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2013-10-16 11:58 AM

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Subject: Just signed up for my first HIM

Only been training about 4 months. Did 1st Sprint last month. Was going to start thinking about an Oly and decided I needed a bigger challenge. Race is next March, so I have almost exactly 23 weeks to prepare, which theoretically is enough time. I need some positive reinforcement guys and gals! Warnings, tips, advice, personal stories will all help too. Just don't tell me what I should have done or that it's too early, because I'm already signed up and its happening!

Help!!!!!

Training plan. Going with Training Peaks because I know it, it helped prepare me for my Sprint and I can't afford any curveballs as far as that goes. I have a swim coach and maybe due to that swimming is my strongest leg, followed by bike, followed by run. Had some IT band issues so have been working on those and will be getting from help from a local Alter G on that. Have not decided on TT or road bike. Rode my road bike for the sprint but I have both. Will need a wetsuit... have to get time in the pool with that on.

Anything else you can think of, throw it at me. I feel like I took a big bite but I also work better like this.

Thanks!



2013-10-16 12:04 PM
in reply to: AZ_Tri

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Subject: RE: Just signed up for my first HIM
Which HIM are you doing in March? I did my first last March at IM California 70.3 (Oceanside) which was also my first triathlon.
2013-10-16 12:09 PM
in reply to: devilfan02

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Subject: RE: Just signed up for my first HIM

Oceanside!

2013-10-16 12:17 PM
in reply to: devilfan02

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Subject: RE: Just signed up for my first HIM

Originally posted by devilfan02 Which HIM are you doing in March? I did my first last March at IM California 70.3 (Oceanside) which was also my first triathlon.

Perfect. Tell me more. We live in the same general area too, can you suggest some good places to ride?

2013-10-16 12:30 PM
in reply to: AZ_Tri

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Subject: RE: Just signed up for my first HIM
Originally posted by AZ_Tri

Oceanside!




It's a great race and you'll really enjoy it. It's an easy swim if there's no swell in the harbor. I have some tips for that particular swim course that I can share for you later. The bike course is what makes this race. It's a demanding course that you have to approach correctly or else your run will be a nightmare. Go out easy the first 30 miles, which are flat, then hang in there from miles 30-48. Mile 30 is an incredibly difficult hill that you have to climb. You'll see several people walking up it and the Marines have named it "Mount MF'er." There's another long climb at around mile 45 I think that can hurt too. Run is great and along the ocean. Make sure to wear a hat and sunglasses though because there's very little shade
2013-10-16 12:47 PM
in reply to: devilfan02

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Subject: RE: Just signed up for my first HIM

Originally posted by devilfan02
Originally posted by AZ_Tri

Oceanside!

It's a great race and you'll really enjoy it. It's an easy swim if there's no swell in the harbor. I have some tips for that particular swim course that I can share for you later. The bike course is what makes this race. It's a demanding course that you have to approach correctly or else your run will be a nightmare. Go out easy the first 30 miles, which are flat, then hang in there from miles 30-48. Mile 30 is an incredibly difficult hill that you have to climb. You'll see several people walking up it and the Marines have named it "Mount MF'er." There's another long climb at around mile 45 I think that can hurt too. Run is great and along the ocean. Make sure to wear a hat and sunglasses though because there's very little shade

"Mount MF'er". Sounds intriguing.

Thanks for the race specific info.



2013-10-16 3:23 PM
in reply to: AZ_Tri

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Subject: RE: Just signed up for my first HIM
Good luck! Here are nutrition tips based on my recent experiences. First, you need to realize that the shorter races don't have real nutritional requirements, but at the HIM and higher, a cavalier attitude toward nutrition means bonking.

