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2007-12-31 7:04 AM

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Elite
2493
2000100100100100252525
Chicago, IL
Subject: Smoke-Free Illinois Act January 2008
Section 15. Smoking in public places, places of employment,
and governmental vehicles prohibited. No person shall smoke in
a public place or in any place of employment or within 15 feet
of any entrance to a public place or place of employment. No
person may smoke in any vehicle owned, leased, or operated by
the State or a political subdivision of the State. Smoking is
prohibited in indoor public places and workplaces unless

specifically exempted by Section 35 of this Act.

This means that no more smoking in any restauarant, regardless if there is a bar or not.... yay!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  Up until now, if there was a bar in the restaurant, there was still some smoking allowed.  Also some small type private owned restaurants still allowed smoking.  I hated this... you would go into a small restaurant during an early morning bike ride, and you'd have to breathe in that crap if you wanted to have a cup of coffee, ewwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww!

but not after today!!, any restaurant.... regardless of ownership and regardless if there is a bar, smoking is prohibited!!  I will never have to smell that stinky stuff again while eating.... yay!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



2007-12-31 7:09 AM
in reply to: #1123919

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Extreme Veteran
930
50010010010010025
Fort Worth, TX
Subject: RE: Smoke-Free Illinois Act January 2008
Ditto in Fort Worth starting in 2008. Now I can pop into a restaurant or tavern for a quick toddy and not smell like I"ve been living there.
2007-12-31 7:58 AM
in reply to: #1123919

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Master
2447
200010010010010025
White Oak, Texas
Subject: RE: Smoke-Free Illinois Act January 2008

First let me say I think smoking is a nasty disgusting habit, my Father, Mother, and Grandmother all smoked when I was a kid in the house, in the car, and quite a lot.  I did not know just how bad it smelled until I joined the Navy and moved out of the house then when I came home WOW it was bad.  My Grandmother died of smoking related illnesses and my father is experiencing problems now as well.  What may shock many of you these smoking bans are just plain wrong! A restaurant or bars are private property someone owns them and the owner should decide to allow smoking or not to not the government.  You and I have the choice to eat or drink at one of these establishments we are not forced to go there just as the employees have a choice to work there or not to.  I am 45 and during the 27 years I have been paying attention to political and social issues (yes at 18 I was interested) we as a nation have turned to the government more and more to correct all of our personal issues, smoking is the first of a long line of government interventions into the personal habits of Americans.  Why do we continue to applaud as the government takes away bit by bit our liberty and rights to personal choice.  This Socialism can be found in many other areas of our day to day lives as well.  Our kids are fat so let’s regulate serving size and content of public school lunch (if you think this is good go to a public school and eat lunch then decide) people are losing their homes we need the government to make it better (If you go too far in debt why is it my responsibility to pay your way)I can add many more but will not just look at your day to day live and see what is regulated and controlled.  If smoking is legal you should be allowed to smoke on private property isn’t that why we own property? so we can control what goes on?  And if I find the skink of tobacco smoke revolting than I can choose to go where the owner does not allow it that is freedom of choice.   Wake up people the more power you give the government to enforce your will on others the more you give it to regulate your choices as well.

I know what I am saying is unpopular and that makes me sad and a concerned because I think in 30 to 40 more years we will simply choose the leaders who will make all choices for us.

 

Clifford Barnes

2007-12-31 8:17 AM
in reply to: #1123919

User image

Champion
15211
500050005000100100
Southern Chicago Suburbs, IL
Subject: RE: Smoke-Free Illinois Act January 2008
Why don't they just make smoking illegal?  If it is "our health" they are so concerned about then take the next logical step.  Heck, there are two cities in California that are trying to make it illegal to smoke in your own house! 
2007-12-31 8:34 AM
in reply to: #1123919

User image

Pro
6838
5000100050010010010025
Tejas
Subject: RE: Smoke-Free Illinois Act January 2008
 What goes next? I'm guessing the right to bear arms.
2007-12-31 8:38 AM
in reply to: #1123964

User image

Elite
3519
20001000500
San Jose, CA
Subject: RE: Smoke-Free Illinois Act January 2008
CBarnes - 2007-12-31 5:58 AM

