"Gliding"
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2007-01-07 1:33 AM |
123 | Subject: "Gliding" I was reading in my Galloway Book about gliding during run workouts. The concept sounds nice, but I had a very hard time understanding exactly what I am supposed to do and feel when I am gliding. The explanation was a little vague. I think I sort of felt it today when I was jogging downhill, but I'm not really sure. I sure don't know how to do it on flats. Have any experience with this? Any further explanations or tips on achieving a glide during the run? Thanks!! |
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2007-01-07 5:38 AM in reply to: #645152 |
New user 11 | Subject: RE: "Gliding" Is gliding just a really long stride while running? If so then I would guess you just take longer strides while running.... |
2007-01-07 10:43 AM in reply to: #645152 |
15 | Subject: RE: "Gliding" I'm not familiar with the term gliding, but efficient runners take shorter, quicker strides than less efficient runners. There are very few absolutes in triathlon training and racing, but that is one. Ken www.EvolutionRunning.com |
2007-01-07 1:02 PM in reply to: #645263 |
Cycling Guru 15134 Fulton, MD | Subject: RE: "Gliding" I believe it is referencing when you have a quick turnover and are minimizing the "bounce" of the typical runner. Think of the top marathoners and how they seem to skim accross the pavement and "glide" as they run. At least that is what I think it refers to ....... |
2007-01-07 1:13 PM in reply to: #645152 |
Master 1603 Connecticut | Subject: RE: "Gliding" Here is a link where Jeff Galloway describes the idea: http://www.runinjuryfree.com/resources/ask_jeff.html |
2007-01-07 4:41 PM in reply to: #645160 |
Coach 9167 Stairway to Seven | Subject: RE: "Gliding" SithVegeta - 2007-01-07 4:38 AM Is gliding just a really long stride while running? If so then I would guess you just take longer strides while running.... A longer stride produces less glide, more bounce as you need to overcome the braking inertia of a foot landing out in front of you creates. |
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2007-01-08 12:31 PM in reply to: #645152 |
Champion 6993 Chicago, Illinois | Subject: RE: "Gliding" yeah I remember correctly chi running calls it skipping off the ground. less time you spend on 1 foot at time time is less stress on your body. less you move in an upward motion the less energy you have to use. plus the storter stride the less effort you can put into your muscles. Its also one reason bike riding is so good for running since it teaches the body to get used to running at a higher candence which causes you to glide over the road. |
2007-01-08 12:35 PM in reply to: #645339 |
Master 1641 Cambridge, MA | Subject: RE: "Gliding" dredwards - 2007-01-07 2:13 PM Here is a link where Jeff Galloway describes the idea: http://www.runinjuryfree.com/resources/ask_jeff.html Very helpful -- thanks! GlidingQ: Hi Jeff, I have heard you talking about one downhill running technique that you called "gliding". Could you explain how to do it and what's its benefit, etc? Jeff: Keep your feet low to the ground, touch down very lightly with each foot, and don't let the stride length get too long. When runners go astray, they let the stride length get an inch or two too long. Just let gravity pull you down the hill, coasting all the way. Edited by SunnyS 2007-01-08 12:36 PM |
2007-01-08 12:36 PM in reply to: #645465 |
Runner | Subject: RE: "Gliding" AdventureBear - 2007-01-07 5:41 PM SithVegeta - 2007-01-07 4:38 AM Is gliding just a really long stride while running? If so then I would guess you just take longer strides while running.... A longer stride produces less glide, more bounce as you need to overcome the braking inertia of a foot landing out in front of you creates. Not necessarily true. The stride length of elite runners is longer than most non-elites. Their stride rate is generally only at best 10% better than MOPers. It depends on where the foot lands. |
2007-01-08 2:24 PM in reply to: #646329 |
Crystal Lake, IL | Subject: RE: "Gliding" SunnyS - 2007-01-08 12:35 PM dredwards - 2007-01-07 2:13 PM Here is a link where Jeff Galloway describes the idea: http://www.runinjuryfree.com/resources/ask_jeff.html Very helpful -- thanks! GlidingQ: Hi Jeff, I have heard you talking about one downhill running technique that you called "gliding". Could you explain how to do it and what's its benefit, etc? Jeff: Keep your feet low to the ground, touch down very lightly with each foot, and don't let the stride length get too long. When runners go astray, they let the stride length get an inch or two too long. Just let gravity pull you down the hill, coasting all the way. I didn't know it as gliding, but I can speak to this now that I know it is about running downhill. I love it. I call it letting the wheels roll. When I'm going downhill I concentrate very hard on form. Keep the stride length right, proper foot placement and strike, and GO! With very little effort you can zoom down a hill. I first noticed how this can help you in my half mary last summer. When we went down hill I passed tons of people who were chugging down at their usual pace fighting gravity. Schmize was a little behind me at this point (he was pacing smarter - i wasn't faster) and noticed what I was doing and began copying me to keep up. It's like free speed and I couldn't believe everyone wasn't doing it. As long as you can maintain your proper form it works like a charm. I have a very hilly half mary coming up in March and I can't wait to do it again there.