Tips:
1. Have a gel or other carb before getting into the water. Practice this in training.
2. Have a gel or carb at T1. The 5 seconds you lose doing this is well worth the minutes you'll gain later. Practice this in training.
3. Plan your carbs on the bike. Everyone has their favorite - mine are fingerling red potatoes boiled, peeled (to remove fiber) and ** heavily ** salted. In fact, putting them in a baggy with excess salt the day or two before, and they will absorb all the salt. You'll puke them if you eat them outside of heavy training, but during effort they actually taste great because your body is craving salt. I also use Honey Stinger wafers and energy bars (not protein bars), and Ironman Perform/Recover mix. No water on the bike, except to hose yourself off from the heat. Practice this in training.
4. At some point you need to stop eating. I usually stop around mile 40 on an HIM or regular 60 mile bike ride. Otherwise your stomach will not be in good shape to take on liquids in the run.
5. There's no such thing as rationing liquids on the bike. You really can't drink enough if you're using the aid stations. Start with two bottles. Aim to pick up a bottle at each of the at least 2 aid stations. Also pickup a water if its hot and pour it over yourself. Ok to toss garbage in sight of the aid station without penalty.
5. On the run, pick up half a banana and some water at that first aid station. Then get a little liquid in at each aid station (not a lot). You don't want to slosh but you want to keep it coming in small quantities. Cola is good toward the end, but not too soon. Walk the aid station if necessary to get it in. The few seconds lost on a short walk can pay dividends over spilling precious liquid or choking on it.
2013-10-16 3:58 PM
in reply to: FranzZemen

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Subject: RE: Just signed up for my first HIM

Originally posted by FranzZemen Good luck! Here are nutrition tips based on my recent experiences. First, you need to realize that the shorter races don't have real nutritional requirements, but at the HIM and higher, a cavalier attitude toward nutrition means bonking. Tips: 1. Have a gel or other carb before getting into the water. Practice this in training. 2. Have a gel or carb at T1. The 5 seconds you lose doing this is well worth the minutes you'll gain later. Practice this in training. 3. Plan your carbs on the bike. Everyone has their favorite - mine are fingerling red potatoes boiled, peeled (to remove fiber) and ** heavily ** salted. In fact, putting them in a baggy with excess salt the day or two before, and they will absorb all the salt. You'll puke them if you eat them outside of heavy training, but during effort they actually taste great because your body is craving salt. I also use Honey Stinger wafers and energy bars (not protein bars), and Ironman Perform/Recover mix. No water on the bike, except to hose yourself off from the heat. Practice this in training. 4. At some point you need to stop eating. I usually stop around mile 40 on an HIM or regular 60 mile bike ride. Otherwise your stomach will not be in good shape to take on liquids in the run. 5. There's no such thing as rationing liquids on the bike. You really can't drink enough if you're using the aid stations. Start with two bottles. Aim to pick up a bottle at each of the at least 2 aid stations. Also pickup a water if its hot and pour it over yourself. Ok to toss garbage in sight of the aid station without penalty. 5. On the run, pick up half a banana and some water at that first aid station. Then get a little liquid in at each aid station (not a lot). You don't want to slosh but you want to keep it coming in small quantities. Cola is good toward the end, but not too soon. Walk the aid station if necessary to get it in. The few seconds lost on a short walk can pay dividends over spilling precious liquid or choking on it.

Thank you for the nute tips. Quick question. You said no water on the bike except to hose myself off from the heat, then later say to drink plenty on the bike. I'm sure its the latter but just wondering about the "no water" comment. Thanks.

Also, I never drink caffeine. Should I start training with it or rely on carbs only? I can tolerate it, I just don't use it at all now.

2013-10-16 4:12 PM
in reply to: AZ_Tri

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Subject: RE: Just signed up for my first HIM
you want to eat and hydrate every 30-40 mins on the bike.

what you do in training is pretty much what you will do in the race.
during training, you should work out what fluids and foods work best for you, and stick to that for the race.
2013-10-16 9:45 PM
in reply to: metafizx

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Subject: RE: Just signed up for my first HIM

Originally posted by metafizx you want to eat and hydrate every 30-40 mins on the bike. what you do in training is pretty much what you will do in the race. during training, you should work out what fluids and foods work best for you, and stick to that for the race.

Thank you. All the comments about nutrition lead me to believe that my training had better be dialed in.

2013-10-17 12:02 AM
in reply to: AZ_Tri

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Subject: RE: Just signed up for my first HIM
Originally posted by AZ_Tri

Originally posted by metafizx you want to eat and hydrate every 30-40 mins on the bike. what you do in training is pretty much what you will do in the race. during training, you should work out what fluids and foods work best for you, and stick to that for the race.

