General Discussion Triathlon Talk » Cyclists that run red lights Rss Feed  
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2007-07-12 1:05 PM

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Elite
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Renton, Washington
Subject: Cyclists that run red lights

This may have been brought up before. Sorry if it has.  I am seeing so many cyclists run red lights these days and I'm getting increasingly pissed off about it.  Not only is it idiotic but it's illegal.  Yesterday I was stopped at an intersection when a guy blew through the light. He didn't even bother to slow down! He was narrowly missed by a guy on a scooter. The cyclists flipped him off shouting obscenities at the person on the scooter! I was gobsmacked.  I've started honking at bikers now just out of anger/disappointment. Don't they understand how dangerous it is!?

 

This is mostly just a rant. I only recently started biking on the road and I do always stop at lights (except for those free rights)  But I'm not perfect. Just annoyed...........



2007-07-12 1:21 PM
in reply to: #883223

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Master
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St. Louis
Subject: RE: Cyclists that run red lights
I always stop at lights, but I must admit, if there is no traffic, I will then proceed through. I consider myself half-pedestrian half-car when I am on the road cycling.
2007-07-12 1:29 PM
in reply to: #883223

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Rocklin
Subject: RE: Cyclists that run red lights
Where I ride there are a number of lights that will not change for a cyclist (only cars) since we don't trigger the weight sensor (no cross-walks either, not that I would use one). I don't run them per se, but there are lots of times I have to go through a red.

I must admit though, I run stop signs all the time where I can see the intersection or a car shields me from getting hit (i.e. the car leaves the line just before me).,

I had a guy in a car chase me down once to tell me to stop at a sign (I didn't cut him off or anything, he just wanted to play cop). It was everything I could do not to tell him off in front of his little kids.

Personally, I think you should leave the law enforcement to the police. Don't take some random rider's stupidity personally (they know how dangerous it is), it could get you into a road rage situation that's not worth it.

Have you ever seen a bike messenger in the city? Now that's some stupidity.
2007-07-12 1:34 PM
in reply to: #883282

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Champion
10018
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, Minnesota
Bronze member
Subject: RE: Cyclists that run red lights

I agree, I'm annoyed whenever I see a cyclist not obeying the law.  It causes bad vibes on all levels and creates a more dangerous ride. 

2007-07-12 1:42 PM
in reply to: #883282

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Sensei
Sin City
Subject: RE: Cyclists that run red lights
aggiecatcher - 2007-07-12 11:29 AM

Where I ride there are a number of lights that will not change for a cyclist (only cars) since we don't trigger the weight sensor (no cross-walks either, not that I would use one). I don't run them per se, but there are lots of times I have to go through a red.

I must admit though, I run stop signs all the time where I can see the intersection or a car shields me from getting hit (i.e. the car leaves the line just before me).,

I had a guy in a car chase me down once to tell me to stop at a sign (I didn't cut him off or anything, he just wanted to play cop). It was everything I could do not to tell him off in front of his little kids.

Personally, I think you should leave the law enforcement to the police. Don't take some random rider's stupidity personally (they know how dangerous it is), it could get you into a road rage situation that's not worth it.

Have you ever seen a bike messenger in the city? Now that's some stupidity.


I do the same things. I tend to ride in areas with less traffic, so if there is nothing around - I run it. But if there is ANY doubt or any other traffic - I don't.

P.S. - the sensors are not based on weight and are actually called "loop detectors" They create a magnetic field that gets disrupted when a large piece of metal is on top of them. That is why they don't work on bikes - there is not enough metal on them. They sometimes don't work for motorcyles either (from first hand experience).

Not trying to call you out - just thought you might like that piece of trivia....
2007-07-12 1:44 PM
in reply to: #883282

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Sneaky Slow
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Herndon, VA,
Subject: RE: Cyclists that run red lights

aggiecatcher - 2007-07-12 2:29 PM Where I ride there are a number of lights that will not change for a cyclist (only cars) since we don't trigger the weight sensor

I don't think it is a weight sensor, it is actually a magnet.  I don't think that's really germane to anything, just thought I'd mention it.



