Just as I expect others to support, or at least accept, my lack of belief. |
| 2013-01-29 12:43 PM in reply to: #4599794 |
Pro 15655 | Subject: RE: Do you believe? r1237h - 2013-01-29 12:37 PM Left Brain - 2013-01-29 9:53 AM sesh - 2013-01-29 11:03 AM Left Brain - 2013-01-29 10:38 AM What is it that holds a person to a moral standard? I'm asking.....I don't know. I think it's a higher power, God, whatever you want to call it. Moral standard as in code of conduct? Like "rules" to being "good?" Institutions that scare you into thinking you need them to be saved do that. Moral standard as in the ability to have compassion, care, concern, and love for others? I think a higher power is involved, but could just as easily see it as some evolutionary marker that separates us from nearly every other species. I think it's the combination of our ability to care and love coupled with all the other motor functions and brain abilities that separates us. For example, dolphins and dogs can show compassion, but they can't do much to help another injured dolphin or dog. In the end though, I even find my belief that there is a higher power somewhat frivolous. There either is or isn't, and maybe I'll find out when my life ends or maybe I won't. It holds no bearing on how I should treat others in the present. Exactly, but you still do what's right even though it holds no bearing. That's the point I'm trying to make.....and that leads me to believe in a greater power than man.
And I fully support your right to believe in this. Just as I expect others to support, or at least accept, my lack of belief. It never gets that far for me on this issue.......I like to hear other opinions, but I couldn't care less what opinion someone has....that's up to them and doesn't affect me at all beyond giving me something to think about. |
| 2013-01-29 12:45 PM in reply to: #4599756 |
Veteran 698 | Subject: RE: Do you believe? Left Brain - 2013-01-29 10:10 AM I agree with that.....I really couldn't care less about other's religious beliefs or non-belief....it doesn't have any bearing on my life. I enjoy discussing the issue because I still have alot of questions.
Questions?!?!? Believing (or not) has nothing to do with questions. I look at my wife, and don't understand how, after bouncing all over the world, I managed to find my other half. I look at my children, and am awed that these amazing kids came from me and my wife, and in addition to what they took from us, are there own people. At the twins, who have a connection, but are different. These are questions I face every day, with joy. I have no answers, nor want them, but I am enjoying the journey. |
| 2013-01-29 1:05 PM in reply to: #4599816 |
Pro 15655 | Subject: RE: Do you believe? r1237h - 2013-01-29 12:45 PM Left Brain - 2013-01-29 10:10 AM I agree with that.....I really couldn't care less about other's religious beliefs or non-belief....it doesn't have any bearing on my life. I enjoy discussing the issue because I still have alot of questions.
Questions?!?!? Believing (or not) has nothing to do with questions. I look at my wife, and don't understand how, after bouncing all over the world, I managed to find my other half. I look at my children, and am awed that these amazing kids came from me and my wife, and in addition to what they took from us, are there own people. At the twins, who have a connection, but are different. These are questions I face every day, with joy. I have no answers, nor want them, but I am enjoying the journey. Where did I say you had questions or not? I said I have questions. I don't care if you do or not. For me, believing is still full of questions. But.....I see we have some common ground....twins are a blast, huh? My identical girls are just turning 13....and I now have the answer to where they came from............HELL!!!!!!!! Edited by Left Brain 2013-01-29 1:07 PM |
| 2013-01-29 1:19 PM in reply to: #4599756 |
Champion 5117 Brandon, MS | Subject: RE: Do you believe? Left Brain - 2013-01-29 12:10 PM I agree with that.....I really couldn't care less about other's religious beliefs or non-belief....it doesn't have any bearing on my life. I enjoy discussing the issue because I still have alot of questions. Questions are great and spur growth, spiritually and otherwise. In fact, beware the one with answers to the toughest questions. There is no yes or no answer to why. I often find that more and more questions arise the more and more I "dive in." I'm ok with that and rather enjoy it. Makes this life a lot more fun. What I do see, and what disturbs me, is that people often mistake them as questions of faith as opposed to questions about faith. Edited by sesh 2013-01-29 1:29 PM |
| 2013-01-29 1:29 PM in reply to: #4599842 |
Veteran 698 | Subject: RE: Do you believe? Left Brain - 2013-01-29 11:05 AM r1237h - 2013-01-29 12:45 PM Left Brain - 2013-01-29 10:10 AM I agree with that.....I really couldn't care less about other's religious beliefs or non-belief....it doesn't have any bearing on my life. I enjoy discussing the issue because I still have alot of questions.
