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2013-11-05 3:50 PM
in reply to: Left Brain

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Subject: RE: Qualified...Very Excited but have questions....
Originally posted by Left Brain

Originally posted by TriBoilermaker
Originally posted by Left Brain

Originally posted by TriBoilermaker
Originally posted by Left Brain

Originally posted by TriBoilermaker
Originally posted by crowny2

Originally posted by TriBoilermaker
Originally posted by Left Brain

Originally posted by TriBoilermaker
Originally posted by Left Brain

Originally posted by fisherman76 I'm sure this has been covered ad nauseum in ST, but I'm getting lost in something here. 1) USAT asks hundreds of athletes to represent the USA at their own cost at the world competition. 2) USAT collects fees from everyone in the US for every race. I'll give you that a portion of that is to cover the insurance bill, but nowhere near all of it. 3) USAT has not honored the blue sky clause of their charter to expose the financials to all USAT members on request 4) USAT's elections put the future of the blue sky clause in jeopardy. You would *think* USAT would foot the bill for their team with funds collected from their operations. For what other purpose would the phrase " USA Triathlon provides leadership and support to elite athletes competing at international events" be put forth on their website? What support are they offering if it isn't financial? USAT is a money pit, and I've come to suspect a corrupt one. Screw that, if you want to compete in a triathlon somewhere else in the world, sign up. Who needs an invitation, or worse yet, a required uniform? How USAT is "growing" the sport by this shenanigan is beyond me.

For the most part, AG athletes going to World AG Championships are not elite athletes.  A few of them will reach that status.....but for the overwhelming majority, no.  In my experience with USAT at the Youth/Jr. elite level they are doing a good job of getting the U.S. up to world standards in Olympic (draft legtal) format racing. Building a program from grass roots takes time.....and money. (which we provied with our memberships)  In the very near future they will also be a major funding entity for Elite Triathlon Academy's that are well into the planning stages.  Corrupt?  No way....I have personally met with a number of people in their upper management tier and they are dedicated people, working on a mission.  Not as up front with their membership about some of the things you mentioned?.....yeah, I think it's fair to say that.  Our memberships are funding USAT......and that means the developement of elite, international caliber triathletes.  Going to AG worlds is a great accomplishment.....but I don't see where USAT owes anybody a trip to an AG competition.

I don't think USAT owes anyone a free trip. However some help would be appropriate. USAT doesn't exist if it wasn't for the thousands of age-groupers that are forced to pay for either annual or 1 day memberships. There wouldn't be new training centers being built or help for young people with Olympic dreams if it weren't for those same age-groupers. On the USAT web site it says that the Vision of USAT is to provide the resources for all in the Triathlon community to reach their full potential. I think by all it should include something for the age-grouper. I honestly hadn't thought about the required membership much before reading through this thread. After looking at the USAT site more this morning, it is clear that the focus of USAT is on the young people and their development. That certainly isn't a bad thing. I just think that when a majority of your funding is coming from a certain group (in this case age-group athletes) you owe something back to them. I admit I'm coming into this late, so maybe I'm missing a lot. I will be open to that if someone has a different view point. To the OP, I hope you are able to go to China. It sounds like it would be a great experience.

USAT is the governing body for triathlon in the U.S.  I think it's fair to use USA swimming as an anology....because they have been at it longer and do an unbelievable job of developing talent for international competition.  We pay yearly membership fees of ~60.00 (I can't remember the exact amount sitting here).  That gives us the right to pay another $300.00 per month for our kids to swim on their club.....and to pay $10 - $15 dollars per event at their meets (usually 7 events per meet, plus relays).  As our kids move up the ladder they get to go to Sectionals, and the Jr. Nationals, and then Olympic trials....all, of course, if they are gifted, dedicated, and lucky.  We pay for every step of that.  We also pay for our kids to have a bigger stake in USA swimming.....swim at better facilities, better run meets, and better competition.  The money we spend keeps the machine running that churns out the best swimmers in the world.....I'm good with that.

Now look at USA triathlon.....who can only hope and dream to one day be as successful as USA swimming.  We pay a few bucks for dues.....and as we get better we pay for better races and better competition, and a bigger stake in the overall picture.  Yeah, it's expensive to race in the "National Championship" events, but it's also pretty cool to race really fast people......not elite racers, but fast.  If you are fast enough, you can race in the World Championships under your countries banner.  Yeah, it cost more, but you are now a bigger donor to a larger picture.....and for your money, you get to race the fastest age groupers in the world, on a great course, in a great venue (last year the actual Olympic course).  If you don't want to be a bigger donor to the bigger picture of elite triathlete developement, then don't pay, and don't go......leave the spot for someone else who wants to.