Thank you. All the comments about nutrition lead me to believe that my training had better be dialed in.




yes, you can get through a sprint or oly with basically very little, and survive fine, but in a 70.3 ...it's a different animal, and what you do on the bike will come back on the run...good or bad.

hydration and nutrition are key on the bike, which can vary due to environment and your body requirements. getting it right in training will help you to have a successful race.


2013-10-17 10:19 AM
in reply to: AZ_Tri

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Subject: RE: Just signed up for my first HIM
Originally posted by AZ_Tri

Originally posted by FranzZemen Good luck! Here are nutrition tips based on my recent experiences. First, you need to realize that the shorter races don't have real nutritional requirements, but at the HIM and higher, a cavalier attitude toward nutrition means bonking. Tips: 1. Have a gel or other carb before getting into the water. Practice this in training. 2. Have a gel or carb at T1. The 5 seconds you lose doing this is well worth the minutes you'll gain later. Practice this in training. 3. Plan your carbs on the bike. Everyone has their favorite - mine are fingerling red potatoes boiled, peeled (to remove fiber) and ** heavily ** salted. In fact, putting them in a baggy with excess salt the day or two before, and they will absorb all the salt. You'll puke them if you eat them outside of heavy training, but during effort they actually taste great because your body is craving salt. I also use Honey Stinger wafers and energy bars (not protein bars), and Ironman Perform/Recover mix. No water on the bike, except to hose yourself off from the heat. Practice this in training. 4. At some point you need to stop eating. I usually stop around mile 40 on an HIM or regular 60 mile bike ride. Otherwise your stomach will not be in good shape to take on liquids in the run. 5. There's no such thing as rationing liquids on the bike. You really can't drink enough if you're using the aid stations. Start with two bottles. Aim to pick up a bottle at each of the at least 2 aid stations. Also pickup a water if its hot and pour it over yourself. Ok to toss garbage in sight of the aid station without penalty. 5. On the run, pick up half a banana and some water at that first aid station. Then get a little liquid in at each aid station (not a lot). You don't want to slosh but you want to keep it coming in small quantities. Cola is good toward the end, but not too soon. Walk the aid station if necessary to get it in. The few seconds lost on a short walk can pay dividends over spilling precious liquid or choking on it.

Thank you for the nute tips. Quick question. You said no water on the bike except to hose myself off from the heat, then later say to drink plenty on the bike. I'm sure its the latter but just wondering about the "no water" comment. Thanks.

Also, I never drink caffeine. Should I start training with it or rely on carbs only? I can tolerate it, I just don't use it at all now.




My view on water is that it fills you up and gives you little benefit. It is however the least disturbing to the stomach, so it's what I go to for thirst on the run (unless I'm taking in calories as opposed to thirst), or any time I have stomach issues and need to get liquids in. Too much of anything in the stomach including water during exercise can cause the GI to shut down. Also, too much concentrated sugars in liquid can do the same. This seems counter to the point of not taking water, but a well balanced drink such as Perform should be fine. All of this should be tested in training.

On caffeine, I recently read an Ironman article that suggests tapering off caffeine before competition, so that caffeine sensitivity is high and to begin taking it late in the run. Personally, I have a no-milk coffee 3 hours before competition, and I have Honey Stinger gels that contain 30 mg of caffeine (no coffee taste) which I take on the bike (but also take a non-caffeinated version - not suggesting to pump 30 mg in every 5 to 10 miles). If you are not use to it you should be aware that it can make you "go" so you need to test in training how it affects you.
2013-10-17 1:56 PM
in reply to: FranzZemen

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Subject: RE: Just signed up for my first HIM
Originally posted by FranzZemen



My view on water is that it fills you up and gives you little benefit. It is however the least disturbing to the stomach, so it's what I go to for thirst on the run (unless I'm taking in calories as opposed to thirst), or any time I have stomach issues and need to get liquids in. Too much of anything in the stomach including water during exercise can cause the GI to shut down. Also, too much concentrated sugars in liquid can do the same. This seems counter to the point of not taking water, but a well balanced drink such as Perform should be fine. All of this should be tested in training.



