General Discussion Triathlon Talk » Tri coaching survey Rss Feed  
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2016-05-05 8:34 PM
in reply to: byrdnj

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Subject: RE: Tri coaching survey
Originally posted by byrdnj

Hi all,

I'm working with a fellow triathlete to gauge interest in a more accessible type of endurance sports training. Although it's not exclusively triathlon-focused, I'd love to get some feedback from some fellow BT'ers.

Here's the survey: http://goo.gl/forms/fps2CqyegP

The survey's just a simple google form. I've just done it, and it takes about 3 minutes to complete.

Would you mind? Huge thanks in advance for your input.

Nathan


As a coach, I've tried it many ways.

Lower price for longer term commitments didn't really work out for both parties. If the athlete is unhappy; they feel stuck. If we cut ties early; I'm out cash because of the lower price we set up.

I'm not afraid to not have long term commitments. If I'm not doing my job, the athlete wouldn't stay with me. If I am not getting along with the athlete, I can cut ties. Its straight forward.

You never want an athlete to stay because of money. You want them to stay because they want to stay, because they see the value in your services.


2016-05-05 9:35 PM
in reply to: tzcoaching

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Subject: RE: Tri coaching survey
Originally posted by tzcoaching
Originally posted by byrdnjHi all,I'm working with a fellow triathlete to gauge interest in a more accessible type of endurance sports training. Although it's not exclusively triathlon-focused, I'd love to get some feedback from some fellow BT'ers.Here's the survey: http://goo.gl/forms/fps2CqyegPThesurvey's just a simple google form. I've just done it, and it takes about 3 minutes to complete.Would you mind? Huge thanks in advance for your input. Nathan
As a coach, I've tried it many ways. Lower price for longer term commitments didn't really work out for both parties. If the athlete is unhappy; they feel stuck. If we cut ties early; I'm out cash because of the lower price we set up. I'm not afraid to not have long term commitments. If I'm not doing my job, the athlete wouldn't stay with me. If I am not getting along with the athlete, I can cut ties. Its straight forward. You never want an athlete to stay because of money. You want them to stay because they want to stay, because they see the value in your services.
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2016-05-06 7:47 AM
in reply to: TriMyBest

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Subject: RE: Tri coaching survey
Originally posted by TriMyBest

Originally posted by happyscientist
Originally posted by byrdnj Thanks everyone! Nice results flowing in so far. EARLY FINDINGS: Seems that most people are struggling with the price point of training, finding coaches in the market quite expensive right now. FOLLOW UP QUESTION: I wonder, would you be interested in a longer commitment to the training, for a lower monthly price? I think a lot of coaches fear the 1-month and done athlete when a new-athlete evaluation takes so much effort. Thoughts?
Here is one of my big concerns about a coach. I have tried finding multiple swim coaches and personal trainers. Every one of them, without exception, has NOT listened to me. They either give me canned workouts and drills without explaining why I am doing something, or they have tried to turn me into the type of athlete that they want me to be instead of the type of athlete that I want to be. For example, I tried three personal trainers in an attempt to give me a strength training program that would support my triathlons and trail running with a focus on injury prevention and agility. I explained my race goals and brought in my training log so they would understand me as an athlete. Not one of them looked at it. They all gave me generalized workouts that left me too weak for the actual triathlon training. They each set back my training so I lost not just money but time. Because of these experiences, I am extremely reluctant to spend hundreds of dollars of a triathlon coach. I would consider it if the initial meeting was less expensive than the follow-ups.

Most personal trainers have absolutely no clue about how to properly evaluate and train an endurance athlete of any type.  It's not surprising at all that you had that experience.  Unless you specifically seek out one who has knowledge of both endurance sports and strength and conditioning, you're not going to get what you're looking for.  To put it in perspective how rare that combination is, the area I live in (Metropolitan Harrisburg) has a population of a little over a half million people, many large gyms, countless fitness studios, and a few hundred personal trainers, yet there are only 2 or 3 of us with the qualifications necessary to provide what you're looking for.

My suggestion would be to start by looking at endurance coaches first, rather than a personal trainer, and try to find one who is also a personal trainer or strength and conditioning coach.  You're much more likely to find what you're looking for.

 




See, the thing is, everyone claims they can do what I am asking for. Just like both of the swim "coaches" said they could help but were more focused on trying to teach me flip turns than fixing my catch or the fact that my form goes to hell when I increase my turnover. People on this forum love to claim that you just need to find a coach and everything will be fixed, but I have been burned enough times that I suspect the vast majority of trainers and coaches are frauds.

