General Discussion Triathlon Talk » Tri vs road bike : Again? Rss Feed  
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2008-06-27 6:47 AM

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Subject: Tri vs road bike : Again?
Yea, I know, we have had a lot of these threads. I just wanted to get some opinions without posting on the tail end of a long thread...

When this topic has been raised, an overwhelming number of posts said that their tri bike "made them faster" "they loved their tri bike over their road bike"... you get the idea.

Heres the question:

Of those that have gone from a road bike to a tri bike and see a measurable difference in comfort and performance, how many have gone to a comparable or lesser tri bike in terms of frame composition, components, wheels... ? It would seem that most athletes will transition to a better better bike. How much of the performance upgrade to you think comes from the better bike as opposed to being a "tri-bike"? For example going from an aluminum to a carbon frame or just an upgraded wheel set.

The reason I ask is when I started training about 8 months ago I purchased a decent road bike (Trek Madone 5.2pro) which is set up like a tri bike. Forward seat angle, aero bars... As a matter of fact we had the angle set at 78% at one point, but it was way too aggressive for my body and I needed to back it off. I need to work on my flexibility in my neck and hamstrings.

I love the idea of a tri specific bike, and really want one, but don't know if I will really benefit from it since my road bike is set up like a tri-bike and I would need to spend $4,000 + for a comparable tri bike.

The way my bike is set up I ride in aero 95% of the time. It is the most comfortable position for me.

What are your thoughts?

Edited by snowriderinfl 2008-06-27 6:49 AM


2008-06-27 6:53 AM
in reply to: #1493798

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Subject: RE: Tri vs road bike : Again?
That is a very nice road bike. It sounds like you should stick with it.
Maybe you should just take the time to test ride alot of tri-bikes, and see with one works for you. Since you have problems being in the 78deg. position. You will have to find a tribike that is adjustable. (which is the majority of them out there)
Since you already have a nice road bike, take your time, and find a tri bike that fits you perfectly. I dont have a road bike, and I just ordered my first tri bike. But, in every thread I have read about the switch from road to tri, people say they gain from 1-2avg. mph. It depends of your level of fitness, and the fit on the older bike. If you dont fit well on your road bike than switch to a professionaly fitted tribike it will make a big diffrence.
Just my .02cents....

Edited by evomike1 2008-06-27 6:58 AM
2008-06-27 9:32 AM
in reply to: #1493798

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Subject: RE: Tri vs road bike : Again?
snowriderinfl - 2008-06-27 6:47 AM

Of those that have gone from a road bike to a tri bike and see a measurable difference in comfort and performance, how many have gone to a comparable or lesser tri bike in terms of frame composition, components, wheels... ? It would seem that most athletes will transition to a better better bike. How much of the performance upgrade to you think comes from the better bike as opposed to being a "tri-bike"? For example going from an aluminum to a carbon frame or just an upgraded wheel set.


I'm not sure why people automatically assume that carbon (or titanium) is "better" than aluminum. I've ridden some really uncomfortable carbon bikes and some silky smoothe aluminum bikes. It's just not true that carbon = better in all cases.

FWIW, I ride a steel Colnago road bike with carbon rear triangle and carbon fork. I ride this mix because I wanted the steel road bike and that's how it came. Conversely, I ride an aluminum tri bike and the only carbon on it is the seatpost. It's very comfortable. It is a lower end Guru, but I ride it in every triathlon I do because I tend to be faster on it in a "time trial" situation than on my road bike. On the other hand, when I do group rides or road races, I ride the Colnago because (a) tri bikes are not allowed; and (b) I'm faster and safer in group rides on the road bike.

You asked "How much of a performance upgrade to you think comes from a better bike as opposed to being a "tri bike?" I'm not exactly sure what you mean, but I think my answer would be responsive: I think what matters MOST is the rider. The "better" bike will probably be lighter and look nicer, but in the end, a poor rider on a really nice bike won't be all that much faster than a poor rider on an entry level bike (all other things being equal). You can get more improvement from maximizing your fitness and your position than you can by getting a more expensive bike.

Bottom line is this: If your position and power are optimized on the Trek as set up, why spend the money unless you just want to have a dedicated tri bike and a dedicated road bike? Nothing wrong with that, really, but it is what it is.

My opinion? You have a really nice road bike. If you're intent on spending the money, get yourself an entry level tri bike and spend your "upgrade" money on aero wheels, an aero helmet, and a proper tri bike fitting.


Edited by Sharkboy 2008-06-27 9:33 AM
2008-06-27 9:47 AM
in reply to: #1493798

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Subject: RE: Tri vs road bike : Again?

The way my bike is set up I ride in aero 95% of the time. It is the most comfortable position for me.

