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2014-08-15 10:40 AM
in reply to: powerman

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Subject: RE: Carpe Diem and Nanu Nanu

Originally posted by powerman

Originally posted by Kido

 

You two would know better, but I also would think it's very hard for the person suffering to know what's happening...

It's not like a broken leg where you can say "this is wrong and hurts and I should get help".  It's a feeling/emotion.  When you are happy or mad or sad, you don't typically ask yourself "is this normal?" and just go with it.  PLUS, I'm sure it's not something that one day you are happy, and the next day in despair to notice a striking difference.  I assume you start to get down like everybody does, but then it goes deeper and deeper and people suffering probably don't question it or just think that's just the way it is.  When I'm sad, I'm sad.  I don't question if it's out of the ordinary/normal and since I'm wired/chemically balanced, I bounce back.  But during that time?  I may toughen up and try to fight through it just like someone suffering with depression might do.  People that contemplate suicide due to depression probably don't think what they are doing is not normal, it's what they feel and don't question it, just like just about any other emotion.  I don't think most people routinely contemplate WHY they feel what they feel and determine if it's healthy they probably just assume what they feel is how it is, but can contemplate their REACTIONS/ACTIONS to how they feel.

I would also assume that in the attempt to "man up" and fight through it, people suffering may outwardly show signs of happiness to convince everyone they are ok.  That makes it a beotch for people the notice anything wrong.  So many times you hear "they seemed so HAPPY" almost happier than normal - it's probably a technique to mask it, which only confuses outsiders looking in and delays people stepping in and getting help.  I'm wondering if comedians as a whole might have slightly higher rates of depression/addiction and their comedy is just a way to mask it?  But I digress. 

I'm sure it takes constant monitoring.  You probably need outside observations to tell you if what you are feeling is "normal" or if it has gone beyond that.  I think self diagnosis is probably VERY difficult - again, due to the fact people generally don't question their emotions and that it probably sneaks up on you gradually.

I can't speak for everyone... just me. I knew exactly what was going on. I made my mind up. Knew what it meant, knew where I was. It was the solution to a problem. The only one I saw. I just wanted it to end. There was just one small problem.... my finger wouldn't pull the trigger.

Now you could say that meant I really didn't want to. OK, sure. But I KNEW, there was no hope, that my life was over, and there was no way I was getting out of that hole. For "ME", I decided to actually do the things people said to do to get out.... only because then when I proved they were full of crap and indeed my life was over, then I would have no choice left. Except... I was wrong. It worked for me the same way it did for them... which is where I'm at today.... the other side of the fence. I know without a shadow of a doubt there IS HELP when I want it, and that it DOES work. All I have to do is ask... It's all around me. It's everywhere.

We all find what we look for. If all we look for is black, that is what we find. That is the spiral... an unintentional one. When we look for help... we find it. And sometimes... we still can't see it. All we can do is hold on to those that can. At least that's how it worked for me. I finally saw what they saw.

I don't go around offering up my life as a spectacle for "train wreck" entertainment. This is actually the only place on-line I have ever "outed" myself.... but I do the same that was done for me... I share my experience to tell others you are not alone. You are not crazy, and there is indeed help. Just ask.

Very cool, PM.....glad you're still around.



2014-08-15 11:41 AM
in reply to: mdg2003

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Subject: RE: Carpe Diem and Nanu Nanu

Originally posted by mdg2003 Now they're reporting he was in the early stages of Parkinson's ;http://www.forbes.com/sites/danmunro/2014/08/14/robin-williams-and-the-devastating-diagnosis-parkinsons/ . Heard a report on the radio that sucide rate among those with Parkinson's is 10X that of population without the disease.

I just saw that this morning too.  Lump that on top of clinical depression and MAYBE too the cancelling of the show and you might have a "perfect storm" kind of thing.  So sad.

2014-08-15 11:47 AM
in reply to: Kido

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Subject: RE: Carpe Diem and Nanu Nanu

Originally posted by Kido

I would also assume that in the attempt to "man up" and fight through it, people suffering may outwardly show signs of happiness to convince everyone they are ok.  That makes it a beotch for people the notice anything wrong.  So many times you hear "they seemed so HAPPY" almost happier than normal - it's probably a technique to mask it, which only confuses outsiders looking in and delays people stepping in and getting help. 

