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Is Tiger Woods done?
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 2014-07-28 12:58 PM |
Champion  6503    NOVA - Ironic for an Endurance Athlete |  Subject: Is Tiger Woods done?I think that he is going to win the PGA Championship in August. And I'm not a fan of his. |
| 2014-07-28 1:06 PM in reply to: pga_mike |
Expert 3145   Scottsdale, AZ | Subject: RE: Is Tiger Woods done? No clue but I'd love to play Whistler Straights. |
| 2014-07-28 3:21 PM in reply to: pga_mike |
Elite 4547 | Subject: RE: Is Tiger Woods done? Originally posted by pga_mike I think that he is going to win the PGA Championship in August. And I'm not a fan of his. Well, I am an unabashed fan of Tiger Woods, and even I don't think he'll win the PGA Championship this year. I hope he does, but I'm not betting on it. He's still recovering from back surgery. But...to say he's done, I really doubt that. This is the 2013 Player of the Year. He certainly wasn't healthy throughout 2013. He won 5 PGA tournaments in 2013. He was 4th in the Masters, 6th in the British Open. Tiger's far from done. |
| 2014-07-28 3:28 PM in reply to: pga_mike |
Veteran 275 Algonquin, IL | Subject: RE: Is Tiger Woods done? Not sure he is “done”, but gone are the days of his domination. Meaning maybe he shoots 67 at a PGA, but so does a large group of other pros. I think he wins the Masters one more time and maybe a PGA. For as much grief as he gets over his crooked driver, his putting is what has been killing him, especially in the majors over the last few years. |
| 2014-07-28 4:22 PM in reply to: 0 |
Elite 3090 Spokane, WA | Subject: RE: Is Tiger Woods done? There's no way I'd say he's done. I doubt he'll win the PGA, but he still has the potential to have many, many good years ahead. Just look at what Bernhard Langer did this weekend. With Tiger's unlimited resources, if he wants to he can stay in top shape and compete for a very long time. Edited by zed707 2014-07-28 4:23 PM |
| 2014-07-28 4:39 PM in reply to: pga_mike |
| Subject: RE: Is Tiger Woods done? He's not done. He's got quite some way to go before he starts winning and contending on a consistent basis though. One thing I heard about him this year is that he's missing more fairways than ever and his misses are about the same to the left and the right. That's tough because you can't even play for your miss hits to make sure and avoid the worst trouble. He's got no bail out area. But given the injuries he's gone through, it's expected. It's hard to be consistent when you can't play/practice on a consistent basis. The one year he was really healthy (post 2008), he won 5 times and was player of the year. If Tiger can just string together 3-4 years of decent health, I think you'll see him win a couple more majors. He's no longer got the physical (strength, distance, etc) advantages over the rest of the field like he used to, but he's still got what it takes to win. Now if Tiger's career is going to be filled with more surgeries, rehab, etc...then yeah...he likely won't ever get back to his winning ways. That goes for any golfer though. |
| 2014-07-29 6:42 AM in reply to: Jason N |
Veteran 976 New Hampshire | Subject: RE: Is Tiger Woods done? He might have one or two more Majors in him on the right courses. Maybe one more Masters if he can get some momentum carrying him into Sunday and if there are no other big names near him at the top. I think he'll get back to his 2013 form which served him pretty well most weeks and he'll probably even win another 10 times over the course of his career but I can't say I'd be shocked if none of those wins were majors. 79 career wins, the level he was at 15 years ago was just out of this world so anything short of a grand slam is just impossible to come back from. |
| 2014-07-29 7:22 AM in reply to: cartman1966 |
| Master 1946 Memphis, TN | Subject: RE: Is Tiger Woods done? Originally posted by cartman1966 Not sure he is “done”, but gone are the days of his domination. Meaning maybe he shoots 67 at a PGA, but so does a large group of other pros. I think he wins the Masters one more time and maybe a PGA. For as much grief as he gets over his crooked driver, his putting is what has been killing him, especially in the majors over the last few years. x2 on his putting. That is what really won him all the majors. He could always make the clutch putt when he needed it and now it never seems to go in. If he can keep healthy and start sinking some putts he's right back in it and is a serious contender to beat Jack's major record. |
| 2014-07-29 9:06 AM in reply to: pga_mike |