First let me say I think smoking is a nasty disgusting habit, my Father, Mother, and Grandmother all smoked when I was a kid in the house, in the car, and quite a lot.  I did not know just how bad it smelled until I joined the Navy and moved out of the house then when I came home WOW it was bad.  My Grandmother died of smoking related illnesses and my father is experiencing problems now as well.  What may shock many of you these smoking bans are just plain wrong! A restaurant or bars are private property someone owns them and the owner should decide to allow smoking or not to not the government.  You and I have the choice to eat or drink at one of these establishments we are not forced to go there just as the employees have a choice to work there or not to.  I am 45 and during the 27 years I have been paying attention to political and social issues (yes at 18 I was interested) we as a nation have turned to the government more and more to correct all of our personal issues, smoking is the first of a long line of government interventions into the personal habits of Americans.  Why do we continue to applaud as the government takes away bit by bit our liberty and rights to personal choice.  This Socialism can be found in many other areas of our day to day lives as well.  Our kids are fat so let’s regulate serving size and content of public school lunch (if you think this is good go to a public school and eat lunch then decide) people are losing their homes we need the government to make it better (If you go too far in debt why is it my responsibility to pay your way)I can add many more but will not just look at your day to day live and see what is regulated and controlled.  If smoking is legal you should be allowed to smoke on private property isn’t that why we own property? so we can control what goes on?  And if I find the skink of tobacco smoke revolting than I can choose to go where the owner does not allow it that is freedom of choice.   Wake up people the more power you give the government to enforce your will on others the more you give it to regulate your choices as well.

I know what I am saying is unpopular and that makes me sad and a concerned because I think in 30 to 40 more years we will simply choose the leaders who will make all choices for us.

Clifford Barnes

We have had this discussion before.  I am very conflicted on the issue.  I side with you on the fact that it is private property but I have a bad reaction to smoke.  not life threatening like some people I know, but I have to labor to breath.  Funny thing is, my mom and my SO smoke.  Mother is going to try (AGAIN) to quite after the first because of health issues.  But with your reasoning, a resteraunt could serve whatever they wanted too including rotten and spoiled food...and of course after eating there and getting sick (or someone dying) we could choose not to go.  But we have health inspections of establishments to gauruntee the greater publics safety...why should we not strive for the same air quality in a place as we do for food safety.   I will also add, the current idea that some california towns are now concidering of banning smoking in all rental properties I think are wrong, unless smoking is made illegal (which wouldn't crush me), I think is wrong.  There is a difference of a privately owned establishment which is open to the public and the place were you live.  If the owner of the house / apartment complex wants to designate it as non smoking that is different, but to regulate all rental properties as smoke free is crossing the line...ok officially babbling now.



2007-12-31 8:43 AM
in reply to: #1124022

User image

Champion
15211
500050005000100100
Southern Chicago Suburbs, IL
Subject: RE: Smoke-Free Illinois Act January 2008
runningwoof - 2007-12-31 8:38 AM
CBarnes - 2007-12-31 5:58 AM

First let me say I think smoking is a nasty disgusting habit, my Father, Mother, and Grandmother all smoked when I was a kid in the house, in the car, and quite a lot.  I did not know just how bad it smelled until I joined the Navy and moved out of the house then when I came home WOW it was bad.  My Grandmother died of smoking related illnesses and my father is experiencing problems now as well.  What may shock many of you these smoking bans are just plain wrong! A restaurant or bars are private property someone owns them and the owner should decide to allow smoking or not to not the government.  You and I have the choice to eat or drink at one of these establishments we are not forced to go there just as the employees have a choice to work there or not to.  I am 45 and during the 27 years I have been paying attention to political and social issues (yes at 18 I was interested) we as a nation have turned to the government more and more to correct all of our personal issues, smoking is the first of a long line of government interventions into the personal habits of Americans.  Why do we continue to applaud as the government takes away bit by bit our liberty and rights to personal choice.  This Socialism can be found in many other areas of our day to day lives as well.  Our kids are fat so let’s regulate serving size and content of public school lunch (if you think this is good go to a public school and eat lunch then decide) people are losing their homes we need the government to make it better (If you go too far in debt why is it my responsibility to pay your way)I can add many more but will not just look at your day to day live and see what is regulated and controlled.  If smoking is legal you should be allowed to smoke on private property isn’t that why we own property? so we can control what goes on?  And if I find the skink of tobacco smoke revolting than I can choose to go where the owner does not allow it that is freedom of choice.   Wake up people the more power you give the government to enforce your will on others the more you give it to regulate your choices as well.