I'm sure it takes constant monitoring.  You probably need outside observations to tell you if what you are feeling is "normal" or if it has gone beyond that.  I think self diagnosis is probably VERY difficult - again, due to the fact people generally don't question their emotions and that it probably sneaks up on you gradually.

Both points are absolutely true for me.  I'm really good at masking, although I've gotten better at letting people know I'm struggling.  Some people don't know how to handle it.  I had one boss who said, "Um, well, get better."  THAT was helpful!  I'm really lucky to have a wonderful DH who recognizes the signs and suggests that I talk with a professional (I have a great support team who's been with me for years) when he sees me sinking too deep.

As for the Parkinson's diagnosis, I can totally relate.  The suicide rate for people with chronic physical pain is similarly high.  My most recent episode was after I'd had constant back pain for 2.5 years, been through 2 hip surgeries, and was told that I needed a spinal fusion.  I was looking at at least another year of pain and rehab, if it was even successful at all, and I'm only 45.  I couldn't do any of the things that I had previously enjoyed, like gardening, hiking, or playing with the dogs.  The last straw was after trying to have a fun day at our timeshare in the mountains.  We got stuck in 4 hours of stop-and-go traffic on the way home and I had to take narcotic pain meds for 2 days to function.  The thought of feeling like that for the rest of my life was more than I could bear. 

That was this past January.  I happened upon a chiropractor who helped me get my life back and now I'm doing my first tri this weekend.  I'm grateful every day for my ever-improving health and for all the people who have helped me along the way.  I tell people my story not to get congratulations for what I've managed to do but to say that there's hope and there's help and you're not as alone as you think.

2014-08-15 11:56 AM
in reply to: Left Brain

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Subject: RE: Carpe Diem and Nanu Nanu

Originally posted by Left Brain

Very cool, PM.....glad you're still around.

Me too. The view from the outside of my rectal cavity is amazing!

2014-08-15 12:30 PM
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Subject: RE: Carpe Diem and Nanu Nanu

Surfing around, I stumbled onto this. It is a REALLY GOOD read. At least to me, I can relate. I was the class clown in H.S. And for all the same reasons mentioned. And knowing what I know now, it always amazes me... I did things to get people to like me, because I knew they would not like the real me... because I knew the real me and I couldn't stand me.... but then when I did get people to like me, I knew it meant nothing because they didn't even know me. It's a long strange trip we're on that's for sure. And no, I'm not the class clown anymore... or powerplant clown either. Life is good today. Being me is enough.

 

Robin Williams and why funny people kill themselves.



Edited by powerman 2014-08-15 12:32 PM
2014-08-15 1:01 PM
in reply to: powerman

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Subject: RE: Carpe Diem and Nanu Nanu

Originally posted by powerman

Surfing around, I stumbled onto this. It is a REALLY GOOD read. At least to me, I can relate. I was the class clown in H.S. And for all the same reasons mentioned. And knowing what I know now, it always amazes me... I did things to get people to like me, because I knew they would not like the real me... because I knew the real me and I couldn't stand me.... but then when I did get people to like me, I knew it meant nothing because they didn't even know me. It's a long strange trip we're on that's for sure. And no, I'm not the class clown anymore... or powerplant clown either. Life is good today. Being me is enough.

 

Robin Williams and why funny people kill themselves.

Great read.  Really really good.

I just recently found out that a HS classmate lost his life to depression about 6-7 years ago.  His obituary stated he lost his battle with obesity and depression. We were merely acquaintances as he never allowed anyone to get close.

This guy wasn't the class clown, he was the class genius.  He was SCARY smart.  Scored perfect 1600 on the SAT in 1989 and a perfect score on the ACT (I think it was either 32 or 35 at the time).  Breezed through every course he ever had and I believe did the same thing in college.  He was also incredibly overweight.   Looking back, I remember seeing scratches on his arm.  At first I thought they were cat scratches, in hindsight, he was cutting himself.

Unfortunately, I'm not surprised this happened to him.  But I'm wondering if there is also a correlation with those that are beyond normal "smart"?  

 



2014-08-15 1:53 PM
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Subject: RE: Carpe Diem and Nanu Nanu

Originally posted by crowny2

Great read.  Really really good.

I just recently found out that a HS classmate lost his life to depression about 6-7 years ago.  His obituary stated he lost his battle with obesity and depression. We were merely acquaintances as he never allowed anyone to get close.