Regular 525 | Subject: RE: Is Tiger Woods done? This is going to be an unpopular opinion but it's mine, I truly believe that Tiger was on PEDs at his peak. His recovery from injury was incredible, now he has injuries that just nag on forever. You see all the same arguments about PEDs in golf that we saw for baseball back in the 90s, golf just did a much better job of quietly fixing the problem than baseball did. I don't think it was nearly as rampant on the course as it was on the diamond, but it was there. That being said, I don't see Tiger ever getting back to the dominating player he once was. I don't think he has the mental edge anymore. He has his own doubts and the field doesn't fear him anymore. To me those two things are almost as big as any aspect of his game. Those that talk about his putting are right on too. Back in the day his putting statistics lapped the field. His make percentage from 3, 6, 10 feet doubled the other tour pros, those make percentages were what really separated him from everyone else. |
| 2014-07-29 10:53 AM in reply to: pga_mike |
Extreme Veteran 1001 Highlands Ranch, Colorado | Subject: RE: Is Tiger Woods done? I don't think that Tiger is done, but I do not think that he will return to be the dominant player that he was prior to "The Car Accident". Five years ago it seemed like a given that Tiger would win and everyone else was playing for second. Over the last five years Tiger has changed his caddy, coach and swing. These changes are an indication that he does not have the confidence in his game that he used to have and all of the other players see this. Over the past five years a new breed of young pros have entered the field that are all in shape, skilled and confident that they can win. None of the newer players fear Tiger the way that he was feared when he was at the top of his game. I do think that he has a couple more Major wins in him but it will not happen at this year's PGA, he is still recovering from his surgery and also needs to work out some of the inconsistencies in his swing. |
| 2014-07-29 11:08 AM in reply to: Its Only Money |
Extreme Veteran 550 Vine Grove, KY | Subject: RE: Is Tiger Woods done? I'm of fan of him the golfer, but not the person. That being said, I'll be there at Valhalla for the Saturday round and I hope he's playing well and in contention. Would love to follow him for the whole round. |
| 2014-07-29 2:30 PM in reply to: Its Only Money |
| Master 1946 Memphis, TN | Subject: RE: Is Tiger Woods done? Originally posted by Its Only Money This is going to be an unpopular opinion but it's mine, I truly believe that Tiger was on PEDs at his peak. His recovery from injury was incredible, now he has injuries that just nag on forever. You see all the same arguments about PEDs in golf that we saw for baseball back in the 90s, golf just did a much better job of quietly fixing the problem than baseball did. I don't think it was nearly as rampant on the course as it was on the diamond, but it was there. That being said, I don't see Tiger ever getting back to the dominating player he once was. I don't think he has the mental edge anymore. He has his own doubts and the field doesn't fear him anymore. To me those two things are almost as big as any aspect of his game. Those that talk about his putting are right on too. Back in the day his putting statistics lapped the field. His make percentage from 3, 6, 10 feet doubled the other tour pros, those make percentages were what really separated him from everyone else. He was much younger than than he is now. He's 38 or 39 compared to 28. That's a big difference when it comes to recovery times. Golf isn't a physically demanding sport either. Before we start accusing anyone of using PED's let's look at the youth factor as well. I think you have a point about his mental game. He always seemed to be able to clear out all the distractions before but now it seems to consume his game. Maybe that's his putting problem. Let's not forget that the field is MUCH more competitive now than it was back then. It's really anybody's game as compared to a handful of players that had a shot at every tournament. |
| 2014-07-29 3:06 PM in reply to: Jtiger |
Veteran 976 New Hampshire | Subject: RE: Is Tiger Woods done? I don't know about the PED stuff. He didn't do himself any favors in the eyes of the public with all his scandal crap, so I guess people pretty much believe he would be capable of doing anything to win and protect himself and his legacy. One of the big things with the competition I think is that the "kids" who are winning now (Rory, Adam Scott, Rickie, Johnson, Speith, Keegan, etc) all these kids, they grew up on "Tigerproof" courses. When Tiger was blowing away the competition for a decade straight the sport was trying to change around him and keep up with him and by doing so they created golfers who grew up bombing the ball and now they laugh at any track less than 7,200 Yards. Good talent coming up combined with Tiger's downfall and IMO he needs to have a lot of things go right to win more than 1 or 2 more majors. |