I know what I am saying is unpopular and that makes me sad and a concerned because I think in 30 to 40 more years we will simply choose the leaders who will make all choices for us.

Clifford Barnes

We have had this discussion before.  I am very conflicted on the issue.  I side with you on the fact that it is private property but I have a bad reaction to smoke.  not life threatening like some people I know, but I have to labor to breath.  Funny thing is, my mom and my SO smoke.  Mother is going to try (AGAIN) to quite after the first because of health issues.  But with your reasoning, a resteraunt could serve whatever they wanted too including rotten and spoiled food...and of course after eating there and getting sick (or someone dying) we could choose not to go.  But we have health inspections of establishments to gauruntee the greater publics safety...why should we not strive for the same air quality in a place as we do for food safety.   I will also add, the current idea that some california towns are now concidering of banning smoking in all rental properties I think are wrong, unless smoking is made illegal (which wouldn't crush me), I think is wrong.  There is a difference of a privately owned establishment which is open to the public and the place were you live.  If the owner of the house / apartment complex wants to designate it as non smoking that is different, but to regulate all rental properties as smoke free is crossing the line...ok officially babbling now.

Make certain you are comparing apples to apples.  Cigarettes are a legal product.  Spoiled/bad food is not.  By law those "products" are considered adulterated. 

2007-12-31 8:58 AM
in reply to: #1123919

User image

Champion
6931
5000100050010010010010025
Bellingham, Washington
Subject: RE: Smoke-Free Illinois Act January 2008
Washington State has been doing this for over a year now.  Really screwed up some of the drinking bars.  People go outside and huddle in the cold and puff on cigs than go back inside and drink some more....repeat.    Except for the Indian Casinos, they get away with not having to follow the rules the rest of the state has to follow.
2007-12-31 9:10 AM
in reply to: #1124031

User image

Elite
3519
20001000500
San Jose, CA
Subject: RE: Smoke-Free Illinois Act January 2008
crowny2 - 2007-12-31 6:43 AM
runningwoof - 2007-12-31 8:38 AM

Make certain you are comparing apples to apples.  Cigarettes are a legal product.  Spoiled/bad food is not.  By law those "products" are considered adulterated. 

But according to the new law, smoking in certain spaces is now concidered illegal.  I am sure at some point in history, food establishments were unregulated.  And at some point the government stepped in for the general welfare of the public.  Which is what they are doing now with cigarette smoke.  My point was, should privately owned establishments be able to do what ever they want.  Which is what I read in the post I was applying to.  In california, we have been smoke free in restraunts and bars for some time.  Again, I am conflicted on the issue. 

2007-12-31 9:24 AM
in reply to: #1123991

Subject: ...
This user's post has been ignored.
2007-12-31 9:24 AM
in reply to: #1124107

Champion
15211
500050005000100100
Southern Chicago Suburbs, IL
Subject: RE: Smoke-Free Illinois Act January 2008
runningwoof - 2007-12-31 9:10 AM
crowny2 - 2007-12-31 6:43 AM
runningwoof - 2007-12-31 8:38 AM

Make certain you are comparing apples to apples.  Cigarettes are a legal product.  Spoiled/bad food is not.  By law those "products" are considered adulterated. 

But according to the new law, smoking in certain spaces is now concidered illegal.  I am sure at some point in history, food establishments were unregulated.  And at some point the government stepped in for the general welfare of the public.  Which is what they are doing now with cigarette smoke.  My point was, should privately owned establishments be able to do what ever they want.  Which is what I read in the post I was applying to.  In california, we have been smoke free in restraunts and bars for some time.  Again, I am conflicted on the issue. 

I understand your conflict.  At the core of it I find it incredibly hypocritical.  If they are so concerned with the health of the nation, ban the stuff.  I used to smoke.  I don't anymore.  I don't particularly like coming out of place smelling like smoke, but it was MY decision to go there, not theirs. 

My concern too, to the extreme, is when will it stop?  Like you mentioned above, they are attempting to do it in residences.  Are you kidding me? 

But you know why they will never make the stuff illegal.  They make too much money on the taxes. 



2007-12-31 9:41 AM
in reply to: #1123919

Master
2808
2000500100100100
, Minnesota
Subject: RE: Smoke-Free Illinois Act January 2008
The entire state of Minnesota just went smoke free in the Fall of 07. Countywide bans existed prior to that, but we went statewide to get ride of county line battles.