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2007-01-08 2:36 PM in reply to: #646330 |
Champion 6993 Chicago, Illinois | Subject: RE: "Gliding" Scout7 - 2007-01-08 12:36 PM AdventureBear - 2007-01-07 5:41 PM SithVegeta - 2007-01-07 4:38 AM Is gliding just a really long stride while running? If so then I would guess you just take longer strides while running.... A longer stride produces less glide, more bounce as you need to overcome the braking inertia of a foot landing out in front of you creates. Not necessarily true. The stride length of elite runners is longer than most non-elites. Their stride rate is generally only at best 10% better than MOPers. It depends on where the foot lands. yeah faster you are the longer the stride length but it should open behind you and not in front of you. Chi running DVD has a great example of this. |
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2007-01-08 2:40 PM in reply to: #646581 |
Master 1210 Saskatchewan | Subject: RE: "Gliding" chirunner134 - 2007-01-08 1:36 PM Scout7 - 2007-01-08 12:36 PM yeah faster you are the longer the stride length but it should open behind you and not in front of you. Chi running DVD has a great example of this.AdventureBear - 2007-01-07 5:41 PM SithVegeta - 2007-01-07 4:38 AM Is gliding just a really long stride while running? If so then I would guess you just take longer strides while running.... A longer stride produces less glide, more bounce as you need to overcome the braking inertia of a foot landing out in front of you creates. Not necessarily true. The stride length of elite runners is longer than most non-elites. Their stride rate is generally only at best 10% better than MOPers. It depends on where the foot lands. I find that leaning forward a touch allows me to keep a higher turnover with less effort too. Interesting discussion... |
2007-01-08 2:45 PM in reply to: #646581 |
Runner | Subject: RE: "Gliding" chirunner134 - 2007-01-08 3:36 PM Scout7 - 2007-01-08 12:36 PM yeah faster you are the longer the stride length but it should open behind you and not in front of you. Chi running DVD has a great example of this.AdventureBear - 2007-01-07 5:41 PM SithVegeta - 2007-01-07 4:38 AM Is gliding just a really long stride while running? If so then I would guess you just take longer strides while running.... A longer stride produces less glide, more bounce as you need to overcome the braking inertia of a foot landing out in front of you creates. Not necessarily true. The stride length of elite runners is longer than most non-elites. Their stride rate is generally only at best 10% better than MOPers. It depends on where the foot lands. As a side note, the higher cadence and longer stride of the elites has been shown to be less efficient than the stride mechanics of non-elites. They get more power out of their stride. |
2007-01-08 2:58 PM in reply to: #646606 |
15 | Subject: RE: "Gliding" Excellent discussion, lots of good points! My research has shown that elite runners are significantly more economical (less oxygenm consumption at a given pace. When we talk about stride length, it refers to the distance between foot-strikes. This does NOT refer to greater range of motion of the legs. Elites lengthen their stride by creating more power at toe-off, not by opening their legs wider. In fact, most elites allow their femur angle to open no wider than 100 degrees at very fast steady-state running paces. Many beginners open a greater femur angle at 10 minute pace. Long strides are necessary to run very fast, but wide range of motion of the legs (as mentioned correctly by AdventureBear) is terribly inefficient. Also, never lengthen your stride at the expense of turnover. To run 4 minute pace requires long strides and high turnover, so 4 minute milers run that way. Always keep turnover at least 180 footstrikes per minute. Ken |
2007-01-08 3:05 PM in reply to: #646651 |
Runner | Subject: RE: "Gliding" Out of curiosity, why at least 180? I see this number all the time, yet no good explanation other than "This is what the elites run". |
2007-01-08 3:53 PM in reply to: #646665 |
Lethbridge, Alberta | Subject: RE: "Gliding" Scout7 - 2007-01-08 2:05 PM Out of curiosity, why at least 180? I see this number all the time, yet no good explanation other than "This is what the elites run". I should let Ken or some of the other experts answer this but, as no one has yet, I'll take a shot at it. As I understand it, 180 steps per minute is a function of the time it takes the connective tissues in someone's foot and leg to stretch and lose the stored energy accumulated when the leg absorbed the landing impact. If your turnover is slower, you start to lose too much of the stored energy. It also doesn't make much difference if you are large or small, the tissues stretch in about the same amount of time. |
