General Discussion Triathlon Talk » Sell me on an IM training plan…Fink? Rss Feed  
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2014-09-10 8:00 PM

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Subject: Sell me on an IM training plan…Fink?
Background: 31 year old age grouper, in my third season of triathlon. I come from a high-volume training background (former competitive swimmer and ran eight marathons using the Pfitz 18/55, 18/70 and 18/85 plans before starting triathlon). My method of improving has always been to throw more volume into the equation. I'm currently training for the Beach2Battleship HIM in October, using a plan of my own creation with 5 runs, 5 rides and 2 swims a week. All of my training is before work, due to my schedule, so I do two back-to-back workouts before work most days. My most recent race was an Oly where the swim was cancelled -- I biked a 1:17 40k and ran a 52 minute 10k, which I was happy but not overjoyed with.

I just finished reading "The Well Built Triathlete" and saw a LOT of myself in the anecdotes in the book. I've been showing some signs of overtraining (terrible night sweats, incredible fatigue, shin splints, etc.), I do lots of volume with most of my workouts at the same intensity, I don't give much priority to recovery or do any strength training. I'm registered for IMMT in 2015 and am starting to investigate training plans, and I feel like what I'm doing right now isn't yielding results.

But...I bought the Don Fink Be Iron Fit book and the volume looks really low to me…like 2 swims, 3 rides and 3 runs in base building phase. I'm open to trying something new, but I'm accustomed to high volume running. I've also worked really really hard to get my bike comfort to where it is, and the best way for me to maintain that is to be out on the bike 5 times a week (bike is my weakest).

Can I honestly expect improvements from the Fink plan? Is there another plan with more bike volume? I can't imagine biking or running fewer than 4 sessions a week. Am I misinterpreting the plan? I think a coach would probably be the easiest solution, and I can afford it, but if I can figure it out on my own I'd rather do that.


2014-09-10 9:04 PM
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Subject: RE: Sell me on an IM training plan…Fink?
I'm in the same boat as you: 31 and on 3rd year of triathlon except I have zero background in anything and just learned to swim 3 years ago and had my first run over 6 miles 4 years ago when I was training for a marathon. I used Be Iron Fit and I thought it was a really good book. I followed it pretty much to the T but I don't agree with this HR formula (220 - age), so you should adjust with a real 30min LT time trial for both running and swimming. Using the competitive plan got me to a 11:30 IM for my first one.

I then bought The Triathlete's Bible and got a power meter. I just winged most of my plan and used Be Iron Fit as a guide for some weeks such as taper weeks. Doing this got me to a sub 11 IM with a max week of about 18 hours (plan called for 22 that week but I got sick).

I do think Be Iron Fit is a good book to use but if you have a Power Meter, modifying the plans really helps. More so if you get Training with a Power Meter and do some of their insane workouts in there. The next step for me is to make up my own plan again but keep better track of my fitness. My fatigue level was pretty bad leading up to and going into peek week. When I started to taper, I felt unstoppable though. Need to find that good personal balance.

Edited by Blastman 2014-09-10 9:05 PM
2014-09-11 10:02 AM
in reply to: Blastman

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Subject: RE: Sell me on an IM training plan…Fink?

I'm curious too. I was looking at this for next year but I don't have a PM.  I do have a computrainer.  I have had a coach for my 4 IMs, this year went coachless and felt lost at times (race weeks). Generally I know what to do, but its hard, especially right now figuring out marathon training while I'm HIM training. 

This year I tried a BT plan but didn't really follow it much, as that it wasn't specific to me (when other races or long runs came up) and I also got an endurance nation plan which I didnt' like at all (back to back long bikes then a different day for a long run wasn't going to happen).

I don't need a coach, but I have a hard time when I have B and C races or injuries and trying to make adaptations to my plan.

2014-09-11 10:27 AM
in reply to: turtlegirl

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Subject: RE: Sell me on an IM training plan…Fink?

 

I'll leave the specifics to the coaches and experts around here. But I can say that you definitely sound as though you are overtraining. I can see 5 runs per week (I tend to need a frequent running to stay injury free). But 5 rides per week seems a bit excessive. The other problem is you are putting bike and run back to back 5 times a week. Essentially 5 brick workouts per week! That would kill anyone.

Something I am coming to learn this year about cycling... I ride with a big group of people, there are many different approaches to training. One of my buddies is closing in on 6k miles for the year, the other is just breaking 2k for this year. Guess who is faster... The long distance guy has 30 years experience and knows what he is doing, but the shorter distance guy trains short but at high intensity, he does hill repeats rather than longer rides. On group rides he does intervals or attacks constantly.

Perhaps you would benefit from some intensity and fewer workouts.