It sounds like you are very conscientious about your work, but there are a lot of bad apples out there.
2016-05-06 10:04 AM
in reply to: 0

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Subject: RE: Tri coaching survey

Originally posted by happyscientist
Originally posted by TriMyBest

Originally posted by happyscientist
Originally posted by byrdnj Thanks everyone! Nice results flowing in so far. EARLY FINDINGS: Seems that most people are struggling with the price point of training, finding coaches in the market quite expensive right now. FOLLOW UP QUESTION: I wonder, would you be interested in a longer commitment to the training, for a lower monthly price? I think a lot of coaches fear the 1-month and done athlete when a new-athlete evaluation takes so much effort. Thoughts?
Here is one of my big concerns about a coach. I have tried finding multiple swim coaches and personal trainers. Every one of them, without exception, has NOT listened to me. They either give me canned workouts and drills without explaining why I am doing something, or they have tried to turn me into the type of athlete that they want me to be instead of the type of athlete that I want to be. For example, I tried three personal trainers in an attempt to give me a strength training program that would support my triathlons and trail running with a focus on injury prevention and agility. I explained my race goals and brought in my training log so they would understand me as an athlete. Not one of them looked at it. They all gave me generalized workouts that left me too weak for the actual triathlon training. They each set back my training so I lost not just money but time. Because of these experiences, I am extremely reluctant to spend hundreds of dollars of a triathlon coach. I would consider it if the initial meeting was less expensive than the follow-ups.

Most personal trainers have absolutely no clue about how to properly evaluate and train an endurance athlete of any type.  It's not surprising at all that you had that experience.  Unless you specifically seek out one who has knowledge of both endurance sports and strength and conditioning, you're not going to get what you're looking for.  To put it in perspective how rare that combination is, the area I live in (Metropolitan Harrisburg) has a population of a little over a half million people, many large gyms, countless fitness studios, and a few hundred personal trainers, yet there are only 2 or 3 of us with the qualifications necessary to provide what you're looking for.

My suggestion would be to start by looking at endurance coaches first, rather than a personal trainer, and try to find one who is also a personal trainer or strength and conditioning coach.  You're much more likely to find what you're looking for.

 

See, the thing is, everyone claims they can do what I am asking for. Just like both of the swim "coaches" said they could help but were more focused on trying to teach me flip turns than fixing my catch or the fact that my form goes to hell when I increase my turnover. People on this forum love to claim that you just need to find a coach and everything will be fixed, but I have been burned enough times that I suspect the vast majority of trainers and coaches are frauds. It sounds like you are very conscientious about your work, but there are a lot of bad apples out there.

There are some fantastic personal trainers out there, but unfortunately, the majority are terrible.  There are several hundred personal trainer "certifications" available in the U.S., but there are only about 5 that are actually worth anything and accepted in pretty much every fitness facility in the country.  Plus, even among the ones with a worthwhile certification there is still a huge variation in their skill levels.  Most are not frauds in the sense that they are selling snake oil.  More commonly, they simply lack the skills to help, but unfortunately, they don't even know what they don't know.  The end result is situations like a PT who thinks they can help someone who wants to run a marathon, but then has them do stupid pointless things like walking on a stair stepper while holding dumbbells.

Also, a good swimming coach isn't going to teach you flip turns if you lack the basics of forward crawl technique, and don't have plans to swim in a Masters event where it's helpful.  They're going to listen to what you want to learn and achieve, and combine that with their experience indicates you really need to learn, and develop a program that gets you where you want to go.

FWIW, I've never seen anyone here or on ST claim that all you need is a coach.  Without exception, every recommendation I've seen for a coach includes the caveat that it needs to be the right coach.  The right coach being one with adequate knowledge of the subject matter, the skills to impart that knowledge, plus a philosophy that is compatible with the athlete's philosophy.

Don't let your bad experiences deter you from seeking professional assistance.  View them as valuable learning experiences that will help you recognize the right people to help you once you find them.

 



Edited by TriMyBest 2016-05-06 10:07 AM
2016-05-08 10:26 AM
in reply to: happyscientist

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Subject: RE: Tri coaching survey
I have to agree that I had this same experience with personal trainers.
2016-05-08 9:40 PM
in reply to: miamiamy

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Subject: RE: Tri coaching survey
If I were to pay for coaching that's exactly what I would want. I would need someone to look at my swimming, running, and biking for major movement pattern flaws. Drills, skills, exercises to eliminate them. Then work with the time that I have to be the best that I can be. I would like for them to review my workouts and give feed back. To understand that I can't afford both a power meter and a coach. Take feed back from me to create my workouts. Know that I don't want to do certain things and not be offended and help me the best they can. I don't need a workout planner. I have a calendar that can do that.


2016-05-10 2:24 PM
in reply to: AdventureBear

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Subject: RE: Tri coaching survey
Originally posted by AdventureBear

Originally posted by AndyEWU07

Don't turn this thread around on me... It's a survey about coaches... I have my opinion... Coaches are a worthless money pit that only lazy athletes utilize.


Why the vitriol? I've seen this at least three different times in the short period of time I've known of you and your rep here on BT. So while I respect your right to have an opinion, and especially if this gives you a laugh as you sit behind the keyboard, I am genuinely curious...what happened to you as a child? who stole your toys ?




FOR THE WIN!
2016-05-11 9:01 AM
in reply to: triguy1043

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Subject: RE: Tri coaching survey
You nailed all of the reasons I love having a coach. I did it self coached for 4 years and was never able to do all of those things and hit a plateau I couldn't get myself out of.
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