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2013-06-19 2:35 PM

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Subject: What is the order of your Swim/Bike/Run for the endurance sessions?
Hi all,

I'm a IM first timer and have been following a plan where my long workouts are: bike on Saturday, run early morning Sunday, and late afternoon swim. What has worked best for some you who have had a few IMs under their belt?

My goal in Placid is to enjoy the race and be injury free - I'm not pursuing a record breaking time.

Thanks!


2013-06-19 3:11 PM
in reply to: lgolding

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Subject: RE: What is the order of your Swim/Bike/Run for the endurance sessions?
I have always preferred to do my long runs before my long ride. For me, I'm more prone to running overuse injuries so I've had to be cautious of how far into the hole I go with my running. If I'm doing a long swim it's usually during the middle of the week so doesn't really bump against the long run/bike. I also don't do that many long swims.
2013-06-19 4:25 PM
in reply to: lgolding

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Subject: RE: What is the order of your Swim/Bike/Run for the endurance sessions?

Two school of thoughts in IM training long runs.

First practice running on tired legs so long rides Saturday and long runs Sunday.

Second school of thought, train for each discipline as fresh as possible so split long run and long ride. Many do long run Wed or Thursday and long bike Saturday and if bad weather have option for long ride again on Sunday.

Others like to do weakest discipline first and freshest.

In the 4 IMs I've done, first one I did first way and split way 3 second way.

My fatigue was better with long training spread out.

2013-06-19 4:53 PM
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Subject: RE: What is the order of your Swim/Bike/Run for the endurance sessions?
Great points all! I have overuse injuries to both my knees - I'm most concerned about the run for that reason. I may try the long run mid-week and leave the long bike/swim on the weekend.

Edited by lgolding 2013-06-19 4:54 PM
2013-06-19 5:52 PM
in reply to: lgolding

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Subject: RE: What is the order of your Swim/Bike/Run for the endurance sessions?
I run long Thursday mornings (even if it means getting up at 4am). I ride long Sat and Sun. See you in LP!
2013-06-20 7:24 AM
in reply to: KathyG

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Subject: RE: What is the order of your Swim/Bike/Run for the endurance sessions?
Originally posted by KathyG

Two school of thoughts in IM training long runs.

First practice running on tired legs so long rides Saturday and long runs Sunday.

Second school of thought, train for each discipline as fresh as possible so split long run and long ride. Many do long run Wed or Thursday and long bike Saturday and if bad weather have option for long ride again on Sunday.

I wouldn't even consider the first school of thought a school of thought anymore.  Running on tired legs = suboptimal training.  There's absolutely no argument or discussion to be made in favor of that philosophy.

ALWAYS separate the long run and long bike by at least two days (preferably three) unless one's life schedule dictates otherwise.



2013-06-20 1:26 PM
in reply to: GMAN 19030


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Subject: RE: What is the order of your Swim/Bike/Run for the endurance sessions?
I'm training for my first as well. I am doing the long run midweek (usually Wednesday) and long ride on the weekend (whichever weekend day works best around kids' activities and weather). I, too, was concerned about overuse injuries on the run if running long on tired legs. I'll take that risk on race day but not in training. Wednesday is usually a swim day for me too and I'm finding this is becoming a problem as I prefer to do all my workouts in the morning. There aren't enough hours before work to swim and do a long run.

The other reason I'm doing this is to take my rest day on the weekend for family time. Obviously IM is a huge time commitment for my family. I'm trying to minimize the impact as best I can which means 4AM alarms Mon-Fri and 5:30AM long rides on Sat or Sun.
2013-06-20 8:01 PM
in reply to: GMAN 19030

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Subject: RE: What is the order of your Swim/Bike/Run for the endurance sessions?
Originally posted by GMAN 19030

Originally posted by KathyG

Two school of thoughts in IM training long runs.

First practice running on tired legs so long rides Saturday and long runs Sunday.