This guy wasn't the class clown, he was the class genius.  He was SCARY smart.  Scored perfect 1600 on the SAT in 1989 and a perfect score on the ACT (I think it was either 32 or 35 at the time).  Breezed through every course he ever had and I believe did the same thing in college.  He was also incredibly overweight.   Looking back, I remember seeing scratches on his arm.  At first I thought they were cat scratches, in hindsight, he was cutting himself.

Unfortunately, I'm not surprised this happened to him.  But I'm wondering if there is also a correlation with those that are beyond normal "smart"?  

 

I'm no expert. All I have is my experiences and the perceptions and biases from that. I can't point to studies, and I'm not much into psychology. I do not need outside validation to know what goes on in my head. It's cool for an explanation... but it changes nothing inside my head.

In every single characteristic you could imagine for humans.... every single person is somewhere on a line between opposite ends of the extreme. Masculine/feminine. High metabolism/low. Extroverted/introverted. Genius/underdeveloped. For "me", I know that there is something broke. On the line of "blissfully content/insatiable", I'm somewhere on the insatiable side. Something is missing. I'm never content, always hungry, never satisfied. Now maybe in cave man days that was a great asset...today, not so much.

How I have wrapped my head around addiction is that as a very young person, I knew something was wrong. I have known this my entire life. And growing up as a kid, I latched onto "reasons" why I felt like this. I didn't have enough money. I wasn't good looking, or athletic, or cool, or smart enough as everyone else. I never measured up to "everyone else"... and trust me, I had a very long list of why.

So where I am going with this is you mentioned smart people in relation to funny..... From my perspective... if "something is wrong".... If you do not feel right in your own skin... then the reasons you could attach to that are as diverse as people. If a person's "reward/punishment" system in the brain is not right, then you are a fat sloth, or an incredibly driven industry leader, or a Monk. And I don't think that has anything to do with any other gifts a person might be blessed with such as intelligence or athletic ability. There are many different ways this can manifest in people. For me, well I'm an addict. For normal people, I have an "addictive personality". Ya, no... I didn't jump into triathlons and get absolutely obsessed with training... not me. Right. Did I mention I am OCD?

So anyway, just rambling. Today, I know all those "reasons" are B.S. I know that now. I know that intellectually. But my "feelings" have never changed. I feel the same today as the day I was born. I just know how to deal with that better now. I know a lot more today than I did at 5.



Edited by powerman 2014-08-15 1:55 PM
2014-08-15 2:38 PM
in reply to: mdg2003

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Subject: RE: Carpe Diem and Nanu Nanu

This really changes the scenario for me. I've seen how Parkinson's progresses, the end result. My father died from it earlier this year. He was diagnosed in 1997. Even by then it had progressed beyond "early detection". It robs you of your mobility, your ability to communicate, and your ability to complete a thought.

Think about some one like Robin, whose quick mind and his ability to communicate the humor was his wall. Now think about having a disease, for which there IS NO CURE, taking away the ONE thing that allows you to put up that wall. The despair would be devastating.

2014-08-15 2:48 PM
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Subject: RE: Carpe Diem and Nanu Nanu

Originally posted by briderdt

This really changes the scenario for me. I've seen how Parkinson's progresses, the end result. My father died from it earlier this year. He was diagnosed in 1997. Even by then it had progressed beyond "early detection". It robs you of your mobility, your ability to communicate, and your ability to complete a thought.

Think about some one like Robin, whose quick mind and his ability to communicate the humor was his wall. Now think about having a disease, for which there IS NO CURE, taking away the ONE thing that allows you to put up that wall. The despair would be devastating.

I remember watching Pink Floyd's "The Wall" in high school. Of course it was a midnight movie... and I was really stoned.... But I remember it hitting me and I understood it completely... except I didn't know why. That wall is indeed a real Mother... When you have invested your whole life in it... well... it's really strong. In the terms you put it ya, wow. That must have been terrifying. And I'm sorry your Dad and family had to live that.

... on a side note... The Wall remains one of top 10 albums of all time for me. It will always be on the "deserted island "album" list" for me. Absolute masterpiece... and I'm not really a huge Pink Floyd fan... They don't really make the "Deserted Island "band" list" for me. That would be the Cure, Zeppelin, Rush, Alice in Chains....



Edited by powerman 2014-08-15 2:58 PM
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