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2014-07-22 11:13 PM

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Subject: Sodium for Ironman
I am in the middle of the fun training for Ironman Florida.

I was talking with a good friend who just went to a Nutrition Seminar about Nutrition during races. The speaker was a Double Ironman winner and went to Kona and teaches Top Endurance Athletes. He says you need 600-1200 mg of sodium per hour in an Ironman. He says he sweats bad and even takes close to 1500.

I sweat a lot! And I did the math of the 5-6 hour workouts I have been doing on weekends and I am barely taking in 600mg. I take in an hour roughly:
-16 oz of gatorade approx 180 mg of sodium
-1.5 Salt pill approx 300 mg of sodium
-1.25 gu approx 130 mg of sodium
TOTAL 610 mg of sodium

So basically I am barely getting enough sodium according to that, but I feel fine. But I live in Florida and sweat a lot! Its hard to take more gatoraide on bikes and runs that I already do. If I drank more or took more gu than every 45 minutes I think my stomach would hurt. Do I need to take way more salt pills? But I feel fine?

Suggestions? Will it make me feel better?




2014-07-23 7:04 AM
in reply to: #5029366

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Subject: RE: Sodium for Ironman
If you take on to little sodium, to balance your electrolytes, your body will shed water by having you urinate which can dehydrated faster. Regular gatorade does not have enough sodium. They had another version called endurance but didn't sell well. I feel better taking in 600 to 800 mg per hour and it makes more of a difference for me what my sodium intake at a hotter IM. Try increase your intake and see how you feel, do research and use next few months to dial it in.
2014-07-23 7:23 AM
in reply to: rungirl222

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Subject: RE: Sodium for Ironman

Just because it works for someone else doesn't mean it's right for you.  Don't forget that what you consume for fuel during a race or training is in addition to what you eat the rest of the day, and everyone's needs are individual to begin with, so the value of supplements can vary greatly from one person to the next.  Considering that most of us already get more sodium than we need in our daily nutrition, my suggestion is not to add sodium (or other electrolyte) supplements unless you're having issues that you're trying to fix.  If it's not broke, don't fix it.

 

2014-07-23 8:15 AM
in reply to: TriMyBest


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Subject: RE: Sodium for Ironman
Originally posted by TriMyBest

Just because it works for someone else doesn't mean it's right for you.  Don't forget that what you consume for fuel during a race or training is in addition to what you eat the rest of the day, and everyone's needs are individual to begin with, so the value of supplements can vary greatly from one person to the next.  Considering that most of us already get more sodium than we need in our daily nutrition, my suggestion is not to add sodium (or other electrolyte) supplements unless you're having issues that you're trying to fix.  If it's not broke, don't fix it.

 




This is true, but, for me, and the OP may be in the same boat, I cannot simulate race day conditions in my training. I live in Asheville, where a really hot day is the upper 80's with marginal humidity. I'm racing Louisville where a typical day is 90's with really high humidity.
As it stands now I don't take any additional sodium and I feel fine, however, I don't think that'll be the case come race day. My only experience with taking sodium was IMAZ, where I don't think I even needed it, but took 1 tablet(salt stick) every 30 minutes and I didn't notice anything negative.
I'm sure I eat plenty of salt, but does simply eating it throughout the week as part of your normal diet, really help on race day when you're sweating buckets?
2014-07-23 8:23 AM
in reply to: rungirl222

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Subject: RE: Sodium for Ironman
I use powerbar gels (Green Apple flavor). They come with 200 mg of sodium and this is one of the main reasons I switched to them. GU gels didn't have enough sodium to add to my hourly needs.

