General Discussion Triathlon Talk » Guesstimating FTP using race efforts and HR Rss Feed  
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2015-07-29 2:01 PM

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Master
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Subject: Guesstimating FTP using race efforts and HR
Hello everyone,

I started training with power this year and it's currently installed on my tri bike. My roadie is mounted on my bike trainer where I determined my LTHR at 148bpm a couple months ago. It may have changed since then and I aim to do another LTHR test next week.

Anyway, would it be possible to guesstimate my current FTP using my recent races at Vineman 70.3 and Goleta Beach Triathlon (almost Olympic distance)? Vineman was a combination of rolling hills, a couple long ascents, and several nice flat segments where I exerted a total effort of 151avg watts/164np at 132avg bpm. Goleta Beach was mostly flat with 1 ascent about a quarter mile long at 4-6% grade and I raced hard during the bike segment and exerted 172avg watts/177np at 145avg bpm. I held off enough to have a decent run for both races, that is to say that I was able to get my legs going within the first mile and not cramping anywhere.

Would these power readings put me at an FTP of around 202 watts? I'm 5'6.5" and currently weigh 148lbs.

Thanks,
Roland

Edited by kloofyroland 2015-07-29 2:05 PM


2015-07-29 2:35 PM
in reply to: kloofyroland

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Subject: RE: Guesstimating FTP using race efforts and HR

Oly should be 85-95% of FTP.  You said you went hard on the Goleta Beach Tri and was mostly flat so if you used 90% your at ~197W, for 95% your at ~187W, for 85% at ~208W.  With training I'd probably go with ~200W and see how the intervals feel.  If too hard and can't finish the last interval or two then back it down, and vise versa.

Dude, (IHMO) put that TB on the trainer and train with power!

2015-07-29 3:13 PM
in reply to: 0

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Subject: RE: Guesstimating FTP using race efforts and HR
If 202, it would have had you doing Vineman at an IF of .81 for a HIM (164/202) and the Oly at .876 (177/202)

Those numbers make sense. If your FTP is higher, your OLY would be on the low end of proper pacing. If your FTP is lower your HIM would be on the high end of proper pacing

Please don't do LTHR tests without getting your power :-)

Edited by marcag 2015-07-29 3:14 PM
2015-07-29 10:04 PM
in reply to: marcag


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Subject: RE: Guesstimating FTP using race efforts and HR
Yup, 200-205 sounds about right if I had to guess.
2015-07-30 9:05 AM
in reply to: ziggie204

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Subject: RE: Guesstimating FTP using race efforts and HR
I am 5'6" tall and weigh 135. My FTP is 200 (well, 199.8). So you are in the ball park. I would say a bit higher.
2015-07-30 2:17 PM
in reply to: DeVinci13

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Subject: RE: Guesstimating FTP using race efforts and HR

Originally posted by DeVinci13 I am 5'6" tall and weigh 135. My FTP is 200 (well, 199.8). So you are in the ball park. I would say a bit higher.

How do you figure your height and weight correlate to your FTP? 



2015-07-31 12:28 AM
in reply to: Donto

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Master
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Subject: RE: Guesstimating FTP using race efforts and HR
Originally posted by Donto

Oly should be 85-95% of FTP.  You said you went hard on the Goleta Beach Tri and was mostly flat so if you used 90% your at ~197W, for 95% your at ~187W, for 85% at ~208W.  With training I'd probably go with ~200W and see how the intervals feel.  If too hard and can't finish the last interval or two then back it down, and vise versa.

Dude, (IHMO) put that TB on the trainer and train with power!




Thanks Donto! Your response makes sense. I wish I can put my QR Illicito on my bike trainer so I can get a more accurate reading but it's the frame that doesn't have a left seat stay and QR highly advises against mounting this frame on a stationary bike trainer other than what they recommend.