2007-07-12 1:48 PM
in reply to: #883223

Expert
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Subject: RE: Cyclists that run red lights
I run signs / lights in 2 cases:

1. Right by my house on my regular ride, there is a curve with a 3-way intersection and a stoplight. On my way out I simply hug the curb and don't actually cross any traffic in that intersection... I'm on the 4th side with no crossing road. I slow down, make sure nobody is going to be affected, and then sneak through
2. On the country roads that I ride where you see 1 car every 5 mintues or so, I slow down at stop signs, take a good look, and go on through if I'm clear

Everywhere else, I act as if I'm one of the cars. I hope what I'm doing isn't too annoying, but anytime I'm in traffic with vehicles I'm probably the most conservative person on the road.
2007-07-12 1:49 PM
in reply to: #883223

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Expert
1035
100025
lake forest, California
Subject: RE: Cyclists that run red lights

Seriously- aren't there better things to worry about? I mean why get worked up over someone elses actions? I absolutely hate smokers that flip thier cigs out the window when they're done but I never consider chasing them down and I certainly don't flip them off. Cell phone drivers or make-up applyers while driving annoy me too. We all do things that annoy someone else. Thats the beauty of individuality.

I run red lights on my bike when I feel its safe too-

2007-07-12 1:51 PM
in reply to: #883333

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Elite
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Renton, Washington
Subject: RE: Cyclists that run red lights
jbjboc - 2007-07-12 11:49 AM

Seriously- aren't there better things to worry about? I mean why get worked up over someone elses actions? I absolutely hate smokers that flip thier cigs out the window when they're done but I never consider chasing them down and I certainly don't flip them off. Cell phone drivers or make-up applyers while driving annoy me too. We all do things that annoy someone else. Thats the beauty of individuality.

I run red lights on my bike when I feel its safe too-

 

Because if WE, as car drivers did it, we'd get a ticket! If I'm in my car sitting at the lights and no one else is there do I go? Nooooooooooo of course I don't.  Why should bikers get off Scot free!? They have to obey to road rules just as drivers do and that goes for chatting on yer cell phone while cycling too. Flipping cigs out of your window here is also a crime and $101 ticket if you get caught. You should chase them down, it's one of the reasons so many brush fires are started.



Edited by ScotinSeattle 2007-07-12 1:52 PM
2007-07-12 1:57 PM
in reply to: #883223

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Elite
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Renton, Washington
Subject: RE: Cyclists that run red lights

Just came across this:

 

If you are in the habit of running red lights then we would like you to consider this:

Running a red light may have a small impact on your journey time but...

1. It's potentially dangerous.

You may get hurt. Others may get hurt - either directly by you, or by the effect of another vehicle having to take evasive action.
The consequences of this could be fatal.


2. It annoys just about everyone.

There is a rising tide of hostility towards cyclists - evident on the streets, in the media and in the political process.


3. It has an impact on the general attitude towards cyclists.

  • It directly affects the way that we are treated every day on the streets by other road users.
    As a vulnerable road user, how would you like to be treated?
  • It directly affects our chance of enhancing our status as road users under the law.
    A bicycle is classed as a vehicle like any other. Everyone knows that this leads to absurdities and anomalies in the way that the law is applied to cyclists in practice. Cycle campaigners are lobbying hard to remedy this; but politicians are unlikely to sign up to enhancing the legal status of an unpopular group of lawbreaking social outcasts.
  • It also undermines our chances of getting improved facilities.
    Better cycle routes are usually funded by taxpayer's money. How can we make a case for better funding when our image in the media is of a group that shows comtempt for the law and for other road users?
We believe that an individual cyclist's behaviour can make a difference, so we are politely asking you to consider the consequences of your behaviour - please think globally when you cycle locally.

Besides, what's the hurry? You already ride the fastest vehicle in town!

 

2007-07-12 2:00 PM
in reply to: #883223

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Champion
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Fountain Hills, AZ
Subject: RE: Cyclists that run red lights
Guilty, but only out in the desert when I come to a light where I can see unubstructed for about 5 miles in ALL directions and I am the only sole around. Otherwise I aways stop, though I do roll right on reds carefully.


2007-07-12 2:09 PM
in reply to: #883223

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Champion
15211
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Southern Chicago Suburbs, IL
Subject: RE: Cyclists that run red lights
Does a "Hollywood Stop" count?

Sorry. I must have done a 1/2 dozen runs this morning. It was about 6 am, and it was always from a big slowdown from my top end speed. In other words, I drop down to about 5-6 mph, check and see that no one is coming from a long way away and then go. IF I can't make it with a large margin of safety, then I stop.

Now, just blowing through them, that's an entirely different story.
2007-07-12 2:12 PM
in reply to: #883365

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Sensei
Sin City
Subject: RE: Cyclists that run red lights
ScotinSeatle,

You make very good points. I am going to make a conscience effort to change my ways when I get the urge to run a light. Rare, but it happens.

thx
2007-07-12 2:14 PM
in reply to: #883223

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Pro
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MA
Subject: RE: Cyclists that run red lights

A wrong is a wrong.  If you choose to do a wrong act, don't get pissed off when others are startled/angry by the act. 