Questions?!?!? Believing (or not) has nothing to do with questions. I look at my wife, and don't understand how, after bouncing all over the world, I managed to find my other half. I look at my children, and am awed that these amazing kids came from me and my wife, and in addition to what they took from us, are there own people. At the twins, who have a connection, but are different. These are questions I face every day, with joy. I have no answers, nor want them, but I am enjoying the journey. Where did I say you had questions or not? I said I have questions. I don't care if you do or not. For me, believing is still full of questions. But.....I see we have some common ground....twins are a blast, huh? My identical girls are just turning 13....and I now have the answer to where they came from............HELL!!!!!!!!
My point was that having questions has little to do with believing or not.
As for the girls, let's see if I got this right:
Two girls, entering their teens?
Yeah, in such a case, I too would look for answers, wherever I could find them
I wish you luck, and hope you survive.
I have a friend who has two girls, ages 8 and 10. He was laughing at me because my two boys were trying to kill each other (also 8 and 10. The other 8 year old is a girl), so I said to him "Three words in a few years: Teens, hormones and boys. Have a nice day" Wiped the smile off his face..,.. Edited by r1237h 2013-01-29 1:33 PM |
| 2013-01-29 1:39 PM in reply to: #4599895 |
Pro 15655 | Subject: RE: Do you believe? r1237h - 2013-01-29 1:29 PM Left Brain - 2013-01-29 11:05 AM r1237h - 2013-01-29 12:45 PM Left Brain - 2013-01-29 10:10 AM I agree with that.....I really couldn't care less about other's religious beliefs or non-belief....it doesn't have any bearing on my life. I enjoy discussing the issue because I still have alot of questions.
Questions?!?!? Believing (or not) has nothing to do with questions. I look at my wife, and don't understand how, after bouncing all over the world, I managed to find my other half. I look at my children, and am awed that these amazing kids came from me and my wife, and in addition to what they took from us, are there own people. At the twins, who have a connection, but are different. These are questions I face every day, with joy. I have no answers, nor want them, but I am enjoying the journey. Where did I say you had questions or not? I said I have questions. I don't care if you do or not. For me, believing is still full of questions. But.....I see we have some common ground....twins are a blast, huh? My identical girls are just turning 13....and I now have the answer to where they came from............HELL!!!!!!!!
My point was that having questions has little to do with believing or not.
As for the girls, let's see if I got this right:
Two girls, entering their teens?
Yeah, in such a case, I too would look for answers, wherever I could find them
I wish you luck, and hope you survive.
I have a friend who has two girls, ages 8 and 10. He was laughing at me because my two boys were trying to kill each other (also 8 and 10. The other 8 year old is a girl), so I said to him "Three words in a few years: Teens, hormones and boys. Have a nice day" Wiped the smile off his face..,.. They have an older brother who is 6'2" at 15 years old.....he will be enlisted as the "enforcer". |
| 2013-01-29 1:45 PM in reply to: #4598986 |
Iron Donkey 38643  , Wisconsin | Subject: RE: Do you believe? skipg - 2013-01-28 10:46 PM captantony - 2013-01-28 11:14 PM No credibility until your post counts reach at least 10,000! At my avg of around .40 per day, I'll reach cred status and finally get some respect in 60 more years or so. 1stTimeTri - 2013-01-28 11:11 PM captantony - 2013-01-28 10:10 PM 1stTimeTri - 2013-01-28 10:59 PM captantony - 2013-01-28 9:53 PM HUH??? Why would you say that? Your opinion would be just as valid as anyone else's.the bear - 2013-01-28 7:40 PM Bigfuzzydoug - 2013-01-28 3:44 PM I believe a BT'er with only 241 posts, asking THIS question, and calling us "cohorts" is a troll.