Groundwork:
--With the exception of bachelor parties, I've never smoked.
--I know plenty of people that smoke, and don't understand it from a purely financial position.
--I've known from Jr high that smoking is bad for you - as I could outrun the 'burnouts' when playing sports.
--I have had relatives that smoke die of emphasema/lung problems.
--I really like smoke-free establishments, but I went prior to the ban and lived with the smoke.
--Going smoke free doesn't make me go out more.

I think it's a shame that the state has to use worker protection laws to regulate something that the free market should take care of on its own.

If you had told me 30 yrs ago that smoking wouldn't be allowed in bars, I'd have said you're nuts! I think it's a case of 'boiling the frog', primarly because people that smoke don't have the #'s to drive the agenda. Let's say 25% of the voting population smokes. Of that, less than half vote, and viturally none are politically active so there's little chance that their views will ever be represented.

Smoking and health insurance costs are a whole 'nother subject, but in a nutshell I think smokers ought to pay a significantly higher price for their insurance - similar to how we hammer the teenage drivers.

2007-12-31 10:02 AM
in reply to: #1124201

Champion
6539
5000100050025
South Jersey
Subject: RE: Smoke-Free Illinois Act January 2008

I think it's great. Both NJ and Philly are smoke-free and I LOOOOVVVVEEEE it.

2007-12-31 10:03 AM
in reply to: #1123964

Veteran
325
10010010025
Subject: RE: Smoke-Free Illinois Act January 2008
CBarnes - 2007-12-31 8:58 AM

First let me say I think smoking is a nasty disgusting habit, my Father, Mother, and Grandmother all smoked when I was a kid in the house, in the car, and quite a lot. I did not know just how bad it smelled until I joined the Navy and moved out of the house then when I came home WOW it was bad. My Grandmother died of smoking related illnesses and my father is experiencing problems now as well. What may shock many of you these smoking bans are just plain wrong! A restaurant or bars are private property someone owns them and the owner should decide to allow smoking or not to not the government. You and I have the choice to eat or drink at one of these establishments we are not forced to go there just as the employees have a choice to work there or not to. I am 45 and during the 27 years I have been paying attention to political and social issues (yes at 18 I was interested) we as a nation have turned to the government more and more to correct all of our personal issues, smoking is the first of a long line of government interventions into the personal habits of Americans. Why do we continue to applaud as the government takes away bit by bit our liberty and rights to personal choice. This Socialism can be found in many other areas of our day to day lives as well. Our kids are fat so let’s regulate serving size and content of public school lunch (if you think this is good go to a public school and eat lunch then decide) people are losing their homes we need the government to make it better (If you go too far in debt why is it my responsibility to pay your way)I can add many more but will not just look at your day to day live and see what is regulated and controlled. If smoking is legal you should be allowed to smoke on private property isn’t that why we own property? so we can control what goes on? And if I find the skink of tobacco smoke revolting than I can choose to go where the owner does not allow it that is freedom of choice. Wake up people the more power you give the government to enforce your will on others the more you give it to regulate your choices as well.

I know what I am saying is unpopular and that makes me sad and a concerned because I think in 30 to 40 more years we will simply choose the leaders who will make all choices for us.

Clifford Barnes




Excellent post. I agree with you 100%. Nothing gets me worked up more than the ever increasing encroachment of the nanny state.
2007-12-31 10:05 AM
in reply to: #1123919

Extreme Veteran
348
10010010025
Houston, Texas
Subject: RE: Smoke-Free Illinois Act January 2008
I think smoking should be banned in any public place except in a casino. In places of business you've already or will soon consume a product (alcohol and food) but in a casino you are constantly consuming (slots and tables). By banning smoking in a casino you would essentially be hurting the economy to where as in a restaurant or bar you're not. This is a good thing for Illinois and one I wish the entire state of Texas would adopt.

If the police wanted to make quite a bit of cash then they'd start handing out fines for smoking next to an entrance but the place would need to mark where 15 feet is.
2007-12-31 10:08 AM
in reply to: #1124201

Subject: RE: Smoke-Free Illinois Act January 2008

leapdog - 2007-12-31 10:41 AM I know plenty of people that smoke, and don't understand it from a purely financial position. 

Heh.  This also describes how I feel about people who buy lattes at Starbuck's.

