ITU Draft legal change for 2016 (Page 2)

Dude....please. 

Look, I'm not going to get into a discussion about any particular Jr. on an open board. So that discussion is out for me.  Suffice to say I don't agree and have seen all of those kids race each more times than you can read about. (I'd be glad to tell you why in a PM)

As far as others.......it'll be a tidal wave now that more and more DL racers are entering non-draft events.  Like I said, they are the most skilled triathletes.  As far now....show me anyone who can beat the top DL racers in an Oly race who has never been a DL racer.......and Fredeno/Gomez in 70.3 is no accident.

I don't see how anyone can argue that DL racers are not the most skilled triathletes.....and I know people do....I find it comical.

DL racing is the best of triathlon.  No question.  We can argue about something else if you want......but I won't even entertain this one.....it's just funny to me.

In conclusion.......BRING ON AG DL RACING!!!

I think you will see it, regardless of what we all want.  I know you saw the drafting by some other countries in Chicago, it's the way they race in their countries.....as far as ITU goes, that's the way they are heading.  And....as long as that's the case, USAT and your country's governing body will almost have to allow DL racing in many of it's sanctioned races just to stay competitive.  Otherwise, there's no practice for anyone.

No, I don't think that DL AG racing will be like Elite DL racing.....your point about the waves is right on the money.  But we might as well get used to drafting in races up to Olympic distance, because it's coming. I get your point about development, but like all of the discussions we end up having, where we disagree most is how the most skilled among us can be a lesson to a faster triathlon for anyone.  It's really not apples and oranges.....it's the same sport.  If you really want to race fast then you have to develop and hone some basic skills.  Transitions, swimming and bike handling are abysmal for the average "triathlete".....the majority just don't take the time to learn.  Since that's the case, and you will need those skills to be competitive in DL racing, learning them and taking the time to get it down is a good thing for the sport.  Who isn't in favor of better bike handling is any race? 

There will always be room for the folks who are doing triathlon for fitness and a finish....that's not going anywhere.  They aren't competitive now and they won't be with DL racing because their goals are different.  DL racing won't change that. 

I won't get into a name for name argument regarding all of the DL racers who can dominate AG races, the list is long.  What you won't find is anyone who only does AG racing that can dominate DL racing.  There's a reason for that.

What most people don't understand is that the bike groups aren't just a rest period.  Most people will get spit off the back rather easily in a good DL race pack if they are not a VERY good cyclist.  In a true DL race the efforts out of corners and 180's are extreme.

However, that is something you may not see in AG DL racing.  I just don't see multiple laps or technical courses for races with thousands of people...it just won't work.  So maybe your point will bear out.

Well, the next qualifier for AG worlds is a DL race in Clermont in Nov.  Half of the world spots will be handed out in that race.  And to your point, the other half were handed out in Milwaukee, a non-drat race.  So in a way, yeah, people got to choose.  But, they won't get to choose how they race next year in Mexico in the sprint race.

USAT will add DL AG races......it's coming.  To what extent is still being discussed from what I've been told.  They really have to if it's gong to be the world format.

they drafted so much, it was lame LB, really LAMEEEE

If the popularity of the sport and both formats continues to grow, I can see a scenario where USAT hosts both DL and NDL Nationals.  It won't happen next year, but maybe within a year or two after.

I don’t think I’d want to take part in a DL race.  Triathletes just don’t have the cycling experience and no-how about what’s required when riding in a pack of people as hard as they can.  There are too many seemingly very small errors that people will make that will cause huge accidents – something as simple as freewheeling when you were previously pedaling furiously, swerving to miss a hole in the road, failing to indicate to the person behind you that you’re stopping. The list is endless and I don’t want to be anywhere near that.

The more I think about it the worse the idea gets.  You go into a race implicitly responsible for someone else’s safety?   It’s one thing doing that at elite level (but they don’t really have any choice there) but it cannot work for the masses.

Yep, so many cluster-ef's even when people DO know what they're doing... You're going to have some crazy-strong triathletes in there with no pack skills making a mess of things. At least for a while. Technical courses are a different story, as LB stated that without the strength and skill to take corners and stay with the pack will sort things out. But there aren't a lot of courses out there that I'd classify as technical enough to make that happen.

It doesn't take much -- just some one standing up on a hill suddenly and throwing the bike backwards, or overlapping a wheel, bad placement relative to other riders (and even most road racers don't get schooled in these things).

In a way, they already have.  I guess you can call what's coming in November anything you want, but for all purposes it's a second AG nationals race since it's a world qualifier.  I understand what you are saying, though.....would the race they actually call AG nationals be DL?  I bet much has to do with how the race in Clermont goes, along with how the worlds race goes and whether the 2017 worlds host also wants to make it DL. 

ITU wants DL racing.....I know this.  USAT is on the fence right now but forced into it for a race with thousands of racers.  The current format is set up for 75 racers.  If you wanted to do that for each AG it would take 3 days to get all of the races in.

As to Brian's point, which I think is a good one, if you really want to become a better cyclist, leave the TT bike at home and find a good, fast, road group once or twice a week..  All of the skills you will learn will make you a better rider on any type of bike.

Not necessarily.  If worlds is DL then they'll just do what they are doing this year and split the qulification spots with two different races.  Baby steps.  I can't figure out what all the whining and gnashing of teeth is all about anyway......it's MUCH better racing.

It'll take time....but it's coming.  There is a generation of folks coming into the sport who only know DL racing......and think non-draft racing is not really racing at all.  We'll see what effect they end up having since their entry into triathlon, at the present numbers (and growing wildly) is relatively new in the U.S.

Besides.....I don't know  how it is with your governing body.......but ours changes things on the fly.

We've already got all the dates for the DL circuit next year.....just like last year....and some of those races and dates changed, were cancelled, never actually existed, blah, blah, blah.