General Discussion Triathlon Talk » How does run fitness translate to bike fitness Rss Feed  
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2015-02-15 4:34 PM

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Subject: How does run fitness translate to bike fitness

At the Vineman full last year, I had a really tough run.  Yes, it was hot (mid 90's) but still I felt that I was not adequately prepared.  So in the offseason, it has been all about the run.  Did the California International Marathon and managed to BQ for the first time and am currently training for the American River 50-miler that will take place April 4.  During the CIM training had quite a few weeks averaging 50+ miles and my current cycle is 50+ peaking at over 70.   I feel I owe Vineman a rematch, more of a grudge match, come July 25 and am wondering what to do about the bike.

Normally I'd be on the bike already building base, but because of the high run mileage am not.  I've never done this before and am wondering if those of you with more experience can comment on how this very high volume of training will translate to the bike.  Will I be able to ramp up fairly rapidly due to the running fitness, or are the muscle groups so different that there is not much cross-over.



2015-02-15 4:54 PM
in reply to: TTom

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Subject: RE: How does run fitness translate to bike fitness
I would start riding as soon as you can. Right now you are setting yourself up for another lopsided race. Unfortunately, coming into the race with weak cycling means you'll be tempted to override. That will sabotage your running leg, no matter how well prepared for it you will be.
2015-02-15 5:08 PM
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Subject: RE: How does run fitness translate to bike fitness
Bad news: Run fitness does not translate well to bike fitness. And as was said above, if your bike is weak, your run will be weaker than you expect even with good run fitness. (Take this from someone who is NOT an accomplished, but started out in triathlon with good run fitness.)

Good news: Bike fitness comes back more quickly than run fitness, so get back on your bike and train.

Edited by jennifer_runs 2015-02-15 5:09 PM
2015-02-15 9:47 PM
in reply to: TTom


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Subject: RE: How does run fitness translate to bike fitness

If you're in shape to BQ and running 50mpw, ramping up the bike will be a literal cakewalk. You will find aerobic cardio rides of 3 hrs almost no problem whatsoever from day one, and you can spend your time/energy on the bike building speed or even more endurance from there. 

 

I think it's a good thing you've built the run endurance and injury resistance - as said above, biking tends to come much faster, largely because the lack of pounding that requires well conditioned ligaments and tendons that takes months to develop if not years if you're new to it. 

 

But yes, for Vineman, definitely aim to increase bike fitness AND bike more conservatively this year, regardless of temp. And I feel your pain - I'm typically a top 5% run finisher in the amateur standings even in big tris like Vineman (overall, not AG), but despite me putting up my best bike training to date last year, I also melted down in the heat at Vineman, pretty spectacularly, actually.

 

But that meltdown wasn't all just race day misexecution - I intentionally shifted some  training from volume my run (my strongest) to the bike, thinking I could give up 10% on the run and get that 10% on the bike (with more time). What ended up happening is that I gained exactly what I thought I'd gain on the bike, but lost over double the expected amount on the run. That def won't happen again!

2015-02-16 10:32 AM
in reply to: TTom

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Subject: RE: How does run fitness translate to bike fitness

You have good answers here, but to add to it my personal experience is run fitness doesn't translate to bike fitness.  However I do seem to retain some run fitness from cycling.

2015-02-16 11:54 AM
in reply to: TTom

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Subject: RE: How does run fitness translate to bike fitness

IMHO, its not the fitness that is the issue, it's the muscles/body taking the usual time to re-adapt to the bike.  I've done 2 run focused programs for a HM where I dropped the bike.  I always found it a lot easier to get back on the bike and "get back up to speed" after a run cycle then from taking time off and doing nothing. Perhaps take a look at a bike focused program for the 1st half of your tri-training when you start it, then you can adapt to a more balance routine on the 2nd half.