If I run a stop sign, it was my down damn fault to get yelled at.  Just my 2 cents. 

 

2007-07-12 2:18 PM
in reply to: #883223

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Champion
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Butler
Subject: RE: Cyclists that run red lights
I must admit that I do roll through stop/traffic light if there are no cars around but I have to have a large gap before I will consider it.  This is part of the reason I try to stick to riding on a trail as opposed to the road.  I don't like to stop.  We can't stop in a race so I try to avoid it in training.
2007-07-12 2:36 PM
in reply to: #883420

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Regular
77
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Manassas, VA
Subject: RE: Cyclists that run red lights

I admit, I'm guilty of rolling through when traffic is light or nonexistent, although I'm less likely to roll through a light than a sign.  First, I always set up as though I'm going to stop, so that I can if I have to.  With no traffic (early a.m. on weekend, residential streets), I'll slow to a near stop while looking both ways.  Or, if it's really obviously clear, I'll roll a slow right turn w/ no stop.  With light to moderate or greater traffic, I definitely practice vehicular cycling.

Basically I'll always ride like I can get squished like a bug.  Sitting around solo in the middle of the road at a light or a sign is just asking to get mowed down by a driver who isn't paying attention.  Blowing lights w/o the ability to stop, at any speed (5-10mph or more) is imho crazy, regardless of time, but I don't see getting really worked up over it. 

Now, about cyclists who ride on the sidewalk when I'm trying to run or walk with my kids.  THAT's something I get worked up about



2007-07-12 2:43 PM
in reply to: #883223

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Master
3127
2000100010025
Sunny Southern Cal
Subject: RE: Cyclists that run red lights

Stop Signs:   Going downhill and flat, generally I do a track stand and stop completely.  Downhill seems the most dangerous, because last-moment stopping is more difficult.  Uphill, if no traffic, I slow to maybe 3 mph and go if it's clear, otherwise trackstand and wait my turn.  There are a couple stop signs in residential areas where it's a three-way intersection and/or I have good visibility and my speeds are moderate, so sometimes I roll those ones if it's completely clear.

Red Lights: If I can trigger the light, either by loop or an easily accessible pedestrian button, I wait.  If cars are going the same direction and will trigger it for me, I wait.  If I can't trigger the light, I will go when there is no risk of from traffic.  Sorry, but if the infrastructure isn't built to accommodate my bicycle, there are not many options.  If I were in a car and the light wouldn't trigger, I wouldn't get out of my car and walk across lanes to the pedestrian button.

I just finished working with the city traffic engineer to improve the loop sensitivity on a couple lights, and now I can trigger them from my bike.  Depending on the municipality, you might find that to be the best approach.  They can't always dial things up enough to make it work for bikes, but it's worth the effort if it is a problem light on your regular route.

Earlier this week while driving, I nearly collided with a cyclist at 5:30 am when he blew through a four-way stop at good speed directly in front of me.  Dumb. 

I had a close call riding once about a year ago when I braked too late for a stop sign on a steep downhill.  I am far more cautious now.  I got lucky, the driver was paying attention.

2007-07-12 2:44 PM
in reply to: #883223

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Pro
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Husker Nation
Subject: RE: Cyclists that run red lights
# but politicians are unlikely to sign up to enhancing the legal status of an unpopular group of lawbreaking social outcasts.
# It also undermines our chances of getting improved facilities.
Better cycle routes are usually funded by taxpayer's money. How can we make a case for better funding when our image in the media is of a group that shows comtempt for the law and for other road users?

Those are probably the two best reasons I've heard to date about running lights and riding negligently. Not that I ride negligently, but as many above have said if I feel it's safe [edit: to run a red light] I do it [and I DON'T blow through them]

Now, honking at a fellow cyclist strictly because you're frustrated? What does that honestly accomplish? Let's say someone in a Jeep cut you off. Do you go around honking at all the Jeeps because of one bonehead? Of course not. I was on the paved shoulder of a medium-traffic highway [where I see many a cyclist] with my brother-in-law and we got honked at twice, for no readily apparent reason other than the fact that we were cyclists riding along the highway. In case the people doing the honking thought it was unsafe or illegal... we rode by the same state patrolman 3 times over 50 minutes and another patrol car. Neither of them thought we were out of line, or at least not enough to say anything!