USA triathlon doesn't owe you anything until you get to the point where you are racing at the Elite International level......then they foot the bill, with money we all put in the pot.  I'm good with that.....it's how our country developes triathletes who can actually compete for gold in the Olympics.  We're not there yet.....but at least a program is coming together to acheive that goal.

Will the athletes that are going to these new training facilities "pay their own way" or will it be free for them to attend? I looked through the USAT web site quickly (so I might have missed it) but I didn't see any mention of the new training facilities you spoke of. I was interested in the funding of these and who would be going to them and what do they pay to attend. I'm not suggesting corruption. There have been many of those threads on ST. What I'm more interested in is what does the USAT do for the average age-group athlete that is required to pay a fee in order to be in a race. Besides insurance I don't know what else there is. If that's it then fine let's say that. If there is more, then what is that? This is going in a different direction then the OP intended so maybe it should be a different thread by itself!

Discounts on travel, gear, etc.

Fair enough. I did find the benefits section of the web site. Several things listed there. A lot of fluff, but some legitimate discounts. As I'm reading back through this, I realize my position appears to be against development of future Olympic hopefuls. That wasn't/isn't my intent. I was just trying to get clear what USAT's mission is and where the funding comes from. I probably haven't done a very good job of explaining that.

Actually, I think your postition is a common one among "triathletes".  Most don't understand, or care, that these organizations like USAT, USA swimming, USA cycling,  etc. are there to ensure that our country gets on the same playing field as the rest of the world in International competitions.  Triaithlon, for many, especially middle aged people, is such a self-centered sport that they don't stop to think about the bigger picture and what these organizations truly exist for....it becomes all about "what's in it for me?"

Thanks for categorizing me and most other "Triathletes". I have tried to explain my position and even said I wasn't against the developing of future Olympians. I guess someone can't ask some questions about where their money is going without being called self-centered. I thought it was a legitimate discussion topic and even thought about starting a new thread for it. You obviously have a dog in this hunt and I don't so I will let it go at that. I apologize to the OP for getting this off track.

Sorry.....I wasn't talking about anyone in particular....but I've been around triathlon for awhile, and I'll stand by my observations.  In the interest of a kinder/gentler LB I apologize if I hurt your feelings or otherwise offended you....only you know if the shoe fits.  It is absolutely a legitimate discussion topic from my point of view.....and I gave you a legitimate answer, even if you don't like it.  What are we talking about here...... $25.00 per year?  You asked what you get for your money.....I told you.

I couldn't care less about a kinder LB. I already said you have a dog in the hunt and I don't and I was letting it go.

I would have gladly let it go....but you don't get the last word when it's garbage.  I never called you self-centered....or anyone else.  I said that triathlon for middle-aged people is a self-centered sport, and it damn sure is. 


Look, about 4 posts ago I said that I probably hadn't explained my position very well and that I was not against the development of future Olympic athletes. For some reason you felt it was necessary to then give your opinion of what "most" triathletes are like and especially the middle aged ones. You obviously have a strong opinion of the importance of the U.S. developing Olympic Triathletes. I may or may not share that opinion but I'm willing to concede that it is important to you and others without making any judgements about that. I hope this can end the diversion from what the OP was originally asking and his desire to raise money to go to China.


2013-11-05 4:08 PM
in reply to: TriBoilermaker

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Subject: RE: Qualified...Very Excited but have questions....

Originally posted by TriBoilermaker
Originally posted by Left Brain

Originally posted by TriBoilermaker
Originally posted by Left Brain

Originally posted by TriBoilermaker
Originally posted by Left Brain

Originally posted by TriBoilermaker
Originally posted by crowny2

Originally posted by TriBoilermaker
Originally posted by Left Brain

Originally posted by TriBoilermaker
Originally posted by Left Brain

Originally posted by fisherman76 I'm sure this has been covered ad nauseum in ST, but I'm getting lost in something here. 1) USAT asks hundreds of athletes to represent the USA at their own cost at the world competition. 2) USAT collects fees from everyone in the US for every race. I'll give you that a portion of that is to cover the insurance bill, but nowhere near all of it. 3) USAT has not honored the blue sky clause of their charter to expose the financials to all USAT members on request 4) USAT's elections put the future of the blue sky clause in jeopardy. You would *think* USAT would foot the bill for their team with funds collected from their operations. For what other purpose would the phrase " USA Triathlon provides leadership and support to elite athletes competing at international events" be put forth on their website? What support are they offering if it isn't financial? USAT is a money pit, and I've come to suspect a corrupt one. Screw that, if you want to compete in a triathlon somewhere else in the world, sign up. Who needs an invitation, or worse yet, a required uniform? How USAT is "growing" the sport by this shenanigan is beyond me.