However, nutrition is very personal. I also live in Florida (Miami) and I do not need as much sodium as other people as I don't sweat that much when racing in cooler events (almost any event outside of Miami is colder than what I am used to).
2014-07-23 9:42 AM
in reply to: davidfedez

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Subject: RE: Sodium for Ironman

I live in FL too and sweat more than any 5 people you know combined.  I am VERY careful about my fluids.  I am a very heavy salty sweater. I actually had my sweat tested so I could replace my sodium better which is really the only true way to know what is right for YOU.  Its extremely individual.  Do a sweat test if you have not to be sure you are replacing fluids adequately. IF what you are doing is working for you then you are probably fine.....might not work for me but we are talking about you.  People get it in their heads they have to do what everyone else or some super star is doing but your needs and those of Mirinda Carrafee are probably 2 different things.

 

As some one who has race IMFL 7 times I will tell you that race day is most likely to be colder than any day of training you will have leading up to the race so the sodium thing is probably going to be more useful for training than racing. 



2014-07-23 10:01 AM
in reply to: Socks

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Subject: RE: Sodium for Ironman

 

You might want to check out Infinit and see about ordering some liquid nutrition from them. They have a program that will ask you some questions about yourself and then create a formula for you based on your answers.

I used Infinit for my IM training and for my race. I sweat like a wh0re in church and can just about fill a salt shaker with the salt left over on my face after a hard workout. My Infinit formula is very salty and worked great for me. No stomach issues, felt good through the race. I lived off the course for the run portion of my IM, there was not a ton of salty stuff available (pretzels, chips) when they finally brought out the chicken broth I got a couple cups of that and felt much better after.

Check out Infinit for the bike portion, then figure out a plan that works for you on the run. 

2014-07-23 10:25 AM
in reply to: rungirl222

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Subject: RE: Sodium for Ironman
funny timing

Mirinda Carfrae's coach, Siri Lindley, twitted this link this morning

http://triathlete-europe.competitor.com/2014/07/22/qa-avoiding-cram...

2014-07-23 10:49 AM
in reply to: TriMyBest

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Subject: RE: Sodium for Ironman
Originally posted by TriMyBest

Just because it works for someone else doesn't mean it's right for you.  Don't forget that what you consume for fuel during a race or training is in addition to what you eat the rest of the day, and everyone's needs are individual to begin with, so the value of supplements can vary greatly from one person to the next.  Considering that most of us already get more sodium than we need in our daily nutrition, my suggestion is not to add sodium (or other electrolyte) supplements unless you're having issues that you're trying to fix.  If it's not broke, don't fix it.

 




I would echo Don's post and add a few additional points:

1 - IME athletes from cooler climates seem to have greater need to electrolyte supplementation beyond what they get in their normal diet. Since you are from a ws
armer climate and will be racing in the same climate you are training in, you may not have to supplement your race day nutrition.

2 - having salt on your clothing and/or body is not a good indication of the need to supplement.

3 - being a heavy sweater is not a good indication of the need to supplement.

4- sweat is hypotonic meaning that when you sweat, you increase the salt concentration in your body, not decrease the concentration as is commonly understood.

Bottom line is that this is something that needs to be tested in training and there are no one size fits all solutions for electrolyte supplementation.

Shane
2014-07-23 12:55 PM
in reply to: gsmacleod

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Subject: RE: Sodium for Ironman

Originally posted by gsmacleod
Originally posted by TriMyBest

Just because it works for someone else doesn't mean it's right for you.  Don't forget that what you consume for fuel during a race or training is in addition to what you eat the rest of the day, and everyone's needs are individual to begin with, so the value of supplements can vary greatly from one person to the next.  Considering that most of us already get more sodium than we need in our daily nutrition, my suggestion is not to add sodium (or other electrolyte) supplements unless you're having issues that you're trying to fix.  If it's not broke, don't fix it.