And personally, smoke-free bars DO make me go out to them more often. 



Edited by DMW 2007-12-31 10:09 AM


2007-12-31 10:10 AM
in reply to: #1124281

Champion
15211
500050005000100100
Southern Chicago Suburbs, IL
Subject: RE: Smoke-Free Illinois Act January 2008

Super T - 2007-12-31 10:05 AM I think smoking should be banned in any public place except in a casino. In places of business you've already or will soon consume a product (alcohol and food) but in a casino you are constantly consuming (slots and tables). By banning smoking in a casino you would essentially be hurting the economy to where as in a restaurant or bar you're not. This is a good thing for Illinois and one I wish the entire state of Texas would adopt. If the police wanted to make quite a bit of cash then they'd start handing out fines for smoking next to an entrance but the place would need to mark where 15 feet is.

Yeah. Just what the police need to do.  Stand outside establishments and fine people for smoking.  What a great use of their time.

2007-12-31 10:13 AM
in reply to: #1123919

Subject: RE: Smoke-Free Illinois Act January 2008

Leapdog - health insurance companies ARE starting to charge more for smokers.  This is up to the individual employer though.  They are also giving money back to people who get dental cleanings, yearly checkups, join weight watchers or disease management programs, all sorts of things.  I think this is going to become more popular. 

2007-12-31 10:15 AM
in reply to: #1123964

Elite
2493
2000100100100100252525
Chicago, IL
Subject: RE: Smoke-Free Illinois Act January 2008
CBarnes - 2007-12-31 7:58 AM

First let me say I think smoking is a nasty disgusting habit, my Father, Mother, and Grandmother all smoked when I was a kid in the house, in the car, and quite a lot.  I did not know just how bad it smelled until I joined the Navy and moved out of the house then when I came home WOW it was bad.  My Grandmother died of smoking related illnesses and my father is experiencing problems now as well.  What may shock many of you these smoking bans are just plain wrong! A restaurant or bars are private property someone owns them and the owner should decide to allow smoking or not to not the government.  You and I have the choice to eat or drink at one of these establishments we are not forced to go there just as the employees have a choice to work there or not to.  I am 45 and during the 27 years I have been paying attention to political and social issues (yes at 18 I was interested) we as a nation have turned to the government more and more to correct all of our personal issues, smoking is the first of a long line of government interventions into the personal habits of Americans.  Why do we continue to applaud as the government takes away bit by bit our liberty and rights to personal choice.  This Socialism can be found in many other areas of our day to day lives as well.  Our kids are fat so let’s regulate serving size and content of public school lunch (if you think this is good go to a public school and eat lunch then decide) people are losing their homes we need the government to make it better (If you go too far in debt why is it my responsibility to pay your way)I can add many more but will not just look at your day to day live and see what is regulated and controlled.  If smoking is legal you should be allowed to smoke on private property isn’t that why we own property? so we can control what goes on?  And if I find the skink of tobacco smoke revolting than I can choose to go where the owner does not allow it that is freedom of choice.   Wake up people the more power you give the government to enforce your will on others the more you give it to regulate your choices as well.

I know what I am saying is unpopular and that makes me sad and a concerned because I think in 30 to 40 more years we will simply choose the leaders who will make all choices for us.

Clifford Barnes

yeah I see what you're saying... when they put in more strict laws on drinking and driving, dang... how that effected our ability to live a more free life...Yell  shame on our government for trying to prolong our lives and keep us a healthier and safer country...



Edited by pigfinn 2007-12-31 10:17 AM
2007-12-31 10:17 AM
in reply to: #1124310

Champion
15211
500050005000100100
Southern Chicago Suburbs, IL
Subject: RE: Smoke-Free Illinois Act January 2008
pigfinn - 2007-12-31 10:15 AM
CBarnes - 2007-12-31 7:58 AM