For the most part, AG athletes going to World AG Championships are not elite athletes.  A few of them will reach that status.....but for the overwhelming majority, no.  In my experience with USAT at the Youth/Jr. elite level they are doing a good job of getting the U.S. up to world standards in Olympic (draft legtal) format racing. Building a program from grass roots takes time.....and money. (which we provied with our memberships)  In the very near future they will also be a major funding entity for Elite Triathlon Academy's that are well into the planning stages.  Corrupt?  No way....I have personally met with a number of people in their upper management tier and they are dedicated people, working on a mission.  Not as up front with their membership about some of the things you mentioned?.....yeah, I think it's fair to say that.  Our memberships are funding USAT......and that means the developement of elite, international caliber triathletes.  Going to AG worlds is a great accomplishment.....but I don't see where USAT owes anybody a trip to an AG competition.

I don't think USAT owes anyone a free trip. However some help would be appropriate. USAT doesn't exist if it wasn't for the thousands of age-groupers that are forced to pay for either annual or 1 day memberships. There wouldn't be new training centers being built or help for young people with Olympic dreams if it weren't for those same age-groupers. On the USAT web site it says that the Vision of USAT is to provide the resources for all in the Triathlon community to reach their full potential. I think by all it should include something for the age-grouper. I honestly hadn't thought about the required membership much before reading through this thread. After looking at the USAT site more this morning, it is clear that the focus of USAT is on the young people and their development. That certainly isn't a bad thing. I just think that when a majority of your funding is coming from a certain group (in this case age-group athletes) you owe something back to them. I admit I'm coming into this late, so maybe I'm missing a lot. I will be open to that if someone has a different view point. To the OP, I hope you are able to go to China. It sounds like it would be a great experience.

USAT is the governing body for triathlon in the U.S.  I think it's fair to use USA swimming as an anology....because they have been at it longer and do an unbelievable job of developing talent for international competition.  We pay yearly membership fees of ~60.00 (I can't remember the exact amount sitting here).  That gives us the right to pay another $300.00 per month for our kids to swim on their club.....and to pay $10 - $15 dollars per event at their meets (usually 7 events per meet, plus relays).  As our kids move up the ladder they get to go to Sectionals, and the Jr. Nationals, and then Olympic trials....all, of course, if they are gifted, dedicated, and lucky.  We pay for every step of that.  We also pay for our kids to have a bigger stake in USA swimming.....swim at better facilities, better run meets, and better competition.  The money we spend keeps the machine running that churns out the best swimmers in the world.....I'm good with that.

Now look at USA triathlon.....who can only hope and dream to one day be as successful as USA swimming.  We pay a few bucks for dues.....and as we get better we pay for better races and better competition, and a bigger stake in the overall picture.  Yeah, it's expensive to race in the "National Championship" events, but it's also pretty cool to race really fast people......not elite racers, but fast.  If you are fast enough, you can race in the World Championships under your countries banner.  Yeah, it cost more, but you are now a bigger donor to a larger picture.....and for your money, you get to race the fastest age groupers in the world, on a great course, in a great venue (last year the actual Olympic course).  If you don't want to be a bigger donor to the bigger picture of elite triathlete developement, then don't pay, and don't go......leave the spot for someone else who wants to.

USA triathlon doesn't owe you anything until you get to the point where you are racing at the Elite International level......then they foot the bill, with money we all put in the pot.  I'm good with that.....it's how our country developes triathletes who can actually compete for gold in the Olympics.  We're not there yet.....but at least a program is coming together to acheive that goal.

Will the athletes that are going to these new training facilities "pay their own way" or will it be free for them to attend? I looked through the USAT web site quickly (so I might have missed it) but I didn't see any mention of the new training facilities you spoke of. I was interested in the funding of these and who would be going to them and what do they pay to attend. I'm not suggesting corruption. There have been many of those threads on ST. What I'm more interested in is what does the USAT do for the average age-group athlete that is required to pay a fee in order to be in a race. Besides insurance I don't know what else there is. If that's it then fine let's say that. If there is more, then what is that? This is going in a different direction then the OP intended so maybe it should be a different thread by itself!