| 2014-07-29 3:20 PM in reply to: Its Only Money |
Elite 4547 | Subject: RE: Is Tiger Woods done? Originally posted by Its Only Money This is going to be an unpopular opinion but it's mine, I truly believe that Tiger was on PEDs at his peak. His recovery from injury was incredible, now he has injuries that just nag on forever. You see all the same arguments about PEDs in golf that we saw for baseball back in the 90s, golf just did a much better job of quietly fixing the problem than baseball did. I don't think it was nearly as rampant on the course as it was on the diamond, but it was there. That being said, I don't see Tiger ever getting back to the dominating player he once was. I don't think he has the mental edge anymore. He has his own doubts and the field doesn't fear him anymore. To me those two things are almost as big as any aspect of his game. Those that talk about his putting are right on too. Back in the day his putting statistics lapped the field. His make percentage from 3, 6, 10 feet doubled the other tour pros, those make percentages were what really separated him from everyone else. Yeah, unpopular... baseless too. Tiger Woods didn't dominate professional golf via power (though it didn't hurt), he dominated (as folks have already mentioned) because he was one of the greatest (if not THE greatest) putter of all-time during his decade of dominance. Do some research into Tiger's training, read up on experts' critiques of his swing which is INCREDIBLY physically demanding and you might get some insight into why he's incurred the injuries he's incurred. |
| 2014-07-29 5:31 PM in reply to: ChineseDemocracy |
Sensei Sin City | Subject: RE: Is Tiger Woods done? I guess sports did it to itself. If anyone is "special" now, someone accuses them of PED's. Guess people can't be better than anyone in the past without the accusation. No one is allowed to be "better" anymore. Anyone that wins a tournament? Must be on PED's (even though SOMEONE has to win a tournament - but the winner? On PED's) Is Tiger over? Maybe the complete dominance phase. His decline plus a HELL of a lot of good players. Scott, McIlroy. Fowler, etc. Jordon Speith can easily be the next "Tiger" - But I'll be the first to say it. Jordon must be on PED's... I think once Tiger is fully healthy, he will be completive PGA pro, win his share of tournaments, maybe even another major or two. Mickelson isn't always at the top of the leader board but still a solid contender and relevant and can win some events. Tiger will easily be at the kind of level.
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| 2014-07-29 7:01 PM in reply to: 0 |
Veteran 928 Columbus, Ohio | Subject: RE: Is Tiger Woods done? Not a fan and not a hater. The game of golf is MUCH better when Tiger is relevant. Personally I hope he doesn't break Jack's record, but living in C-bus and being an OSU alumnus I am obviously biased. I will agree with a previous comment that I think is a big factor which is there is a contingent of current golfers that aren't intimidated by him like the past. Edited by jacasa 2014-07-29 7:02 PM |
| 2014-07-30 2:12 AM in reply to: jacasa |
| Veteran 320 Lost, Florida | Subject: RE: Is Tiger Woods done? Originally posted by jacasa The game of golf is MUCH better when Tiger is relevant. I know the numbers back up this statement, but I think it's golf coverage and the fact that the PGA won't really promote any other player on why this happens. I hate the fact when Tiger is in a tournament they will follow him no matter what his score. I have watched tournaments where you see Tiger more then the leaders. The year Kenny Perry almost won the Master's they were covering Tiger who was out of it, and Perry made a putt to take the lead. We (viewing tv) did not get to see the Perry putt live, but on replay. And this was on Sunday on the back 9 at the Masters! I do get it, when Tiger plays the viewship goes up. But the coverage is also better when he is in the field. Tiger makes a shot we see it from 9 different angles, 19 different times. Bill Haas makes a shot from the water to win $10 Million (Fed Ex Cup) and we only see it 3 times from 2 different angles. If that was Tiger Woods, CBS would've had an underwater camera and we would still be seeing coverage of that shot today. Another example, the Bubba Watson shot in a playoff to set-up his win at the Masters, compare that to how many times we've seen Tiger's shot on 16, that fell into the hole. Little known fact, DLIII did the same shot two days earlier. Yes, Tiger did it on Sunday at the Masters in contention. But people/tv networks act like he is the only one who can pull off the shots that he does. The PGA is loaded with great golfers. Same thing about the internet coverage. Tiger plays in a tournament and it's on the front page of ESPN. If it's any other tournament you have to hunt for the results. |
