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2013-09-24 1:13 PM

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Subject: CrossFit's Dirty Little Secret


2013-09-24 1:17 PM
in reply to: lisac957

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Subject: RE: CrossFit's Dirty Little Secret
First!

2013-09-24 1:22 PM
in reply to: lisac957

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Subject: RE: CrossFit's Dirty Little Secret

Woah. Rhabdo is no joke. That's messed up.

I want to hear what Comet and Teejay say though...I can't believe rhabdo is joked about at Crossfit. 

2013-09-24 1:24 PM
in reply to: Goosedog

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Subject: RE: CrossFit's Dirty Little Secret

Originally posted by Goosedog First!

Pure win.

2013-09-24 1:35 PM
in reply to: switch

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Subject: RE: CrossFit's Dirty Little Secret

"No, peeing during a workout is not alright. Ever."

Guess that settles the peeing in the pool debate, eh?

2013-09-24 1:38 PM
in reply to: switch

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Subject: RE: CrossFit's Dirty Little Secret

I think this paragraph was interesting:

"CrossFitters, largely unaware of the rhabdo risk, will continue to charge ahead, pressured and happily coerced into exercising to depletion and exhaustion. My prediction: in a few years, the peer-reviewed scientific literature will be ripe with articles about CrossFit and rhabdomyolysis. Health providers will be there to scoop up the pieces, but who is there to protect those people unknowingly at risk?"

Like with any new thing, it takes a while to determine the benefits and risks.  It's like Thalidomide - an extreme example of something that was supposed to be great until the side effects became apparent.  And, unlike new drugs, so many things in the world are not tested under any sort of protocol.

Scary.  Part of life?  Still scary.  I guess this is where one's own judgment prevails.



2013-09-24 1:38 PM
in reply to: ratherbeswimming

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Alpharetta, Georgia
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Subject: RE: CrossFit's Dirty Little Secret
Originally posted by ratherbeswimming

"No, peeing during a workout is not alright. Ever."

Guess that settles the peeing in the pool debate, eh?

But peeing on the bike is still cool, clearly. Cool

2013-09-24 1:46 PM
in reply to: ratherbeswimming

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Subject: RE: CrossFit's Dirty Little Secret
Originally posted by ratherbeswimming

"No, peeing during a workout is not alright. Ever."

Guess that settles the peeing in the pool debate, eh?

Well, not really.  You're not doing flip turns with double unders.

2013-09-24 1:50 PM
in reply to: lisac957

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Subject: RE: CrossFit's Dirty Little Secret
Originally posted by lisac957

Originally posted by ratherbeswimming

"No, peeing during a workout is not alright. Ever."

Guess that settles the peeing in the pool debate, eh?

But peeing on the bike is still cool, clearly. Cool




If the cyclist is averaging under 19mph, I don't think you can really call it a workout.

2013-09-24 1:52 PM
in reply to: lisac957

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Subject: RE: CrossFit's Dirty Little Secret
I've been doing Crossfit for about a month now, but this isn't the first time I've heard about Rhabdomyolysis and Crossfit. I remember reading about it a few years ago when Crossfit started to boom.

For me, Rhabdo is to Crossfit what Hypernatremia is to endurance sports. Which is to say that if you educate yourself about proper training/nutrition/hydration, and aren't completely clueless when it comes to listenting to your body and being realistic about your capabilities, you should be able to train safely without any fear of either of these conditions.

If however, you try to do too much too soon, don't follow the advice of a coach or educate yourself on proper training methods, and aren't aware enough of your body's signals, of course, you can do yourself real harm, whether it's either of these conditions, or hyperthermia, or a separated shoulder.

Again, I haven't been at Crossfit for very long, and every gym (I can't yet get myself to refer to Crossfit gym's as "boxes") and trainer is different, but my own experience has been that the classes are pretty small and the coaches are very attuned to members' limitations. I've yet to see anyone, myself included, being pushed past a point that seemed unsafe. When I was going through my introductory classes, nearly every movement we learned could be scaled down for people who weren't strong or athletic enough to do it as prescribed. Some people do squats with hundreds of pounds, some do it with an empty bar, and some with a piece of pvc pipe.

While it's easy to point to Rhabdo the Clown as evidence of an inherent meatheaded irresponsibility on the part of Crossfit, I see it as sort of an "inside joke" among Crossfitters, much in the same way that triathletes say stuff like "Death before DNF" and "HTFU", knowing full well that one should never risk serious injury just for the sake of finishing a race.

.
2013-09-24 2:06 PM
in reply to: lisac957

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Subject: RE: CrossFit's Dirty Little Secret
Originally posted by lisac957

Posting without comment but am interested in others!

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/eric-robertson/crossfit-rhabdomyolysis_b_3977598.html




In the past two months, 2 people I know have been diagnosed with rhabdo that started crossfit in the last year...did not even know what it was until 2 months ago...definately Crossfits dirty little secret...