I highly counter your comment about water giving you "little benefit".

I would say that water is highly essential to your hydration plan. You have to be careful not to over hydrate, and watch your electrolytes...but do not skimp on water. This includes adding Heed or Gatorade, etc which is calories and electrolytes.

2013-10-18 1:43 PM
in reply to: metafizx

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Subject: RE: Just signed up for my first HIM
Originally posted by metafizx

Originally posted by FranzZemen



My view on water is that it fills you up and gives you little benefit. It is however the least disturbing to the stomach, so it's what I go to for thirst on the run (unless I'm taking in calories as opposed to thirst), or any time I have stomach issues and need to get liquids in. Too much of anything in the stomach including water during exercise can cause the GI to shut down. Also, too much concentrated sugars in liquid can do the same. This seems counter to the point of not taking water, but a well balanced drink such as Perform should be fine. All of this should be tested in training.



I highly counter your comment about water giving you "little benefit".

I would say that water is highly essential to your hydration plan. You have to be careful not to over hydrate, and watch your electrolytes...but do not skimp on water. This includes adding Heed or Gatorade, etc which is calories and electrolytes.




Not sure what you're saying. Heed or Gatorade is not water. But think I know what you're trying to say.

Whatever you do, practice it over training, and over the Ironman distances, that nutrition training should include long distances, so you'll know what works. Nothing like a weekly century ride to tell you that. When you're constantly downing liquids and need calories too, you have to decide if you're going to take pure water and supplement the rest with solids gels, or get some extra by using Perform. If you've done those distances, you know that tradeoff very well.

2013-10-18 4:32 PM
in reply to: AZ_Tri

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Subject: RE: Just signed up for my first HIM

Thanks for everyone who has replied so far. As far as I'm concerned right now the more info the better for me. I'm very much a believer in not changing anything when its go time, so I will try various things in training and once dialed in will not change it.

One disadvantage I'll have is lack of experience with the aid stations. I did not use any on the bike portion of my sprint. No real way to train that I guess.

My TP program starts next Monday.

Thanks everyone. And again, the more the merrier. I know a lot of people are gearing up for Soma and IMAZ so good luck if you are one of them.

2013-10-18 4:52 PM
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Subject: RE: Just signed up for my first HIM
Originally posted by AZ_Tri

Thanks for everyone who has replied so far. As far as I'm concerned right now the more info the better for me. I'm very much a believer in not changing anything when its go time, so I will try various things in training and once dialed in will not change it.

One disadvantage I'll have is lack of experience with the aid stations. I did not use any on the bike portion of my sprint. No real way to train that I guess.

My TP program starts next Monday.

Thanks everyone. And again, the more the merrier. I know a lot of people are gearing up for Soma and IMAZ so good luck if you are one of them.




Aid stations aren't that hard. Just make sure you toss the bottle you want replaced out in sight of the aid station, be aware which side the bottles will be presented on and go whatever safe speed you feel you can to grab the bottle. The volunteers are usually well trained to make them grabbable.

If congested, its ok to come to a full stop to get a bottle. Just make sure you announce it and do what you can to get out of the way so anyone following can avoid you.

Edited by FranzZemen 2013-10-18 4:53 PM


2013-10-18 5:02 PM
in reply to: AZ_Tri

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Subject: RE: Just signed up for my first HIM
Originally posted by AZ_Tri

Thanks for everyone who has replied so far. As far as I'm concerned right now the more info the better for me. I'm very much a believer in not changing anything when its go time, so I will try various things in training and once dialed in will not change it.

One disadvantage I'll have is lack of experience with the aid stations. I did not use any on the bike portion of my sprint. No real way to train that I guess.

My TP program starts next Monday.

Thanks everyone. And again, the more the merrier. I know a lot of people are gearing up for Soma and IMAZ so good luck if you are one of them.




Oceanside was my first tri and I had the same concern. Got finished and realized that the aid stations were a complete non-factor. IM really makes them that seamless. Just make sure to slow down so the bottle hand-off is easy for the volunteers. Also, ditch any trash in this area.