Discounts on travel, gear, etc.

Fair enough. I did find the benefits section of the web site. Several things listed there. A lot of fluff, but some legitimate discounts. As I'm reading back through this, I realize my position appears to be against development of future Olympic hopefuls. That wasn't/isn't my intent. I was just trying to get clear what USAT's mission is and where the funding comes from. I probably haven't done a very good job of explaining that.

Actually, I think your postition is a common one among "triathletes".  Most don't understand, or care, that these organizations like USAT, USA swimming, USA cycling,  etc. are there to ensure that our country gets on the same playing field as the rest of the world in International competitions.  Triaithlon, for many, especially middle aged people, is such a self-centered sport that they don't stop to think about the bigger picture and what these organizations truly exist for....it becomes all about "what's in it for me?"

Thanks for categorizing me and most other "Triathletes". I have tried to explain my position and even said I wasn't against the developing of future Olympians. I guess someone can't ask some questions about where their money is going without being called self-centered. I thought it was a legitimate discussion topic and even thought about starting a new thread for it. You obviously have a dog in this hunt and I don't so I will let it go at that. I apologize to the OP for getting this off track.

Sorry.....I wasn't talking about anyone in particular....but I've been around triathlon for awhile, and I'll stand by my observations.  In the interest of a kinder/gentler LB I apologize if I hurt your feelings or otherwise offended you....only you know if the shoe fits.  It is absolutely a legitimate discussion topic from my point of view.....and I gave you a legitimate answer, even if you don't like it.  What are we talking about here...... $25.00 per year?  You asked what you get for your money.....I told you.

I couldn't care less about a kinder LB. I already said you have a dog in the hunt and I don't and I was letting it go.

I would have gladly let it go....but you don't get the last word when it's garbage.  I never called you self-centered....or anyone else.  I said that triathlon for middle-aged people is a self-centered sport, and it damn sure is. 

Look, about 4 posts ago I said that I probably hadn't explained my position very well and that I was not against the development of future Olympic athletes. For some reason you felt it was necessary to then give your opinion of what "most" triathletes are like and especially the middle aged ones. You obviously have a strong opinion of the importance of the U.S. developing Olympic Triathletes. I may or may not share that opinion but I'm willing to concede that it is important to you and others without making any judgements about that. I hope this can end the diversion from what the OP was originally asking and his desire to raise money to go to China.
\

Fair enough.....If the OP PM's me I'll donate $20.00 to his China adventure.

2013-11-05 4:18 PM
in reply to: strykergt

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Subject: RE: Qualified...Very Excited but have questions....
You are on your own. In addition to all the travel expenses, you will have to buy USAT approved racing gear - which will run you $250 to $500 depending on what you buy. That being said, I recommend the experience if you can swing it financially. I did Holland and Spain, but will most likely skip China and shoot for Sweden in 2015.
2013-11-05 7:44 PM
in reply to: TriGuy05

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Subject: RE: Qualified...Very Excited but have questions....
Originally posted by TriGuy05

So i did the Rev3 HIM in South Carolina a few weeks ago as I know a few others here did as well.  So it was the USAT Long Course National Championship Race and was a qualifying race for Team USA.  Top 20 of my age group qualify, I was fortunate enough to be #19.  I was very happy with the way the race went and was a HIM PR time for me.  So a couple days ago I received an email saying I have been chosen to help represent Team USA in the 2014 ITU World Championship in Weihi, China.  

So my question is for those who may have done this before.  I have read that they will not help financially with the registration of travel fees but are you able to get sponsors?  If so, how do you help advertise for them if someone sponsors?  I am really looking at the details because I can't afford the expenses out of my income but I would not mind putting in the work to get sponsors to cover the majority of it...

Anyone with experience is welcome to chime in...I am very excited and not sure when I will ever have a chance to do a race like this again and don't want to pass up an opportunity. 




I'm a little confused. I mean no disrespect but don't understand how a USAT (non draft legal race) qualifies for an ITU race? I didn't race Anderson but think I could have qualified but my bike isn't even ITU legal. So I'd have to buy a new bike on top of travel expenses?
2013-11-05 8:27 PM
in reply to: rjrankin83

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Subject: RE: Qualified...Very Excited but have questions....