2013-09-24 2:35 PM
in reply to: Gene67

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Subject: RE: CrossFit's Dirty Little Secret
yeah I think I will pass on cross fit. I will stick with my hyponatremia.
2013-09-24 2:58 PM
in reply to: jmk-brooklyn

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Subject: RE: CrossFit's Dirty Little Secret
Originally posted by jmk-brooklyn

While it's easy to point to Rhabdo the Clown as evidence of an inherent meatheaded irresponsibility on the part of Crossfit, I see it as sort of an "inside joke" among Crossfitters, much in the same way that triathletes say stuff like "Death before DNF" and "HTFU", knowing full well that one should never risk serious injury just for the sake of finishing a race.


Um. What?
2013-09-24 3:11 PM
in reply to: jmk-brooklyn

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Subject: RE: CrossFit's Dirty Little Secret
Originally posted by jmk-brooklyn


triathletes say stuff like "Death before DNF" and "HTFU", knowing full well that one should ALWAYS risk serious injury just for the sake of finishing a race. especially an Ironman



Fixed that, bro.

2013-09-24 3:28 PM
in reply to: 0

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Subject: RE: CrossFit's Dirty Little Secret

Originally posted by . While it's easy to point to Rhabdo the Clown as evidence of an inherent meatheaded irresponsibility on the part of Crossfit, I see it as sort of an "inside joke" among Crossfitters, much in the same way that triathletes say stuff like "Death before DNF" and "HTFU", knowing full well that one should never risk serious injury just for the sake of finishing a race. .

Pretty much everything Jonah said and it's not a "dirty secret." I find it's pretty well known. Might be different now that it's grown so much in the past 2 years, but I think most people know. Also, I've never seen anyone joke about it.

I also want to know what the point of starting the thread is without an opinion or comment? You're sure to get plenty of 'haters' on a triathlon website.

Yes, rhabdo happens. Did you also know it's common in the military too? I had many patients with it, in the ICU, while deployed especially. I've been doing CF since 2008 and have not had rhabdo. The one "injury" I had was ME being STUPID and the ONLY person to try an insane number of double-unders in a workout, I pulled my calf muscle. Again, ME being stupid. Like it was said before, that could have also happened in a track workout for someone trying to go for a PR 4-800 time, or mile.

People should know their bodies. They should know what is pushing "healthy" and what is being stupid. CrossFit is meant to scale. Everyone can do it. Not everyone is smart about it and unfortunately, not every coach or gym is good. But many are.

Sidenote:  I've seen the "crossfit zealot" and other negative comments about CF on this forum. There is no need. People do what they enjoy and it's not hurting others. But, I guess I could go to my CF forums and start making fun of triathletes.



Edited by Comet 2013-09-24 3:43 PM
2013-09-24 3:40 PM
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Edited by Teejaay 2013-09-24 3:41 PM


2013-09-24 3:44 PM
in reply to: Comet

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Subject: RE: CrossFit's Dirty Little Secret

Meh, just like any activity, If you go to extremes, it can be dangerous.

I don't think it would ever  happen to me because I think I would know when to quit.  Just like I know when to call it a day on a long run if I'm not feeling right.  Not to say I'm a "quitter" since I have several long courses under my belt.  Plus, even though I'm competitive, I'm happy to defer to someone faster or stronger than me and wouldn't feel the need to keep up like the girl in the story.  Being pushed is one thing, being pushed past reason and to stupid levels is another.

I looked into crossfit and assumed that it would be encouraging, not bootcamp.  If I felt pressured or humiliated into doing more than I can, I would be telling someone off and I can educate them in the art of Jiu Jitsu.  Maybe it's not for me if it's pressure instead of encouragement.

I have had MTB friends or snowboard friends bomb down runs I know I can't handle.  Yeah, I may get teased, but I also stay in one piece by not doing anything I KNOW I'm not prepared for.  I push myself within my own limits and know when to back off.

2013-09-24 4:27 PM
in reply to: lisac957

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Subject: RE: CrossFit's Dirty Little Secret

I'm not a fan of CF, but not because of concerns over Rhabdo.  Like others have said, there's risk in any sport, and that risk can be magnified if you take things to extremes and don't use good judgement.

My issues with CF are from the perspective of a fitness professional: The outrageous cost of their credentials relative to the amount of training received ($1,000 for the Level 1 for only a two day course that isn't anywhere near the equivalent of complete personal trainer certifications that provide much more extensive education for similar cost), and the tendency of participants and occasionally CF's marketing, to imply or claim outright that CF is better training that sport-specific training for other sports.  IMO, the later contributes to the mis-education of the general public regarding health, fitness, and athletic theory and application that I encounter daily.

Take away those two issues, and the HIIT at it's core can be a fun and effective way to gain and maintain general fitness.

2013-09-24 4:27 PM
in reply to: Kido

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Subject: RE: CrossFit's Dirty Little Secret

I see it as the same in any sport - there are risks and you should be aware of them, as you should be aware of your own abilities and/or limitations. Depending on the sport, there are inherent risks involved - and as soon as you start to partake in that sport, you voluntarily accept that those risks exist.  I guess even darts (though I don't consider darts a sport, more of a game IMO) has the risk of getting a dart in the eye or something. 