Edited by Bripod 2007-07-12 2:45 PM
2007-07-12 2:50 PM
in reply to: #883223

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Member
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virginia beach
Subject: RE: Cyclists that run red lights
first off, you probably shouldnt honk at a cyclist, personally I can't stand that! If there is a bike path or crosswalk across the intersection of the red light and there arent any cars crossing why the hell would you stop your bike. that just sounds crazy to me.
2007-07-12 2:56 PM
in reply to: #883320

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Champion
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the colony texas
Subject: RE: Cyclists that run red lights
newLeaf - 2007-07-12 1:44 PM

aggiecatcher - 2007-07-12 2:29 PM Where I ride there are a number of lights that will not change for a cyclist (only cars) since we don't trigger the weight sensor

I don't think it is a weight sensor, it is actually a magnet.  I don't think that's really germane to anything, just thought I'd mention it.

OFF TOPIC--> you can get this little device that will trigger the magnet to work the light. I have one for my motorcycle since I got annoyed waiting for the light. I"d more likely get a ticket on the motorcycle then bicycle.

sorry for the sidebar

2007-07-12 2:59 PM
in reply to: #883263

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Cycling Guru
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Fulton, MD
Subject: RE: Cyclists that run red lights

ranger5oh - 2007-07-12 2:21 PM I always stop at lights, but I must admit, if there is no traffic, I will then proceed through. I consider myself half-pedestrian half-car when I am on the road cycling.

Ditto.



2007-07-12 3:22 PM
in reply to: #883460

Member
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Montgomery, AL
Subject: RE: Cyclists that run red lights
dallairelj - 2007-07-12 1:36 PM

Now, about cyclists who ride on the sidewalk when I'm trying to run or walk with my kids.  THAT's something I get worked up about



Not to side-track this thread, but I almost got run down last night on the side walk by 3 teenagers in a golf cart. It was 10pm and dark, I turn the corner around some shrubs and all I can see is two bright headlights coming at me at about 10 to 15 mph. I jump off of the sidewalk, in just enough time to avoid getting plowed over. They looked back at me, but didn't even slow down. Pissed me off.
2007-07-12 3:31 PM
in reply to: #883223

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Rocklin
Subject: RE: Cyclists that run red lights
Wow, magnets, no wonder my carbon fiber road bike doesn't set it off.

I don't stop at all reds, but I never "blow" lights. I only roll signs when its totally clear (its pretty flat here, so there are places you can see for miles), or when i have a car as a blocker. As for lights, they are usually at intersections that aren't a good risk to run so I stop.

As for people telling me how to ride, my position remains to mind you own business unless you have a badge (then just ignore me). I think you should wear helmets, but I never yell at people not wearing them.

I don't think we will be getting more or less bike lines because of the popular voters being unhappy about stop sign runners. Sorry, I can't imagine CA voters ever voting against more alternative transportion infrastructure.

Honk at me and you might get the finger if I'm in a bad mood...just being honest.
2007-07-12 3:40 PM
in reply to: #883502

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northeast Ohio
Subject: RE: Cyclists that run red lights

AdrEnaLineRuSh - 2007-07-12 3:50 PM If there is a bike path or crosswalk across the intersection of the red light and there arent any cars crossing why the hell would you stop your bike. that just sounds crazy to me.

Because in most states bikes are considered vehicles.  Stopping at a red light is the law.  Unless you get off and walk and then you are a pedestrian.  Just because a bike path/lane crosses an intersection doesn't mean cyclists are free to run red lights or stop signs.

I will admit that I am indeed not perfect ( ), but I will almost always at least come to a complete stop at a red light.  I do it mainly for adding good karma for bicyclists.  I am just trying to be good so motor vehicle drivers can see what good bicycling looks like.  Many times I come up to a red light that I could easily pass through because there is only traffic far in the distance, but I will stop and wait.  If that car off in the distance passes through the intersection and sees a bicyclist obeying traffic laws that is good karma for all bicyclists!    For whatever reason, I am more apt to roll through a stop sign, but I always slow down to a near complete stop before going.   Of course I do that in my car too.  Yikes!

Sometimes when we are in a group that people associate with being rude, dangerous, illegal or having bad etiquette, sometimes you have to go out of your way to follow the letter of the law and be polite.  It's the ol' catching more flies with honey routine.

2007-07-12 3:41 PM
in reply to: #883223

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Expert
1105
1000100
Milwaukee, WI
Subject: RE: Cyclists that run red lights
The first time I joined some co-workers on a group ride, they told me the rule is "blow through stop signs but stop at all stop lights". When approaching a stop sign, they check pretty closely before blowing through. Seems to work well...my $.02.
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