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2004-07-30 7:11 AM

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Subject: Interesting article on fatigue
I came across this article the other day. http://blogs.salon.com/0002729/2004/03/22.html
You have to scroll down the link a bit to get to it. After reading the article I'm just wondering if there is a difference between fatigue (which the article seems to say is all in your mind, and bonking. I know from personal experience a few times that bonking is definitely not a psychological thing. Food for thought

Chris


2004-07-30 8:28 AM
in reply to: #41775

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Subject: RE: Interesting article on fatigue
Interesting article Chris. Now, I am no scientist but I do have a close relationship with someone who has Chronic Fatigue Syndrome and am involved with the CFIDS Association of America, the leading non-profit organization in search of a cause and cure. I have read several articles similar to that one and can assure you that fatigue is not purely a psychological thing.

I too have experienced bonking and would take that pain any day over having to live CFS, which is an awful disease that not a whole lot is known about.

For more info, visit www.cfids.org
2004-07-30 9:11 AM
in reply to: #41775

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Subject: RE: Interesting article on fatigue
Any time a physical condition is described as being "psychlogical" , "psychosomatic" or "in your head", a good dose of scepticism is in order. This frequently means that the person making the statement can't find a physical cause so they assume that there can not be one. Both my wife and my mother-in-law have had successful corrective abdominal surgery for problems that were "in their head".

Edited by marmadaddy 2004-07-30 9:13 AM
2004-07-30 9:19 AM
in reply to: #41775

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Subject: Great Article!
I'd read something similar awhile back and have started to keep this in mind when I am doing my long runs. It HAS made a difference! Whenever I start to get tired, I remind myself that the running is REALLY mental. It sounds silly, but a line from the movie "Unbreakable" has been inspriring. It is something to the effect that, "Many people never find their limits because they're too scared to push themselves that far." What a great idea!

I am absolutely fascinated by how the mind can influence the body. Long ago, I read a study where researchers had people spend 30 minutes thinking very hard about strengthening a specific muscle. They did no physical exercises. But at the end of the research period, their muscle strength had increased around 30%. Maybe part of what makes great athletes is the ability to control yourself with your mind!
2004-07-30 9:36 AM
in reply to: #41796

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Subject: RE: Great Article!
Whit:

I'm the same way when I'm out running. I know when I was training for marathons, I would almost always feel exhausted in the middle of my long runs, but some how, I always managed to finish. I had alwys had a goal of breakign 4 hours in the marathon, and consistently I would come up about 4-5 minutes short every time, with always the same problem, the feeling of fatigue setting in at about 22 miles. And for almost everyone, I would start thinking about it at about mile 18 or so, wondering if it was going to happen again, and invariably it did.

The last marathon I ran, I finished in 3:54, and I think mainly because I was psychologically stronger, only because I hadn't really changed my training much. I'm a big proponent of visualization. Laying quietly somewhere and thinking about what's going to happen and how you are going to react. For this last race, I kept visualizing running strong the entire way, and came up with a couple of thoughts that I would repeat if I started getting those negative thoughts.

Glad you enjoyed the article.
2004-07-30 9:39 AM
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Subject: RE: Interesting article on fatigue
Great article! there was something similar in runner's world a few months ago... I know that for me, running is suuuper mental. It's just taxing. in HS, the only time that I ever ran under 18:30 min in a cross country race (2.6 mi, for non HS CC runners) was by telling myself "You're going to do well, and you're going to do it by pushing NOW" about 50 times during the race. Does that mean that I was less well prepared, physically, for the races before and after that one when I ran 20+ min times? No. I just pushed mentally. Just my opinion, I think the central governor theory holds (some) water.


2004-07-30 10:37 AM
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Subject: RE: Interesting article on fatigue
Intresting article. But there was an error - they coudn't possibly detect the location of that central governer with EEG.
1. EEG has excelent temporal resolution but no spacial - I would like to see original paper
2. central governor is just a concept, it is not some black box inside the head, things are way more complicate then that

And, there is a whole world between physiological and psychological. World of neurons. It is no news everything is calculated in brain. Neuromuscular coordination is almost everything, I would dare to say.

I just want to add a few words about visualisation. It is not psychological, either. During the visualisation (and watching) actually the same neurons are firing along the same pathways, and same patterns as during the real performing, there is absolutelly no difference! Awesome!
(sfms = sorry for my spelling)
2004-07-30 12:36 PM
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Subject: RE: Interesting article on fatigue
I will start by saying I am no doctor or elite athlete. However, for me fatigue is real. I typically will check my resting HR in the AM to see if I am fatgiued and not just go on my mental outlook. My resting HR is usually around 50, if it is higher (e.g. in the upper 50's) I realize that my body is fatigued and either take it easy or insert a rest day into the schedule. For me this is the only sure way to tell fatigue.

Adios
2004-07-30 2:35 PM
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Subject: RE: Interesting article on fatigue
"Many people never find their limits because they're too scared to push themselves that far." What a great idea!


Great saying to remember.

When I am fatigued when I work out I also remember something my martial arts teacher says a lot. That is that you don't really get stronger on the easy workouts--you get stronger when your body is fatigued. The work outs you think are bad are probably the ones that contribute the most to your progress!
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