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2007-01-08 3:55 PM in reply to: #646788 |
15 | Subject: RE: "Gliding" Excellent answer, I agree completely. Ken |
2007-01-08 3:58 PM in reply to: #645152 |
Master 1641 Cambridge, MA | Subject: RE: "Gliding" Fascinating...this 180 steps/min seems like a magic number...could it be true? Too bad I always lose count by 90. |
2007-01-08 4:06 PM in reply to: #646808 |
Lethbridge, Alberta | Subject: RE: "Gliding" SunnyS - 2007-01-08 2:58 PM Fascinating...this 180 steps/min seems like a magic number...could it be true? Too bad I always lose count by 90. I only count one side for 20 seconds. I usually just count and then look at my watch again as I get to 30. 20 seconds is usually about 31 to 33 steps on one side for me. |
2007-01-08 4:08 PM in reply to: #646808 |
Champion 6993 Chicago, Illinois | Subject: RE: "Gliding" SunnyS - 2007-01-08 3:58 PM Fascinating...this 180 steps/min seems like a magic number...could it be true? Too bad I always lose count by 90. That is why tempo trainers are so useful. they keep the beat for you. |
2007-01-08 7:58 PM in reply to: #645152 |
123 | Subject: RE: "Gliding" you guys are great. What an awesome discussion. I am a long time heel-striker who began fiddling with form over my first triathlon training season this past summer. A little barefoot running, careful attention to turnover and listening to the good old body...guess who is running/walking without as much pain and fatigue.....yeah that would be yours truly!!! Every lilttle discussion like this helps me thiknk about more things when I run. I really appreciate it! TB |
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2007-01-08 8:19 PM in reply to: #647093 |
Champion 6993 Chicago, Illinois | Subject: RE: "Gliding" yeah I was doing well and I found I wsa getting injuried and why because I feel into bad running habits. Running coach is right. always constantly work on form. always think about and work on it. |
2007-01-09 7:00 AM in reply to: #646788 |
Runner | Subject: RE: "Gliding" Micawber - 2007-01-08 4:53 PM Scout7 - 2007-01-08 2:05 PM Out of curiosity, why at least 180? I see this number all the time, yet no good explanation other than "This is what the elites run". I should let Ken or some of the other experts answer this but, as no one has yet, I'll take a shot at it. As I understand it, 180 steps per minute is a function of the time it takes the connective tissues in someone's foot and leg to stretch and lose the stored energy accumulated when the leg absorbed the landing impact. If your turnover is slower, you start to lose too much of the stored energy. It also doesn't make much difference if you are large or small, the tissues stretch in about the same amount of time.Interesting. Any idea where you saw this? I have a link to a study some might find interesting. It's kind of math-intensive, but if you get to the end to see the results, it's worth it. http://www.elitetrack.com/articles/weyand.pdf Call me a naysayer, but I'm generally of the opinion that unless your current stride rate is below about 160-165, you're fine. |
2007-01-09 8:08 AM in reply to: #645152 |
Master 1641 Cambridge, MA | Subject: RE: "Gliding" Oh of course! A 20 second count on one leg...an easy solution to my counting woes. And a tempo meter -- sounds like a metronome, right? I ran half of my second 13.1 race near a woman who was wearing one. What a freaking nuisance!! I'm sure it helped her keep the pace, but the beat seemed really fast and it was impossible to tell where it was coming from until I passed her (deliberately) and the silence returned. I'd never wear one in a race, but I bet they're a cheap and useful training tool. |
2007-01-09 8:46 AM in reply to: #647408 |
Champion 6993 Chicago, Illinois | Subject: RE: "Gliding" SunnyS - 2007-01-09 8:08 AM And a tempo meter -- sounds like a metronome, right? Yep first ones I saw were actaul metronomes and now 1 company has labeled them as tempo meter. They even mad it water proof for swimming so you can time your stroke. One thing I learnt from swimming its almost the opposite of running you want to slow them down and not speed them up. They are good to teach you to get your candense up. first you match it to your current candense and then you work on boasting it up just a little at a time and before you know it your there. If your tall like me though 85 is about what you seem to need. Only way I can do 90 is if I am running a 10 minute mile which is currently too fast for me but maybe its what I need to do. |
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