| 2014-07-30 8:37 AM in reply to: #5031497 |
Champion 6503 NOVA - Ironic for an Endurance Athlete | Subject: RE: Is Tiger Woods done? Pretty sure that he was on PEDs. He flew down a certain "doctor" from Canada. 14 visits for $74000. Same guy who "treated" a bunch of MLB players. |
| 2014-07-30 9:14 AM in reply to: pga_mike |
Regular 525 | Subject: RE: Is Tiger Woods done? Mike, I forget if PGA has a professional meaning in your name or not. I don't think that PEDs were/are a huge problem on tour, but I can see the benefits. Do you think the PGA has/had a PED problem? I know this is going off topic, sorry. Tiger did revolutionize the game in many ways, but one of the most significant ways was training. He was the first golfer who was cut up and really took to non-traditional golfing training with weights and other things. I still think he can compete and can even win majors. I just don't think we will ever see him be as dominate as he once was. There are many contributing factors, age, competition, the mental game and yes I believe testing. |
| 2014-07-30 7:24 PM in reply to: Its Only Money |
| Subject: RE: Is Tiger Woods done? I'm not suspicious of Tiger doping for the following reasons. 1. His track record. The dominance he showed while winning his first 14 majors...was the same type of dominance he showed when he was 8-15 years old. His success in golf did not show any unusual spikes in success throughout his career...which is pretty amazing when you think about it. 2. At his prime, he wasn't doing anything physical that has never been duplicated since. Tiger's peak was an era where he led the way about fitness and strength. Most of the other golfers on tour were scared to do any type of strength training and that's where Tiger would get his distance advantages. You look at today's crop of golfers who molded themselves after Tiger and they are hitting the ball just as far, if not farther than Tiger ever did. And it's not just a few guys doing it...there are dozens of guys who can bomb the ball. You look at other sports like baseball's doping era where guys were hitthing 50+ home runs like it was nothing...and now that they are cracking down on PEDs, the home run leaders are back into the 40's. If Tiger was the only one who could ever hit the ball 330+ yards then that would be a red flag. Other golfers have proved it's possible...either that or everyone is on PEDs. |
| 2014-07-30 9:47 PM in reply to: pga_mike |
Elite 4547 | Subject: RE: Is Tiger Woods done? Originally posted by pga_mike Pretty sure that he was on PEDs. He flew down a certain "doctor" from Canada. 14 visits for $74000. Same guy who "treated" a bunch of MLB players. Wow Mike, never figured you for a conspiracy theory guy. What PEDs are you suggesting Tiger used? As I said before, I think it's hogwash, but I'm curious to hear what you think he took. It makes no sense. Do you think he was on 'roids? You're a golfer...how the heck would 'roids (even if used which I don't believe) help? Now if I heard about him getting some bogus diagnosis that would require he get beta blockers, THEN you'd be on to something. IMO, the greatest PED to a golfer, bar none, would be medication that would control heart rate...basically a fancy "anti-yips" prescription. btw, let me be the 1st to say it...Peyton Manning is on PEDs! Did ya see what kind of year he had last year? After missing a season?? Yeah, he also had several "experimental" treatments out in Europe. Very curious. Must have been some sort of undetectable PED regimen if ya ask me. (obviously I jest) |
| 2014-07-30 9:48 PM in reply to: Jason N |
Elite 4547 | Subject: RE: Is Tiger Woods done? Originally posted by Jason N I'm not suspicious of Tiger doping for the following reasons. 1. His track record. The dominance he showed while winning his first 14 majors...was the same type of dominance he showed when he was 8-15 years old. His success in golf did not show any unusual spikes in success throughout his career...which is pretty amazing when you think about it. 2. At his prime, he wasn't doing anything physical that has never been duplicated since. Tiger's peak was an era where he led the way about fitness and strength. Most of the other golfers on tour were scared to do any type of strength training and that's where Tiger would get his distance advantages. You look at today's crop of golfers who molded themselves after Tiger and they are hitting the ball just as far, if not farther than Tiger ever did. And it's not just a few guys doing it...there are dozens of guys who can bomb the ball. You look at other sports like baseball's doping era where guys were hitthing 50+ home runs like it was nothing...and now that they are cracking down on PEDs, the home run leaders are back into the 40's. If Tiger was the only one who could ever hit the ball 330+ yards then that would be a red flag. Other golfers have proved it's possible...either that or everyone is on PEDs. Exactly. Great points. |