First let me say I think smoking is a nasty disgusting habit, my Father, Mother, and Grandmother all smoked when I was a kid in the house, in the car, and quite a lot.  I did not know just how bad it smelled until I joined the Navy and moved out of the house then when I came home WOW it was bad.  My Grandmother died of smoking related illnesses and my father is experiencing problems now as well.  What may shock many of you these smoking bans are just plain wrong! A restaurant or bars are private property someone owns them and the owner should decide to allow smoking or not to not the government.  You and I have the choice to eat or drink at one of these establishments we are not forced to go there just as the employees have a choice to work there or not to.  I am 45 and during the 27 years I have been paying attention to political and social issues (yes at 18 I was interested) we as a nation have turned to the government more and more to correct all of our personal issues, smoking is the first of a long line of government interventions into the personal habits of Americans.  Why do we continue to applaud as the government takes away bit by bit our liberty and rights to personal choice.  This Socialism can be found in many other areas of our day to day lives as well.  Our kids are fat so let’s regulate serving size and content of public school lunch (if you think this is good go to a public school and eat lunch then decide) people are losing their homes we need the government to make it better (If you go too far in debt why is it my responsibility to pay your way)I can add many more but will not just look at your day to day live and see what is regulated and controlled.  If smoking is legal you should be allowed to smoke on private property isn’t that why we own property? so we can control what goes on?  And if I find the skink of tobacco smoke revolting than I can choose to go where the owner does not allow it that is freedom of choice.   Wake up people the more power you give the government to enforce your will on others the more you give it to regulate your choices as well.

I know what I am saying is unpopular and that makes me sad and a concerned because I think in 30 to 40 more years we will simply choose the leaders who will make all choices for us.

Clifford Barnes

yeah I see what you're saying... when they put in more strict laws on drinking and driving, dang... how that effected our ability to live a more free life...Yell  shame on our government for trying to prolong our lives and keep us a healthier and safer country... how dare they.

 

Ummm... you forgot the sarcastic font.  Oh, and you might want to make certain you are comparing apples to apples.  Those that die in drunk driving accidents due to another's actions had NO choice in the matter.  Those that don't smoke and don't want to be around those that do HAVE a choice.  It is called not going.

Thanks for playing.

2007-12-31 10:18 AM
in reply to: #1123919

Champion
5345
500010010010025
Carlsbad, California
Subject: RE: Smoke-Free Illinois Act January 2008

Yeah, your going to love it.

California has been pretty much smoke free for quite a while now. (Even our local beach is smoke free)

Our current law is 100 ft away from the entrance to any building which is very nice. We found that at 15 ft, smokers would congregate at the entrance to a building and fill the lobby/resturant full of unfiltered cancer causing smoke without regard for anyone but themselves. (Sorry, my pet peeve)

For those who wish to have a debate about the rights of individuals to kill themselves, consider that when someone who smokes decides to exercise his/her rights in public, they are also forcing those around them (Children included) to smoke also. (Without the benefit of a filter)

I for one am not willing to suffer while someone "exercises" their rights

Don't really care too much what they do in the privacy of their own home as long as they don't have children who cannot make choices for themselves.



2007-12-31 10:19 AM
in reply to: #1124316

Elite
2493
2000100100100100252525
Chicago, IL
Subject: RE: Smoke-Free Illinois Act January 2008
crowny2 - 2007-12-31 10:17 AM
pigfinn - 2007-12-31 10:15 AM
CBarnes - 2007-12-31 7:58 AM

First let me say I think smoking is a nasty disgusting habit, my Father, Mother, and Grandmother all smoked when I was a kid in the house, in the car, and quite a lot.  I did not know just how bad it smelled until I joined the Navy and moved out of the house then when I came home WOW it was bad.  My Grandmother died of smoking related illnesses and my father is experiencing problems now as well.  What may shock many of you these smoking bans are just plain wrong! A restaurant or bars are private property someone owns them and the owner should decide to allow smoking or not to not the government.  You and I have the choice to eat or drink at one of these establishments we are not forced to go there just as the employees have a choice to work there or not to.  I am 45 and during the 27 years I have been paying attention to political and social issues (yes at 18 I was interested) we as a nation have turned to the government more and more to correct all of our personal issues, smoking is the first of a long line of government interventions into the personal habits of Americans.  Why do we continue to applaud as the government takes away bit by bit our liberty and rights to personal choice.  This Socialism can be found in many other areas of our day to day lives as well.  Our kids are fat so let’s regulate serving size and content of public school lunch (if you think this is good go to a public school and eat lunch then decide) people are losing their homes we need the government to make it better (If you go too far in debt why is it my responsibility to pay your way)I can add many more but will not just look at your day to day live and see what is regulated and controlled.  If smoking is legal you should be allowed to smoke on private property isn’t that why we own property? so we can control what goes on?  And if I find the skink of tobacco smoke revolting than I can choose to go where the owner does not allow it that is freedom of choice.   Wake up people the more power you give the government to enforce your will on others the more you give it to regulate your choices as well.