Originally posted by rjrankin83
Originally posted by TriGuy05

So i did the Rev3 HIM in South Carolina a few weeks ago as I know a few others here did as well.  So it was the USAT Long Course National Championship Race and was a qualifying race for Team USA.  Top 20 of my age group qualify, I was fortunate enough to be #19.  I was very happy with the way the race went and was a HIM PR time for me.  So a couple days ago I received an email saying I have been chosen to help represent Team USA in the 2014 ITU World Championship in Weihi, China.  

So my question is for those who may have done this before.  I have read that they will not help financially with the registration of travel fees but are you able to get sponsors?  If so, how do you help advertise for them if someone sponsors?  I am really looking at the details because I can't afford the expenses out of my income but I would not mind putting in the work to get sponsors to cover the majority of it...

Anyone with experience is welcome to chime in...I am very excited and not sure when I will ever have a chance to do a race like this again and don't want to pass up an opportunity. 

I'm a little confused. I mean no disrespect but don't understand how a USAT (non draft legal race) qualifies for an ITU race? I didn't race Anderson but think I could have qualified but my bike isn't even ITU legal. So I'd have to buy a new bike on top of travel expenses?

See this article for clarification http://www.slowtwitch.com/mainheadings/techctr/trirules.html

"ITU Rules" do not apply to non-draft legal events, or for age group (non-pro) events

2013-11-05 8:32 PM
in reply to: dmiller5

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Subject: RE: Qualified...Very Excited but have questions....
Originally posted by dmiller5

Originally posted by rjrankin83
Originally posted by TriGuy05

So i did the Rev3 HIM in South Carolina a few weeks ago as I know a few others here did as well.  So it was the USAT Long Course National Championship Race and was a qualifying race for Team USA.  Top 20 of my age group qualify, I was fortunate enough to be #19.  I was very happy with the way the race went and was a HIM PR time for me.  So a couple days ago I received an email saying I have been chosen to help represent Team USA in the 2014 ITU World Championship in Weihi, China.  

So my question is for those who may have done this before.  I have read that they will not help financially with the registration of travel fees but are you able to get sponsors?  If so, how do you help advertise for them if someone sponsors?  I am really looking at the details because I can't afford the expenses out of my income but I would not mind putting in the work to get sponsors to cover the majority of it...

Anyone with experience is welcome to chime in...I am very excited and not sure when I will ever have a chance to do a race like this again and don't want to pass up an opportunity. 

I'm a little confused. I mean no disrespect but don't understand how a USAT (non draft legal race) qualifies for an ITU race? I didn't race Anderson but think I could have qualified but my bike isn't even ITU legal. So I'd have to buy a new bike on top of travel expenses?

See this article for clarification http://www.slowtwitch.com/mainheadings/techctr/trirules.html

"ITU Rules" do not apply to non-draft legal events, or for age group (non-pro) events




Okay so at the WC's only the Pro's will be draft legal?


2013-11-05 9:49 PM
in reply to: rjrankin83

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Subject: RE: Qualified...Very Excited but have questions....

Originally posted by rjrankin83
Originally posted by dmiller5

Originally posted by rjrankin83
Originally posted by TriGuy05

So i did the Rev3 HIM in South Carolina a few weeks ago as I know a few others here did as well.  So it was the USAT Long Course National Championship Race and was a qualifying race for Team USA.  Top 20 of my age group qualify, I was fortunate enough to be #19.  I was very happy with the way the race went and was a HIM PR time for me.  So a couple days ago I received an email saying I have been chosen to help represent Team USA in the 2014 ITU World Championship in Weihi, China.  

So my question is for those who may have done this before.  I have read that they will not help financially with the registration of travel fees but are you able to get sponsors?  If so, how do you help advertise for them if someone sponsors?  I am really looking at the details because I can't afford the expenses out of my income but I would not mind putting in the work to get sponsors to cover the majority of it...

Anyone with experience is welcome to chime in...I am very excited and not sure when I will ever have a chance to do a race like this again and don't want to pass up an opportunity. 

I'm a little confused. I mean no disrespect but don't understand how a USAT (non draft legal race) qualifies for an ITU race? I didn't race Anderson but think I could have qualified but my bike isn't even ITU legal. So I'd have to buy a new bike on top of travel expenses?

See this article for clarification http://www.slowtwitch.com/mainheadings/techctr/trirules.html

"ITU Rules" do not apply to non-draft legal events, or for age group (non-pro) events

Okay so at the WC's only the Pro's will be draft legal?

For age group worlds in canada I know it is not draft legal, same with china. I believe there are some non-pro events that are draft legal like the pan-american cup. Someone else who has participated might be able to give a bit more information.

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