| 2014-07-30 10:18 PM in reply to: sfm15 |
Elite 4547 | Subject: RE: Is Tiger Woods done? Originally posted by sfm15 Originally posted by jacasa The game of golf is MUCH better when Tiger is relevant. I know the numbers back up this statement, but I think it's golf coverage and the fact that the PGA won't really promote any other player on why this happens. I hate the fact when Tiger is in a tournament they will follow him no matter what his score. I have watched tournaments where you see Tiger more then the leaders. The year Kenny Perry almost won the Master's they were covering Tiger who was out of it, and Perry made a putt to take the lead. We (viewing tv) did not get to see the Perry putt live, but on replay. And this was on Sunday on the back 9 at the Masters! I do get it, when Tiger plays the viewship goes up. But the coverage is also better when he is in the field. Tiger makes a shot we see it from 9 different angles, 19 different times. Bill Haas makes a shot from the water to win $10 Million (Fed Ex Cup) and we only see it 3 times from 2 different angles. If that was Tiger Woods, CBS would've had an underwater camera and we would still be seeing coverage of that shot today. Another example, the Bubba Watson shot in a playoff to set-up his win at the Masters, compare that to how many times we've seen Tiger's shot on 16, that fell into the hole. Little known fact, DLIII did the same shot two days earlier. Yes, Tiger did it on Sunday at the Masters in contention. But people/tv networks act like he is the only one who can pull off the shots that he does. The PGA is loaded with great golfers. Same thing about the internet coverage. Tiger plays in a tournament and it's on the front page of ESPN. If it's any other tournament you have to hunt for the results. sfm, love him or hate him, Tiger Woods is to golf what Babe Ruth was to baseball in the '20's and '30's. He is singlehandedly the most influential golfer to have ever played the game. I am sure there were folks who complained about Babe Ruth getting a ton of press on the downside of his career too, but I'd bet radio stations and newspapers in that era made a lot more money reporting on Babe than other up and coming ballplayers. (and trust me, just like in Babe's era, the American public enjoys tearing down the hero as much as they love building them up) Hey, I love watching the Spieths, the McIlroys, the Bubba's...but until they can do anything close to what Tiger did, coverage isn't going to match Tiger's, period. Also, you're talking about the defending PGA Player of the Year as well as the guy who singlehandedly spikes ratings like no other player. |
| 2014-07-31 5:50 AM in reply to: ChineseDemocracy |
Champion 6503 NOVA - Ironic for an Endurance Athlete | Subject: RE: Is Tiger Woods done? Beside his RAPID-DRAMATIC body changes after leaving college, and the equally rapid decline in his fitness when the Tour started testing for PED's, there is his use of Anthony Galea. Where there is smoke...
http://www.golf.com/tour-and-news/tiger-woods-paid-anthony-galea-76k-14-visits-new-book-says
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| 2014-07-31 9:48 AM in reply to: pga_mike |
Member 465 | Subject: RE: Is Tiger Woods done? Tiger Woods made a lot of golfers very, very rich. And every single one to them who flew flew over to Firestone in their private jet hopes the answer to your question is no. IMO, the talent pool has caught up to him. When he came on tour he changed the paradigm of the sport. There was nobody like him. It was a common thought that being in athletic shape and tall was a disadvantage. Remember when lifting weights hurt the swing and being tall left a lot of room for swing flaws. The tour was filled with homemade swings and a guys with nicknames like The Walrus. The new generation of tours players grew up idolizing Tiger. They have been surrounded by swing coaches, trainers, mental coaches, and so on much of their golfing lives. Tiger is done, It is just that the rest of the tour players have up'd their game. I think he still has a few majors left in him just by the simple fact that his win percentage per starts is still ridiculous. |
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