I'm also getting really tired of this whole perceived crap of all tri people thinking that Crossfit people are in someway less than, or douchier, or elitist, or whatever.  There are idiots in EVERY sport.  Hell, just go over to one of the running forums and they're calling all triathletes slow dbags that have no business even calling themselves athletes.  Or tell and English person that they have no idea what football is. 

I don't care if you do crossfit, or if you're a triathlete, or if you've decided to take up scuba diving.  Do what you enjoy, why is that so hard? 

2013-09-24 4:40 PM
in reply to: Teejaay

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Subject: RE: CrossFit's Dirty Little Secret
Originally posted by Teejaay

It's not joked about by everyone.


There's nothing funny about crossfit. Except maybe clean snatches and jerks.
2013-09-24 5:08 PM
in reply to: mr2tony

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2013-09-24 5:09 PM
in reply to: TriMyBest

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Subject: RE: CrossFit's Dirty Little Secret
Originally posted by TriMyBest

I'm not a fan of CF, but not because of concerns over Rhabdo.  Like others have said, there's risk in any sport, and that risk can be magnified if you take things to extremes and don't use good judgement.

My issues with CF are from the perspective of a fitness professional: The outrageous cost of their credentials relative to the amount of training received ($1,000 for the Level 1 for only a two day course that isn't anywhere near the equivalent of complete personal trainer certifications that provide much more extensive education for similar cost), and the tendency of participants and occasionally CF's marketing, to imply or claim outright that CF is better training that sport-specific training for other sports.  IMO, the later contributes to the mis-education of the general public regarding health, fitness, and athletic theory and application that I encounter daily.

Take away those two issues, and the HIIT at it's core can be a fun and effective way to gain and maintain general fitness.


I'm not disagreeing with you about anything you wrote. It's all true. This is where it's on the person to find an appropriate gym, and coaches, for them. I value those who DO have other training certifications, not just CF. And those with experience in other sports.

However, I will add that it's not that dissimilar than a USAT coaching license, no? 2 day seminar. Test at the end. Bam, you're a 'coach.'

2013-09-24 6:06 PM
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Edited by Teejaay 2013-09-24 6:07 PM
2013-09-24 6:07 PM
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Subject: RE: CrossFit's Dirty Little Secret
Originally posted by Comet
Originally posted by TriMyBest

I'm not a fan of CF, but not because of concerns over Rhabdo.  Like others have said, there's risk in any sport, and that risk can be magnified if you take things to extremes and don't use good judgement.

My issues with CF are from the perspective of a fitness professional: The outrageous cost of their credentials relative to the amount of training received ($1,000 for the Level 1 for only a two day course that isn't anywhere near the equivalent of complete personal trainer certifications that provide much more extensive education for similar cost), and the tendency of participants and occasionally CF's marketing, to imply or claim outright that CF is better training that sport-specific training for other sports.  IMO, the later contributes to the mis-education of the general public regarding health, fitness, and athletic theory and application that I encounter daily.

Take away those two issues, and the HIIT at it's core can be a fun and effective way to gain and maintain general fitness.


I'm not disagreeing with you about anything you wrote. It's all true. This is where it's on the person to find an appropriate gym, and coaches, for them. I value those who DO have other training certifications, not just CF. And those with experience in other sports.

However, I will add that it's not that dissimilar than a USAT coaching license, no? 2 day seminar. Test at the end. Bam, you're a 'coach.'


I wasn't criticizing what is covered in the two day CF clinic.  I was criticizing the cost.  The USAT Level 1 cert clinic is currently $555 - only slightly more than 1/2 of the CF 2 day clinic.  I compared it to personal trainer certs because the cost is similar, and that's for reputable ones like my NSCA-CPT that requires passing a very difficult exam on all the material included in a 650 page text book in a testing center, not online.  One and two day clinics can't begin to cover the topics necessary to qualify someone to be a personal trainer, but there's nothing wrong with attending them to add credentials such as CF or my TRX credential.  Again, my issue with CF is they are outrageously over-priced relative to similar 2 day clinics.

If you go to a CF gym, and the CF credential is their only qualification, leave.  Don't risk training with someone without an actual reputable trainer cert, preferably NSCA, NASM, ACE, ISSA, or ACSM.

BTW, a USAT Level 1 cert doesn't "make you a coach".  IMO, it's just one of the many possible steps in the education process for anyone who takes their coaching profession seriously.  In fact, I've always viewed a USAT Level 1 cert as the coaching equivalent of someone working toward becoming a doctor who has completed their MCAT and been accepted to med school.  Earn a Level 2 cert, then you're "in residency".

 

 

 




Edited by TriMyBest 2013-09-24 6:09 PM
2013-09-24 6:12 PM
in reply to: Teejaay

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Subject: RE: CrossFit's Dirty Little Secret

Originally posted by Teejaay 


How many athletes continue a race when they are dehydrated?  Crap their pants? Feel lightheaded?  Crashed their bike and hit their head?  Fractured or broke a bone? Then they keep on going ... There is risk in any sport.

Wow, how did I miss that race report?  And they probably still were faster than me...

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