I know what I am saying is unpopular and that makes me sad and a concerned because I think in 30 to 40 more years we will simply choose the leaders who will make all choices for us.

Clifford Barnes

yeah I see what you're saying... when they put in more strict laws on drinking and driving, dang... how that effected our ability to live a more free life...Yell  shame on our government for trying to prolong our lives and keep us a healthier and safer country... how dare they.

 

Ummm... you forgot the sarcastic font.  Oh, and you might want to make certain you are comparing apples to apples.  Those that die in drunk driving accidents due to another's actions had NO choice in the matter.  Those that don't smoke and don't want to be around those that do HAVE a choice.  It is called not going.

Thanks for playing.

so I have to avoid a public place because you decide to spread poison?... how is that fair?  why not take your poison to a place where it's only killing you.  doesn't it bother you that you are killing others while you are killing yourself.  oh i didn't think so.

2007-12-31 10:21 AM
in reply to: #1123919

Master
3019
20001000
West Jordan, UT
Subject: RE: Smoke-Free Illinois Act January 2008
Utah has been "smoke-free" for at least 10 years.   Can't say I mind one bit.  It is still legal in bars and clubs, but they are working on that.    Personally I don't think that smoking is the same as other harmful substances because you don't have a choice if it goes in your body.  If you are in the same room as someone who smokes, you are smoking too whether you want to or not. 
2007-12-31 10:26 AM
in reply to: #1124320

Champion
6539
5000100050025
South Jersey
Subject: RE: Smoke-Free Illinois Act January 2008
pigfinn - 2007-12-31 11:19 AM
crowny2 - 2007-12-31 10:17 AM
pigfinn - 2007-12-31 10:15 AM
CBarnes - 2007-12-31 7:58 AM

First let me say I think smoking is a nasty disgusting habit, my Father, Mother, and Grandmother all smoked when I was a kid in the house, in the car, and quite a lot.  I did not know just how bad it smelled until I joined the Navy and moved out of the house then when I came home WOW it was bad.  My Grandmother died of smoking related illnesses and my father is experiencing problems now as well.  What may shock many of you these smoking bans are just plain wrong! A restaurant or bars are private property someone owns them and the owner should decide to allow smoking or not to not the government.  You and I have the choice to eat or drink at one of these establishments we are not forced to go there just as the employees have a choice to work there or not to.  I am 45 and during the 27 years I have been paying attention to political and social issues (yes at 18 I was interested) we as a nation have turned to the government more and more to correct all of our personal issues, smoking is the first of a long line of government interventions into the personal habits of Americans.  Why do we continue to applaud as the government takes away bit by bit our liberty and rights to personal choice.  This Socialism can be found in many other areas of our day to day lives as well.  Our kids are fat so let’s regulate serving size and content of public school lunch (if you think this is good go to a public school and eat lunch then decide) people are losing their homes we need the government to make it better (If you go too far in debt why is it my responsibility to pay your way)I can add many more but will not just look at your day to day live and see what is regulated and controlled.  If smoking is legal you should be allowed to smoke on private property isn’t that why we own property? so we can control what goes on?  And if I find the skink of tobacco smoke revolting than I can choose to go where the owner does not allow it that is freedom of choice.   Wake up people the more power you give the government to enforce your will on others the more you give it to regulate your choices as well.

I know what I am saying is unpopular and that makes me sad and a concerned because I think in 30 to 40 more years we will simply choose the leaders who will make all choices for us.

Clifford Barnes

yeah I see what you're saying... when they put in more strict laws on drinking and driving, dang... how that effected our ability to live a more free life...Yell  shame on our government for trying to prolong our lives and keep us a healthier and safer country... how dare they.

 

Ummm... you forgot the sarcastic font.  Oh, and you might want to make certain you are comparing apples to apples.  Those that die in drunk driving accidents due to another's actions had NO choice in the matter.  Those that don't smoke and don't want to be around those that do HAVE a choice.  It is called not going.

Thanks for playing.

so I have to avoid a public place because you decide to spread poison?... how is that fair?  why not take your poison to a place where it's only killing you.  doesn't it bother you that you are killing others while you are killing yourself.  oh i didn't think so.