I can however move my PM to the roadie to get some tests done but damn, the cranks there are 2.5mm longer.
2015-07-31 12:30 AM
in reply to: marcag

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Master
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Subject: RE: Guesstimating FTP using race efforts and HR
Originally posted by marcag

If 202, it would have had you doing Vineman at an IF of .81 for a HIM (164/202) and the Oly at .876 (177/202)

Those numbers make sense. If your FTP is higher, your OLY would be on the low end of proper pacing. If your FTP is lower your HIM would be on the high end of proper pacing

Please don't do LTHR tests without getting your power :-)


Thanks Marcag! What does IF stand for? I wanna get my power! Hmmm, I guess I should bite the bullet and buy some shorter cranks for my roadie since the PM is a 170mm SRAM Rival crank based PM and the roadie has 172.5s, ughhhh. >.<
2015-07-31 12:38 AM
in reply to: ziggie204

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Subject: RE: Guesstimating FTP using race efforts and HR
Thanks!

Hmm, I was thinking another test I can do is an hour all out effort on the bike path near my house and see if I can hold 202watts. It's only about 7 miles long one way so perhaps I can add 5% to 202 and see if I can hold an even harder effort for 20 minutes at 212watts. It has 3 very short hills and has a slight upward gradient for the entire length heading back.

I can do some warmups similar to my LTHR test using a trainer on the way out to the turnaround. That or if you guys have some warmup suggestions I can use, that would be appreciated.
2015-07-31 12:40 AM
in reply to: DeVinci13

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Master
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Subject: RE: Guesstimating FTP using race efforts and HR
Originally posted by DeVinci13

I am 5'6" tall and weigh 135. My FTP is 200 (well, 199.8). So you are in the ball park. I would say a bit higher.


MAYBE a bit higher.
2015-07-31 4:24 AM
in reply to: kloofyroland

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Subject: RE: Guesstimating FTP using race efforts and HR
Originally posted by kloofyroland

Originally posted by marcag

If 202, it would have had you doing Vineman at an IF of .81 for a HIM (164/202) and the Oly at .876 (177/202)

Those numbers make sense. If your FTP is higher, your OLY would be on the low end of proper pacing. If your FTP is lower your HIM would be on the high end of proper pacing

Please don't do LTHR tests without getting your power :-)


Thanks Marcag! What does IF stand for? I wanna get my power! Hmmm, I guess I should bite the bullet and buy some shorter cranks for my roadie since the PM is a 170mm SRAM Rival crank based PM and the roadie has 172.5s, ughhhh. >.<


IF is intensity factor. It's normalized power over FTP. So if you rode at 80% of FTP IF = .8. It's a metric that will show up in the summary of your ride.
So yes 202 seems right since you normally ride a HIM with an IF of about .8 or 80% of FTP.


Not sure why you want shorter cranks. It's ok to have a difference between road and tri bike. and 2.5 mm is not going to change your cadence.


2015-07-31 6:02 AM
in reply to: marcag

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Subject: RE: Guesstimating FTP using race efforts and HR
Originally posted by marcag

Originally posted by kloofyroland

Hmmm, I guess I should bite the bullet and buy some shorter cranks for my roadie since the PM is a 170mm SRAM Rival crank based PM and the roadie has 172.5s, ughhhh. >.<



Not sure why you want shorter cranks. It's ok to have a difference between road and tri bike. and 2.5 mm is not going to change your cadence.


OK, I think I may understand. You have 170 Stages and can't swap it on the 172.5 ? Makes sense. Sorry I confused things.
2015-07-31 1:00 PM
in reply to: marcag

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Master
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Los Angeles, CA
Subject: RE: Guesstimating FTP using race efforts and HR
Originally posted by marcag

Originally posted by marcag

Originally posted by kloofyroland

Hmmm, I guess I should bite the bullet and buy some shorter cranks for my roadie since the PM is a 170mm SRAM Rival crank based PM and the roadie has 172.5s, ughhhh. >.<



Not sure why you want shorter cranks. It's ok to have a difference between road and tri bike. and 2.5 mm is not going to change your cadence.


OK, I think I may understand. You have 170 Stages and can't swap it on the 172.5 ? Makes sense. Sorry I confused things.


No problem man. I'm gonna look for a used 170mm SRAM compact crank (50/34) and swap the PM over for a solid test.
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