General Discussion Triathlon Talk » 2.4 miles - done, 112 miles - done, 14 miles and then ...wtf??? Rss Feed  
Moderators: jmk-brooklyn, Ron Reply
2013-08-29 5:33 PM

User image

Expert
921
500100100100100
Subject: 2.4 miles - done, 112 miles - done, 14 miles and then ...wtf???
I'm trying to figure out why I was reduced to a 12 minute/mile run/walk regimen the final half of my IM run. My swim was a breeze - easiest 2.4 miles ever. Drafting makes all the difference. Bike I took real easy a coasted downhills, spun up hills, stated seated, followed nutrition plan averaging 250 cal/hr. and walked out of T2 feeling okay. Got organized and started running around 9 min miles. Felt okay, not great, but okay. Was taking salt, drinking, fueling, etc... Felt good till around mile 12.


At half way I felt the energy drop. At some point after pushing on I was reduced to my run/walk, around mile 14. I wasn't cramping. I had no GI issues. I was a bit dehydrated, but that's expected. Why didn't I just keep running? I feel like I stopped myself, maybe to strategically preserve energy, but it certainly wasn't my body that gave out, it was my mind. I justified run walking so I could maintain 12 min miles rather than pushing another few miles and then hoping I didn't cramp or fall flat, having to limp home. I feel like it was strategic in the moment, but now I'll never know what would have happened had I kept running.


I guess that's just it ... I'll never know. I took the conservative approach and ended with a conservative time. Pushing, I would have ended with a great time, a really bad one, or a dnf. It's a tough in the moment decision to have to make. Was my decision the right one?



2013-08-29 7:38 PM
in reply to: DV 1

User image

Master
2157
20001002525
Gold member
Subject: RE: 2.4 miles - done, 112 miles - done, 14 miles and then ...wtf???
I have had the same problem. I don't know if it is low blood sugar, like a light bonk, or the central governor, or just plain old mental toughness.
My IM runs have been....dissapointing.
2013-08-29 9:50 PM
in reply to: DV 1

User image

Champion
19688
50005000500020002000500100252525
MA
Bronze member
Subject: RE: 2.4 miles - done, 112 miles - done, 14 miles and then ...wtf???

Probably don't want to hear this but most likely pacing for the swim, bike and the first 10 miles on the run based on your fitness. Nutrition can play a role here as well, but often folks blame nutrition rather than race execution.

Could you have run if you pushed yourself?

2013-08-29 10:06 PM
in reply to: DV 1

User image

Extreme Veteran
379
100100100252525
Northern Virginia
Subject: RE: 2.4 miles - done, 112 miles - done, 14 miles and then ...wtf???
Something very similar happened to me at Lake Placid last month. My analysis is poor nutrition on the run combined with insufficient mental toughness. Improving my mental toughness is now one of my top goals for next season.
2013-08-29 10:32 PM
in reply to: KathyG

User image

Champion
7507
50002000500
Columbia, South Carolina
Subject: RE: 2.4 miles - done, 112 miles - done, 14 miles and then ...wtf???
Originally posted by KathyG

Probably don't want to hear this but most likely pacing for the swim, bike and the first 10 miles on the run based on your fitness. Nutrition can play a role here as well, but often folks blame nutrition rather than race execution.

Could you have run if you pushed yourself?




Yep. I'd say almost certainly overcooked the bike and maybe the swim too.

You say that you "Felt okay, not great, but okay.". That's a bad sign. You should feel *amazing* at the beginning of the run. (We'll leave the first mile out of it -- the first mile can be weird; but once you've settled in, you should feel great.) You should be celebrating getting off the bike, and feeling like you could run much much faster, and you could, but you're smart and you don't.
2013-08-30 1:25 PM
in reply to: Experior

User image

Extreme Veteran
482
100100100100252525
Austin, TX
Subject: RE: 2.4 miles - done, 112 miles - done, 14 miles and then ...wtf???
How many 100+ mile bike rides did you do in training? First inclination is you overcooked the bike.


2013-08-30 3:04 PM
in reply to: rbalazs

User image

Expert
921
500100100100100
Subject: RE: 2.4 miles - done, 112 miles - done, 14 miles and then ...wtf???
I did three 100+ rides during training. As for swim, there's no way I went too fast there. I was basically tickling the guys feet in front of me for an hour. I had the opportunity to jump on a faster swimmers feet twice and opted for my nice easy relaxed pace behind my original guy. The bike wasn't easy, but it was far from hard. My shoulders got pretty sore by the end, but my legs felt good. I feel like my bike speed was a sweet spot between going so slow I'd be out on the course longer than reasonable for me and going my normal speed like last year. Normal easy is 21 and that was way too fast last year. I approach 22.5 in an Oly and 21 - 21.5 in a half. My full speed was 19.7. Maybe the answer will only reveal itself after I race more iron distances. I just wondered if others have had similar experiences and what their solutions/outcomes were. I'm leaning toward not enough nutrition and lack of mental toughness.