Right on! You do not know how many times I've avoided a restaurant or bar because of the smoke. Tons of times. Most people just aren't as crazy as me, choosing to stay in than to face the smoke. My not smoking doesn't hurt the smokers; smokers' smoking hurts the non-smokers. It's not fair that non-smokers either have to put up with the smoke and the negative side effects, or not go to the restaurant/bar/etc; but smokers can just go and do as they please. Now, I can sit in a bar or restaurant without getting watery eyes, coughing, and breathing in second-hand smoke, and going home with clothes and hair that needs to be immediately washed; and smokers can still go to the restaurants and bars and enjoy their food and drink and head outside for a cigarette.

2007-12-31 10:26 AM
in reply to: #1124320

Champion
15211
500050005000100100
Southern Chicago Suburbs, IL
Subject: RE: Smoke-Free Illinois Act January 2008
pigfinn - 2007-12-31 10:19 AM
crowny2 - 2007-12-31 10:17 AM
pigfinn - 2007-12-31 10:15 AM
CBarnes - 2007-12-31 7:58 AM

First let me say I think smoking is a nasty disgusting habit, my Father, Mother, and Grandmother all smoked when I was a kid in the house, in the car, and quite a lot.  I did not know just how bad it smelled until I joined the Navy and moved out of the house then when I came home WOW it was bad.  My Grandmother died of smoking related illnesses and my father is experiencing problems now as well.  What may shock many of you these smoking bans are just plain wrong! A restaurant or bars are private property someone owns them and the owner should decide to allow smoking or not to not the government.  You and I have the choice to eat or drink at one of these establishments we are not forced to go there just as the employees have a choice to work there or not to.  I am 45 and during the 27 years I have been paying attention to political and social issues (yes at 18 I was interested) we as a nation have turned to the government more and more to correct all of our personal issues, smoking is the first of a long line of government interventions into the personal habits of Americans.  Why do we continue to applaud as the government takes away bit by bit our liberty and rights to personal choice.  This Socialism can be found in many other areas of our day to day lives as well.  Our kids are fat so let’s regulate serving size and content of public school lunch (if you think this is good go to a public school and eat lunch then decide) people are losing their homes we need the government to make it better (If you go too far in debt why is it my responsibility to pay your way)I can add many more but will not just look at your day to day live and see what is regulated and controlled.  If smoking is legal you should be allowed to smoke on private property isn’t that why we own property? so we can control what goes on?  And if I find the skink of tobacco smoke revolting than I can choose to go where the owner does not allow it that is freedom of choice.   Wake up people the more power you give the government to enforce your will on others the more you give it to regulate your choices as well.

I know what I am saying is unpopular and that makes me sad and a concerned because I think in 30 to 40 more years we will simply choose the leaders who will make all choices for us.

Clifford Barnes

yeah I see what you're saying... when they put in more strict laws on drinking and driving, dang... how that effected our ability to live a more free life...Yell  shame on our government for trying to prolong our lives and keep us a healthier and safer country... how dare they.

 

Ummm... you forgot the sarcastic font.  Oh, and you might want to make certain you are comparing apples to apples.  Those that die in drunk driving accidents due to another's actions had NO choice in the matter.  Those that don't smoke and don't want to be around those that do HAVE a choice.  It is called not going.

Thanks for playing.

so I have to avoid a public place because you decide to spread poison?... how is that fair?  why not take your poison to a place where it's only killing you.  doesn't it bother you that you are killing others while you are killing yourself.  oh i didn't think so.

First, read my posts above.  I don't smoke.  I also know that I had a choice about going to places that did, or didn't, allow smoking.  That's why it is called a choice.  Mandates by the government, when it comes to choices like this, on a LEGAL product are a dangerously, slippery slope.  If you are that worried about this poison, lobby to get it banned.

Again, yes, you have a choice to go, or not to go.  The restaurant/bar etc also should have the CHOICE to be smoke free or not.  There have been plenty of places doing it BEFORE the government stepped in.  It is hypocritical.  If they really cared, they would ban it.  All they are doing is grandstanding.  Making it look like they are actually doing something. 

I associate this garbage law with Chicago banning foie-gras and NYC banning Trans Fats.  A waste of tax payer time when the government should be focusing on more pressing issues.  Namely, education, budgets and the overall corruption of our government from top to bottom (Federal, State, City, local, etc). 

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