OP has been here 3 years. "Only 241 posts" just means little time in CoJ and probably no time in TAN. This boosts his credibility considerably, IMHO. THIS! THIS is the reason for the not renewing BT membership post. I have very strong opinions on the original topic, but none I would want to post here. Quite honestly my opinions on religion are personal, as are everyone else's opinions. However, if I chose to participate in this thread I am certain that my opinions would be disregarded because my screen name is not known and my post counts are not high (although I have been around and active for a long while). The rest of my rant belongs in the "what's wrong with BT membership post" so I will stop. Not true. Look at the quoted post where the OP was discredited for 'only' having 240 posts. But, you're not the OP. Well played, but.................  Well, if that IS you in the avatar, and your seat is not too high, I think you have some credibility, even though you are over 200 behind the Cap'n. |
| 2013-01-29 1:48 PM in reply to: #4599791 |
| Member 143 Oklahoma City, OK | Subject: RE: Do you believe? r1237h - 2013-01-29 12:36 PM Sooner Tri Guy - 2013-01-29 9:34 AMI share this to our awesome non-believing COJ friends, and ask you to please be patient with us 'crazy Christians' when we try to 'convert' you. Please understand we mean no harm; but to us, there is a truck barreling down on you and we don't want you to get hit! I understand that. However, does the opposite hold true? If I believe that religion is not good for you, is it ok for me to try to ""convert" you to not believing? Or can we agree that you can try, but if I let you know that I am not interested, you drop it? And the same for me? Of course, my friend! That's what free will is all about. We all have to make our own decisions about this life and the life beyond (or even whether to believe in one). As long as we agree that our own personal beliefs (no matter how fervent) will not change the outcome. I am always happy to read & hear all points of view, and seek to be respectful to them. I certainly don't have all the answers to the philosophical questions people may have (how many angels can dance on the head of a pin?) but enjoy lively discussion. Even when it comes to my own faith, I can't claim to be an expert. I can only share the difference it's made in my own life! I feel like the blind man that Jesus healed, when he was questioned about the philosophical significance of the act. The blind man said, "I don't know the answers to your questions, but I do know this; once I was BLIND, but now I can SEE!" Peace! |
| 2013-01-29 2:08 PM in reply to: #4599931 |
Expert 1194 | Subject: RE: Do you believe? 1stTimeTri - 2013-01-29 2:45 PM Yeah its me in the avatar but my seat is too high so back to no cred. It will take me 2 years to make up that 200 post count deficit on Cap'n, assuming he stops posting now. skipg - 2013-01-28 10:46 PM captantony - 2013-01-28 11:14 PM No credibility until your post counts reach at least 10,000! At my avg of around .40 per day, I'll reach cred status and finally get some respect in 60 more years or so. 1stTimeTri - 2013-01-28 11:11 PM captantony - 2013-01-28 10:10 PM 1stTimeTri - 2013-01-28 10:59 PM captantony - 2013-01-28 9:53 PM HUH??? Why would you say that? Your opinion would be just as valid as anyone else's.the bear - 2013-01-28 7:40 PM Bigfuzzydoug - 2013-01-28 3:44 PM I believe a BT'er with only 241 posts, asking THIS question, and calling us "cohorts" is a troll.
OP has been here 3 years. "Only 241 posts" just means little time in CoJ and probably no time in TAN. This boosts his credibility considerably, IMHO. THIS! THIS is the reason for the not renewing BT membership post. I have very strong opinions on the original topic, but none I would want to post here. Quite honestly my opinions on religion are personal, as are everyone else's opinions. However, if I chose to participate in this thread I am certain that my opinions would be disregarded because my screen name is not known and my post counts are not high (although I have been around and active for a long while). The rest of my rant belongs in the "what's wrong with BT membership post" so I will stop. Not true. Look at the quoted post where the OP was discredited for 'only' having 240 posts. But, you're not the OP. Well played, but................. Well, if that IS you in the avatar, and your seat is not too high, I think you have some credibility, even though you are over 200 behind the Cap'n.  |
| 2013-01-29 3:35 PM in reply to: #4599924 |
Veteran 698 | Subject: RE: Do you believe? Left Brain - 2013-01-29 11:39 AM r1237h - 2013-01-29 1:29 PM Left Brain - 2013-01-29 11:05 AM r1237h - 2013-01-29 12:45 PM Left Brain - 2013-01-29 10:10 AM I agree with that.....I really couldn't care less about other's religious beliefs or non-belief....it doesn't have any bearing on my life. I enjoy discussing the issue because I still have alot of questions.
Questions?!?!? Believing (or not) has nothing to do with questions. I look at my wife, and don't understand how, after bouncing all over the world, I managed to find my other half. I look at my children, and am awed that these amazing kids came from me and my wife, and in addition to what they took from us, are there own people. At the twins, who have a connection, but are different. These are questions I face every day, with joy. I have no answers, nor want them, but I am enjoying the journey. Where did I say you had questions or not? I said I have questions. I don't care if you do or not. For me, believing is still full of questions. But.....I see we have some common ground....twins are a blast, huh? My identical girls are just turning 13....and I now have the answer to where they came from............HELL!!!!!!!!
My point was that having questions has little to do with believing or not.
As for the girls, let's see if I got this right:
Two girls, entering their teens?
Yeah, in such a case, I too would look for answers, wherever I could find them
I wish you luck, and hope you survive.
I have a friend who has two girls, ages 8 and 10. He was laughing at me because my two boys were trying to kill each other (also 8 and 10. The other 8 year old is a girl), so I said to him "Three words in a few years: Teens, hormones and boys. Have a nice day" Wiped the smile off his face..,.. They have an older brother who is 6'2" at 15 years old.....he will be enlisted as the "enforcer".
The two brothers are slated to be in charge of giving any boy who even looks at their sister a hard time. |
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