The mental toughness one is complicated. If being mentally tough means giving it my all until I collapse in a heap on the side of the road, I'm not sure I want to be mentally tough. Does one have to be prepared to fail in order to achieve to their greatest?

2013-08-30 4:03 PM
in reply to: DV 1

User image

Champion
15754
5000500050005001001002525
Happy Valley
Subject: RE: 2.4 miles - done, 112 miles - done, 14 miles and then ...wtf???
Originally posted by DV 1I did three 100+ rides during training. As for swim, there's no way I went too fast there. I was basically tickling the guys feet in front of me for an hour. I had the opportunity to jump on a faster swimmers feet twice and opted for my nice easy relaxed pace behind my original guy. The bike wasn't easy, but it was far from hard. My shoulders got pretty sore by the end, but my legs felt good. I feel like my bike speed was a sweet spot between going so slow I'd be out on the course longer than reasonable for me and going my normal speed like last year. Normal easy is 21 and that was way too fast last year. I approach 22.5 in an Oly and 21 - 21.5 in a half. My full speed was 19.7. Maybe the answer will only reveal itself after I race more iron distances. I just wondered if others have had similar experiences and what their solutions/outcomes were. I'm leaning toward not enough nutrition and lack of mental toughness.

The mental toughness one is complicated. If being mentally tough means giving it my all until I collapse in a heap on the side of the road, I'm not sure I want to be mentally tough. Does one have to be prepared to fail in order to achieve to their greatest?

. I do grant that it is impossible to be sure what happened to you, but I would put another vote in for biking too hard. Nobody wants to hear it and I suspect you don't either, but the most likely cause of what happened is you biked too hard for your current level of fitness. To reach your potential, yes you may have to flirt with failure, but as a 5time ironman who has over biked myself before....my opinion is just that.
2013-08-30 4:17 PM
in reply to: Fred D

Iron Donkey
38593
500050005000500050005000500020001000500252525
, Wisconsin
Subject: RE: 2.4 miles - done, 112 miles - done, 14 miles and then ...wtf???
Lots of factors.  It's an Ironman afterall.
2013-08-30 4:22 PM
in reply to: 1stTimeTri

User image

Champion
34258
500050005000500050005000200020001001002525
Chicago
Silver member
Subject: RE: 2.4 miles - done, 112 miles - done, 14 miles and then ...wtf???
Originally posted by 1stTimeTri

Lots of factors.  It's an Ironman afterall.


I was going to say ... where do we begin ... I would say, start with the fact that you'd just gone 128 miles at that point?
2013-08-30 4:27 PM
in reply to: mr2tony

Iron Donkey
38593
500050005000500050005000500020001000500252525
, Wisconsin
Subject: RE: 2.4 miles - done, 112 miles - done, 14 miles and then ...wtf???

Originally posted by mr2tony
Originally posted by 1stTimeTri Lots of factors.  It's an Ironman afterall.
I was going to say ... where do we begin ... I would say, start with the fact that you'd just gone 128 miles at that point?

Exactly!



2013-08-30 5:52 PM
in reply to: DV 1

User image

Extreme Veteran
379
100100100252525
Northern Virginia
Subject: RE: 2.4 miles - done, 112 miles - done, 14 miles and then ...wtf???
Originally posted by DV 1

I just wondered if others have had similar experiences and what their solutions/outcomes were.




My solution was to suck down a bunch of orange slices. That did wonders. Then I played my motivational song in my head. That got me running to the end.

I don't think I overcooked my bike (although anything is possible). I got my VO2 max retested a few months before the race and I stayed in zone 2 for pretty much the entire 112 miles.

On mental toughness, I don't plan to push myself until I collapse. It will be more about smarter pacing the first half of the run and then building on that so I can negative split and push hard (but not insane) that second half and all the way to the end of the race, no matter the distance. I'll let you know when I've figured that out.