Second school of thought, train for each discipline as fresh as possible so split long run and long ride. Many do long run Wed or Thursday and long bike Saturday and if bad weather have option for long ride again on Sunday.



I wouldn't even consider the first school of thought a school of thought anymore.  Running on tired legs = suboptimal training.  There's absolutely no argument or discussion to be made in favor of that philosophy.




Besides the numerous wildly successful plans that have you train that way?
2013-06-20 8:56 PM
in reply to: lgolding

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Subject: RE: What is the order of your Swim/Bike/Run for the endurance sessions?
Interesting topic, thanks for posting. I'll throw in my thinking for my first Ironman....I'm using a Fitzgerald plan that calls for a Sat long bike, Sun long run and long swim. But I'm fine with that because I come from a running background. I figure the let's say 55 mile bike that week is more important to me as a newer cyclist than the 12 mile run on Sunday. I've run enough marathons that I can cut my run short if need be and focus on the 2400m swim later in the day. (He has you run a tempo run on Friday.) YMMV
2013-06-20 10:55 PM
in reply to: bgraboski

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Subject: RE: What is the order of your Swim/Bike/Run for the endurance sessions?
Originally posted by bgraboski
Originally posted by GMAN 19030
Originally posted by KathyG

Two school of thoughts in IM training long runs.

First practice running on tired legs so long rides Saturday and long runs Sunday.

Second school of thought, train for each discipline as fresh as possible so split long run and long ride. Many do long run Wed or Thursday and long bike Saturday and if bad weather have option for long ride again on Sunday.

I wouldn't even consider the first school of thought a school of thought anymore.  Running on tired legs = suboptimal training.  There's absolutely no argument or discussion to be made in favor of that philosophy.

Besides the numerous wildly successful plans that have you train that way?
And they'd be more successful if they got with the program and updated their training plans for the 21st century to separate the long run and long bike.There's not a coach in the world worth a darn that advocates running on tired legs and plans for their athletes to do so (unless life dictates as I qualified previously). I couldn't take a plan or coach seriously that would advocate the Sat long run followed by the Sun long run. It makes no f'n sense.
2013-06-21 7:57 AM
in reply to: GMAN 19030

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Subject: RE: What is the order of your Swim/Bike/Run for the endurance sessions?
Originally posted by GMAN 19030
Originally posted by bgraboski
Originally posted by GMAN 19030
Originally posted by KathyG

Two school of thoughts in IM training long runs.

First practice running on tired legs so long rides Saturday and long runs Sunday.

Second school of thought, train for each discipline as fresh as possible so split long run and long ride. Many do long run Wed or Thursday and long bike Saturday and if bad weather have option for long ride again on Sunday.

I wouldn't even consider the first school of thought a school of thought anymore.  Running on tired legs = suboptimal training.  There's absolutely no argument or discussion to be made in favor of that philosophy.

Besides the numerous wildly successful plans that have you train that way?
And they'd be more successful if they got with the program and updated their training plans for the 21st century to separate the long run and long bike.There's not a coach in the world worth a darn that advocates running on tired legs and plans for their athletes to do so (unless life dictates as I qualified previously). I couldn't take a plan or coach seriously that would advocate the Sat long run followed by the Sun long run. It makes no f'n sense.
I meant Sat long bike, Sun long run in the last part.


2013-06-21 9:49 AM
in reply to: GMAN 19030

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Subject: RE: What is the order of your Swim/Bike/Run for the endurance sessions?
I did my long run, 17 miles yesterday/Thursday and am doing my 85 mile bike ride on Saturday. I'm still sore today, but I think by tomorrow I'll be alright by tomorrow. Thanks all for the great advice! This journey in training has been as interesting as it is eye-opening to how amazing the body can adapt to incredible stress. I've done marathons before and I thought the training was much harder than the race itself. Looking forward to seeing how Ironman training pulls together on race day!!!
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