As far as training plans go. I paid the $80 for a 6 month gold membership here and used the custom plan creator for my IM. It allows you to pick how many workouts you want per week and allows you to place them in the week where you want them. I did not follow it 100% but I did what I could and it worked very well for me. I felt prepared and ready to go come race day despite low run volume due to an injury. For a little additional $$ you can get a coach assigned to you here to monitor your progress and tweak things for you. $100 for a training plan and coaching is a small price compared to your $700 entry fee for the race, might be worth a look to you. 

2014-09-11 10:34 AM
in reply to: meggfishy

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Subject: RE: Sell me on an IM training plan…Fink?

Originally posted by meggfishy Background: 31 year old age grouper, in my third season of triathlon. I come from a high-volume training background (former competitive swimmer and ran eight marathons using the Pfitz 18/55, 18/70 and 18/85 plans before starting triathlon). My method of improving has always been to throw more volume into the equation. I'm currently training for the Beach2Battleship HIM in October, using a plan of my own creation with 5 runs, 5 rides and 2 swims a week. All of my training is before work, due to my schedule, so I do two back-to-back workouts before work most days. My most recent race was an Oly where the swim was cancelled -- I biked a 1:17 40k and ran a 52 minute 10k, which I was happy but not overjoyed with. I just finished reading "The Well Built Triathlete" and saw a LOT of myself in the anecdotes in the book. I've been showing some signs of overtraining (terrible night sweats, incredible fatigue, shin splints, etc.), I do lots of volume with most of my workouts at the same intensity, I don't give much priority to recovery or do any strength training. I'm registered for IMMT in 2015 and am starting to investigate training plans, and I feel like what I'm doing right now isn't yielding results. But...I bought the Don Fink Be Iron Fit book and the volume looks really low to me…like 2 swims, 3 rides and 3 runs in base building phase. I'm open to trying something new, but I'm accustomed to high volume running. I've also worked really really hard to get my bike comfort to where it is, and the best way for me to maintain that is to be out on the bike 5 times a week (bike is my weakest). Can I honestly expect improvements from the Fink plan? Is there another plan with more bike volume? I can't imagine biking or running fewer than 4 sessions a week. Am I misinterpreting the plan? I think a coach would probably be the easiest solution, and I can afford it, but if I can figure it out on my own I'd rather do that.

 

So I'll preface this with I'm a coach, and my suggestion is to get a coach.  Go figure right?  A good coach can tailor a plan to you specific limiters and strengths.

 

That said Fink's plan is solid.  It will get you to the start line healthy and ready to complete the distance.  Will it specifically get you to see great strides in your fitness and performance?  Who knows.  Maybe it will address your specific needs, maybe it won't.  What I can tell you is that throwing volume at your training program at the iron distance is a recipe for injury.

2014-09-11 10:58 AM
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Subject: RE: Sell me on an IM training plan…Fink?

I read Don Fink's book too after many rave reviews but i went with a plan from an older book my husband had used for his first IM simply because i wanted a plan with more time in the saddle.  I think Fink's long ride maxed out around 5:30 and I already knew I was a slower cyclist and wanted to know that i had covered close to the race distance in training.   The training plan you do pick has to fit your life - and your own training preferences

I had a great race - made it to race day uninjured and largely came in exactly where my training had indicated.  I actually even did better than anticipated - I had thought i might lose some time depending on weather, any nutrition issues, etc - plus, on your first, how do you ever know how a marathon after the swim and bike will go!!?   But it all went to plan and I was mentally ready for it after training. 

I think improving is great but making it through training uninjured and relatively excited to race is very important so don't pile on too much volume. You're still quite a way off from the race.  So perhaps you can do a few dedicated training blocks in the off season - say the cycle focused 8-week plan on this site and if you make improvements then you'll be able to harness them in the main part of your iron training.  (your new zone 2 will be faster training than this season ...)



Edited by juniperjen 2014-09-11 11:00 AM


2014-09-11 12:53 PM
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Subject: RE: Sell me on an IM training plan…Fink?
What do you consider a high volume week in terms of mileage for swim/bike/run ?
Peak for Fink I am around 10K/200/45,
I have done Fink Advanced 3 times, I find that the volume is pretty good, it allows you to keep some intensity in your training and build mileage.

This may not be true for all people but during IM training if I cant complete at least 1 run and bike at tempo pace per week (at least 1 hour long) than I am not recovering from the volume, essentially its to much volume for my fitness. This excludes maybe the last week or 2 of peak when I have some built up fatigue.

I have done a lot of long slow volume in the past and I got good at going long and slow, now I want to go long and fast!



Edited by Rover24 2014-09-11 12:54 PM
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