2015-02-16 12:27 PM
in reply to: Donto

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Subject: RE: How does run fitness translate to bike fitness
I'm in the "it shouldn't be a problem to get your bike fitness back" camp. I ran exclusively a couple of winters ago and my first ride outside after that was roughly the same speed as what I was riding throughout tri season the year before. I am doing the same thing this year (training for a marathon without riding) so I hope it translates! Of course this all depends on how strong you were on the bike before, etc. For instance, if you were riding 200 mpw and then stopped and ran 50 mpw for 6 months, there is no way you will be as strong on the bike right away. But I would venture a guess that if you were spending, lets say, 10 hrs a week running and biking and then switched to almost all running (lets say 8hrs worth), you will be pretty close.
2015-02-16 9:39 PM
in reply to: TTom


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Subject: RE: How does run fitness translate to bike fitness
I agree with others that it doesn't translate directly to the bike. But as others have said, by running 50 mpw, you'll have no problems ramping up your bike workouts quickly to get back into shape. A few months and you can probably get it back to where it was.
2015-02-16 9:59 PM
in reply to: msteiner

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Subject: RE: How does run fitness translate to bike fitness

Originally posted by msteiner

You have good answers here, but to add to it my personal experience is run fitness doesn't translate to bike fitness.  However I do seem to retain some run fitness from cycling.

Now you've done it.

2015-02-17 4:52 AM
in reply to: TTom

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Subject: RE: How does run fitness translate to bike fitness
Good news is that you will have endurance, but the bad news is that you won't have the muscle endurance to take advantage of it. Basically, your lunges can go much further and faster than the rest of your body. That's why training from one sport has very little payback on another.
2015-02-17 8:39 AM
in reply to: TTom

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Subject: RE: How does run fitness translate to bike fitness
Just to dog pile here, long time runner, only 4 years tri. That is a definite for me as well. Run fitness does not translate well to bike fitness. Even though it appears to fly in the face of your experience, I have found bike fitness is the key to a good run in a tri, not the other way around. The stronger you are on the bike, the more energy you will have left for a good run, that is if you don't overcook it on the bike. Me personally, I would be looking into more hot weather running techniques, versus sacrificing bike fitness for more running miles. Take a hard look at your nutrition and hydration plans. Are they compensating for extreme heat and your personal characteristics, such as heavy sweating/salt loss, etc.

Did a Oly last year in extreme heat. Saw a good buddy from my run group and just slogged it in with her. Sometimes it just is what it is. It was pretty brutal. Stomach starting cramping, couldn't get anything but water down. Poured more water over my head than I drank in the last few miles. Helped me dial in my nutrition/hydration for the next race. though.


2015-02-17 9:15 AM
in reply to: NewDiz

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Subject: RE: How does run fitness translate to bike fitness
A big problem some good cyclists have in triathlon is that they forget they still have to run after the bike. That is, they are so pumped to have a strong bike split that they don't pace properly to have a strong run. So while in theory having strong bike fitness leads to a stronger run leg, some people take it too far on the bike and then have a crappy run. Then they make the mistake of thinking they need to do more focussed run training, but that's not really the fix.

I'm not saying this is necessarily your issue, OP, but keep that in mind when you plan your race.
2015-02-17 11:37 AM
in reply to: jennifer_runs

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Subject: RE: How does run fitness translate to bike fitness

Originally posted by jennifer_runs A big problem some good cyclists have in triathlon is that they forget they still have to run after the bike. That is, they are so pumped to have a strong bike split that they don't pace properly to have a strong run. So while in theory having strong bike fitness leads to a stronger run leg, some people take it too far on the bike and then have a crappy run. Then they make the mistake of thinking they need to do more focussed run training, but that's not really the fix. I'm not saying this is necessarily your issue, OP, but keep that in mind when you plan your race.

I paced the bike last year right on plan, including backing off by a bit for the hotter day, so feel I executed that part well.  During the run I was right there on my first lap when the race leader, who was CRUSHING it, passed me on his last lap with about 5 miles to go.  He was hurting and stopped to put his hands on his knees and catch his breath, so I passed him.  He soon passed me again, but slowly and got to the turnaround ahead of me.  I saw his face as he ran by me in the other direction and he was digging deep just to hold on.  I caught up with him a couple of miles later as he was getting into the back of a car after pulling himself from the race.  That reinforced the need to slow down, hydrate and make good use of the ice at the aid stations.  I may have gone a little too far in these areas, but seeing him pretty much limp in the back of that car made an impression on me.

So, unfortunately I'm not hearing a resounding "Run fitness will translate into bike fitness".  I've got some decisions to make as my run training for the next 6 weeks up to the 50-miler  is pretty intense (maxing at 73 mpw) and I'm not sure how much bike I can put in that regime.  I did hop on and do a moderate 10 miles last Sunday and could really feel it in the Monday run.  The good news is that the moderate effort on the bike was still at IM distance speed, the looming question is, how long will that be sustainable as I lengthen the rides.  But it did sure feel good to get back on the bike.

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