2013-08-30 7:01 PM
in reply to: Experior

User image

Champion
6419
50001000100100100100
NOVA - Ironic for an Endurance Athlete
Subject: RE: 2.4 miles - done, 112 miles - done, 14 miles and then ...wtf???
Originally posted by Experior

Originally posted by KathyG

Probably don't want to hear this but most likely pacing for the swim, bike and the first 10 miles on the run based on your fitness. Nutrition can play a role here as well, but often folks blame nutrition rather than race execution.

Could you have run if you pushed yourself?




Yep. I'd say almost certainly overcooked the bike and maybe the swim too.

You say that you "Felt okay, not great, but okay.". That's a bad sign. You should feel *amazing* at the beginning of the run. (We'll leave the first mile out of it -- the first mile can be weird; but once you've settled in, you should feel great.) You should be celebrating getting off the bike, and feeling like you could run much much faster, and you could, but you're smart and you don't.

Right on & Amen about the going just a little too fast on the bike & 250 calories an hour sounds pretty lean for a guy. 1/2 mph and 50 calories / hour can make all the difference. How was your sleep the week before? And your nutrition for the week before?

You should feel awesome starting the run and need to start so it feels way too slow. And even if you had to walk, could you regroup and start running after a mile?
2013-08-30 10:21 PM
in reply to: DV 1

User image

Veteran
187
100252525
Boulder, Colorado
Subject: RE: 2.4 miles - done, 112 miles - done, 14 miles and then ...wtf???
Definitely the mind. You could have kept running the same pace through the finish. If fitness is good, nutrition is good, and you have not overheated the body will not quit.
2013-08-31 3:04 AM
in reply to: DV 1

User image

Veteran
535
50025
Melbourne
Subject: RE: 2.4 miles - done, 112 miles - done, 14 miles and then ...wtf???
Funny how that happens, right? About the same thing happened to me during my first. Was it your first? How was your training (MPW) and how long did you spend building your base?

My second one I was confident I could do the distance...just a matter of ow fast. I wasn't going to let ,yield quit like I did in the first one. In fact, I told my wife at the finish line I'm doing A second and she called me crazy. Anyways, sounds like a combination of fitness and mental. No one said IMs were easy.

Keep your head up, sign up for another one next year and use this as a learning experience.
New Thread
General Discussion Triathlon Talk » 2.4 miles - done, 112 miles - done, 14 miles and then ...wtf??? Rss Feed  
RELATED POSTS

Advice for my first 112 mile bike race

Started by diane.b
Views: 1470 Posts: 9

2013-01-06 10:50 AM diane.b

Next time you complain about riding 112 miles (olympic story inside)

Started by FELTGood
Views: 1613 Posts: 16

2012-07-26 11:32 PM ayabrea

Beer Miles, Soda Miles, RUBIKS CUBE MILES...

Started by faded_memories
Views: 439 Posts: 3

2011-04-02 9:14 PM faded_memories

Vacationing in VA Beach need 112 mile bike route please

Started by chevy57
Views: 515 Posts: 5

2010-07-20 11:42 AM wbayek

swim 2.4 miles or not to swim 2.4 miles Pages: 1 2

Started by chirunner134
Views: 1252 Posts: 38

2006-12-11 8:05 AM chirunner134
RELATED ARTICLES
date : April 28, 2011
author : fivecents
comments : 5
What my first sprint distance triathlon taught me about myself.
 
date : April 14, 2011
author : Troy Jacobson
comments : 0
What is the difference between a recovery ride and junk miles?
date : December 24, 2008
author : Coach AJ
comments : 0
Discussions on indoor cycling drills such as one legged drills and power intervals. Also we discuss how many half Ironman races should be done before your first full Ironman.
 
date : September 15, 2008
author : lcthomas74
comments : 0
Soon after I got married, I decided I needed to get motivated to work out and focus on getting back into shape. I could barely jog a quarter-mile without needing a walk break.
date : September 4, 2008
author : Coach AJ
comments : 0
Coach AJ reviews the Reynolds SDV 66 Racing Wheel and the PowerTap 2.4 SL Wireless Power Meter.
 
date : August 17, 2007
author : scoli121
comments : 6
I quickly browsed an article in Men's Health that talked about doing a triathlon, and how it wasn't really that hard. With a "tsk!" I quickly turned the page while thinking, "Yeah, right!"
date : April 2, 2006
author : a.maria
comments : 0
I think quite truly for the first time I 'get it'. It's not just about the fitness. It's not just about the great little endorphin rush as you hit 5, 10, 15 miles...its not just the medal at the end.
 
date : May 3, 2005
author : Rich Strauss
comments : 5
The 112/4 Race Rehearsal Brick. If done correctly, the RR is usually no more stressful than a regular training ride, and that is probably the point.