 

I would echo Don's post and add a few additional points: 1 - IME athletes from cooler climates seem to have greater need to electrolyte supplementation beyond what they get in their normal diet. Since you are from a ws armer climate and will be racing in the same climate you are training in, you may not have to supplement your race day nutrition. 2 - having salt on your clothing and/or body is not a good indication of the need to supplement. 3 - being a heavy sweater is not a good indication of the need to supplement. 4- sweat is hypotonic meaning that when you sweat, you increase the salt concentration in your body, not decrease the concentration as is commonly understood. Bottom line is that this is something that needs to be tested in training and there are no one size fits all solutions for electrolyte supplementation. Shane

#1 is very interesting, Shane.  I've only worked with athletes in the Northeast U.S, so I don't have that perspective, and I'd never heard it before.  Do you know if any objective studies have been done regarding this?

 

2014-07-23 2:10 PM
in reply to: TriMyBest

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Subject: RE: Sodium for Ironman
Don,

It's purely anecdotal based on athletes I've coached and conversations that I've had with others.

There may be nothing to it but it seems that those who train in hot weather consistently are more likely to be okay on race day.

Shane


2014-07-23 4:50 PM
in reply to: gsmacleod

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Subject: RE: Sodium for Ironman

Originally posted by gsmacleod Don, It's purely anecdotal based on athletes I've coached and conversations that I've had with others. There may be nothing to it but it seems that those who train in hot weather consistently are more likely to be okay on race day. Shane

I can see why that would be, considering how efficient our bodies are at adapting to whatever demands we throw at them.  More exposure to training in hot conditions could result in better functioning in those conditions.

 

2014-07-24 3:27 PM
in reply to: gsmacleod

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Subject: RE: Sodium for Ironman
Originally posted by gsmacleod

I would echo Don's post and add a few additional points:

1 - IME athletes from cooler climates seem to have greater need to electrolyte supplementation beyond what they get in their normal diet. Since you are from a ws
armer climate and will be racing in the same climate you are training in, you may not have to supplement your race day nutrition.

2 - having salt on your clothing and/or body is not a good indication of the need to supplement.

3 - being a heavy sweater is not a good indication of the need to supplement.

4- sweat is hypotonic meaning that when you sweat, you increase the salt concentration in your body, not decrease the concentration as is commonly understood.

Bottom line is that this is something that needs to be tested in training and there are no one size fits all solutions for electrolyte supplementation.

Shane


Even as your body's salt concentration is increasing as you sweat, you are still losing salt (total available salt reserves). With a higher concentration, the salt will "push" more readily into cells, but only up to the point where there still is salt in the blood. The question is: Does the OP's current hydration plan replenish enough salt so there is always an adequate maintained reservoir?
2014-07-24 10:52 PM
in reply to: rungirl222

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Subject: RE: Sodium for Ironman
Originally posted by rungirl222

I am in the middle of the fun training for Ironman Florida.

I was talking with a good friend who just went to a Nutrition Seminar about Nutrition during races. The speaker was a Double Ironman winner and went to Kona and teaches Top Endurance Athletes. He says you need 600-1200 mg of sodium per hour in an Ironman. He says he sweats bad and even takes close to 1500.

I sweat a lot! And I did the math of the 5-6 hour workouts I have been doing on weekends and I am barely taking in 600mg. I take in an hour roughly:
-16 oz of gatorade approx 180 mg of sodium
-1.5 Salt pill approx 300 mg of sodium
-1.25 gu approx 130 mg of sodium
TOTAL 610 mg of sodium

So basically I am barely getting enough sodium according to that, but I feel fine. But I live in Florida and sweat a lot! Its hard to take more gatoraide on bikes and runs that I already do. If I drank more or took more gu than every 45 minutes I think my stomach would hurt. Do I need to take way more salt pills? But I feel fine?

Suggestions? Will it make me feel better?





Everyone's sweat rate and sodium loss rate differes. Don't go by what someone tells you, go by how you feel during your training rides/runs/bricks while tracking yoru sodium as you have been doing. PRACTICE different sodium intake amounts during training so you know how you perform. Do you feel badly? Are you performing as well as you think you should be on training runs & rides?
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