I'm one of the AZ guys doing SOMA and IMAZ. Can't believe it's already here... You should go out to either race and hang out at a bike aid station. You'll see a bit of everything...
2013-10-19 8:19 AM
in reply to: devilfan02

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Subject: RE: Just signed up for my first HIM
Mentioned above was having a gu in T1. For me, personally, my stomach can't take anything in after a HIM swim for about 15 minutes or so. I try to make sure to get something in starting about that long into the bike.

I think I got my fueling down finally in my last race. Key is to make it simple and follow your plan. I get to a point on the bike where I don't want anymore fuel. But, I know I need it, so forced myself to have that last gu and shot blocks.

As you noted, key is to try it out in training.
2013-10-22 11:59 AM
in reply to: AZ_Tri


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Subject: RE: Just signed up for my first HIM
Congrats! Half of the battle is won. I'm actually contemplating signing up for my first too, I just haven't made the complete commitment yet!
2013-10-22 2:41 PM
in reply to: AZ_Tri

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Subject: RE: Just signed up for my first HIM

I had several reason for going HIM instead of OLY. Although it's clear that having an upcoming race, even if it's 6 months away, helps me focus and stay on track tremendously.

1. 6 months is too much prep time for an OLY I want to race as soon as the season starts so I can map out the rest of my year

2. I had several people whom I trust tell me it is plenty of time to prepare. Although not everybody shares that opinion

3. I do well when I'm pushed. I should probably learn to do well all the time but until then I'll keep pushing

4. My ultimate goal is Kona (I know, I know) and I want to see how I respond to this distance

5. I want to push my fitness and get into the best shape of my life

6. I like the charity that Ironman is supporting in this race

I went with Joe Friel's Half Ironman base period for 12 weeks and will follow up with his build for 11 weeks. Was a bit pricey but I don't like to gamble when going into unknown territory. Day 1 was yesterday. Meeting with my nutritionist (who is an Ironman finisher, as is my swim coach) about fueling during training next week. Will meet with her again later as I progress and nail down a race day nute plan. Immediate goal is regain some lost fitness as I've been kind of lazy over the last 3 weeks and nursing some IT band/knee issues. Concurrent goal is drop as much weight as is safely possible. When I used to compete in kickboxing I weighed 178 or below and I'm tipping the scales at close to 2 bills now although some is muscle. Would like to be sub 180 on race day, so need to drop about a pound per week on average.

After posting this I'll look to see if there's a Diary area on the forum so I don't clog up the Training page.

Thanks again for any and all posts related to HIM training, strategy, pitfalls to avoid, hard lessons learned, warnings and encouragement.

 

2013-10-22 5:07 PM
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Subject: RE: Just signed up for my first HIM

Oceanside is a great first half.

As above, train hills.  Get as light as you can.  Select the proper gearing.  Don't overbike the first 30 miles.  There are three climbs, each progressively longer, but less steep as you go along.  First is steepest but you can see the top.  Just get to the top.  Worst part for me is the section between the first big descent and the second climb.  It is a long false flat with rollers, and it always demoralized me until I learned to just accept it.

Following the third climb it's hammer time to the right turn into the wind.  Get a good fit, if you can still be in aero in this section, you will have a leg up on a lot of racers that are now sitting up just trying to finish but acting like sails in the wind.

Run is flat.  ish.  No real climbs to speak of, but there are rollers and you need to know how to handle them

Search the oceanside 70.3 2013 thread, I think I posted a youtube in there of someone that drove the (unrideable) back side of the course.  Or search youtube for it.  It will help visualize it



Edited by ChrisM 2013-10-22 5:08 PM


2013-10-22 6:47 PM
in reply to: ChrisM

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Subject: RE: Just signed up for my first HIM
^ Also, Chris gave a great swim tip that I used at this years race. Cut the course as far to the right on the return leg as possible. Everyone stays on the buoy line which adds yardage to the course. Just stay way to the right, just inside the "lifeguards" on the stand up paddle boards. Based on my past HIM swim times, this saved me about two minutes.
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