This is just me, but... 

(a) MY road bike is a Trek 5500 OCLV Carbon Trek with Dura Ace components.  I bought it used, so I do not know the age of the shimano components, but the frame is a 1996 model.  I had aerobars on there and also rode aero 95% of the time.

(b) My tri bike is a 2004 aluminum with ultegra components.

Hard to say with the age difference which is "better" but the road bike feels a tad lighter.  I was faster and more comfy on the tri bike from day one.   One reason, which everyone seems to ignore, is ease of shifting.  If you are aero 95% of the time, you still need to reach over and shift via the hoods.  The minute I got the tri-bike I was shifting more, at more appropriate times, and riding better as a result.  I live in an area of rolling to hilly terrain, so constant adjustment is required.  

That is a seriously nice road bike.  I liked my road bike too.  I hardly touch it anymore.

 

 

2008-06-27 10:03 AM
in reply to: #1493798

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Subject: RE: Tri vs road bike : Again?

I come from a road racing background as well as having been a mechanic and salesmen for 5 years, so have a bit of experience when it comes to cycling.  I also have a road and tri bike, both carbon.  Up until getting into tri I almost exclusively road steel frames (even though I've owned and raced aluminum as well and have ridden just about every material under the sun).

The comfort of a bike in general has less to do with the specific material and more to do with the way it is manufactured/designed.  I have ridden super stiff aluminum that beats the crap out of you and also have ridden aluminum that I thought was going to explode underneath me because it was so whippy!  (If you've ever ridden one of the original Vitus aluminum frames you know what I'm talking about!)  A good builder can make any material do whatever they want with it.

That being said, I like a really stiff but compliant road bike.  I had a Giant TCR carbon bike that met that criteria but recently replaced that with a Scott CR-1 carbon for even more weight savings and stiffness.  But it is a pure road racing bike and is stiff, fast and not very forgiving.  That suits my riding style.

I bought my tri bike strictly for speed and got one of the "fastest" designs out there and could care less about how comfortable it is.  I don't ride it for "comfort," I ride it for fast splits.  With that being said, I've still used it in two separate iron distance races and two HIMs with no issues.

I spend the majority of the time on my road bike and will usually only break out the tri bike as I get closer to an event where I will be using it.  And as mentioned, I get about 1 - 2 mph on a normal training ride with my "training" wheels.  Come race day I use an aero helmet and a disc and deep section front wheel which bumps that average up a bit, so it is harder to compare times between my road bike and tri bike.  I don't "race" the road bike in TT's, so I don't have exact numbers to compare, only training rides.



Edited by Daremo 2008-06-27 10:04 AM
2008-06-27 10:47 AM
in reply to: #1493798

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Subject: RE: Tri vs road bike : Again?
The reason I asked the question is I am trying to come to terms with not using a tri bike. I like my road bike in it's "professionally fit, tri-setup". To me, my bike is fast. In my first race, after only riding for 4 months I averaged a speed of 21 mph(I know, subjective) and I lost count to how many tri-bikes I blew by. It's just that I read so many threads about how much faster people feel with their upgraded tri-bike. It makes me wonder how much faster I could be compared to riding my Madone. Which again is professionally fit and set up.

What started all my confusion is the Guru rep was in town and I made the mistake of demo-ing a crono. Given, this is an $8,000 bike, but OMG, the power transfer felt amazing. I understand this just might be bike envy, but I still wonder. I know I have a lot more work to do on my engine, and I can't wait to see what kind of speeds I can hit after a year or two of training, but I just wonder...


2008-06-27 10:48 AM
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Subject: RE: Tri vs road bike : Again?

I don't think you need to spend $4k on up to get an equivalent performance out of a tri bike. In road riding/racing, a lot of the bike's "performance" feel comes from things like the smoothness of a shift, how well it shifts under load, sprinting, cornering... Not things that are necessarily going to make or break the performance of a tri bike.

My roadie is a tricked-up Ultegra (Ultegra + other bits, kind of like tuning a Camaro) titanium Softride. My tri rig is a rigid ti OLD frame with a mish-mash of components mostly 105 level. And I get just as much of a speed boost going from my roadie to the tri bike as the next guy.

In your case, though, I think what you're going to see is the HANDLING difference between being on a road bike with too much weight on the front wheel, to a bike that's actually designed around that position. You're comfy where you are, and that's fine. I think you'll find a whole new level of comfort in being able to relax in ways that you didn't even realize. Go out and try some bikes out and see what you think. In the end, you may decide that making that leap isn't worth the coin. It's your money, spend it how you like.

2008-06-27 11:09 AM
in reply to: #1493798

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Subject: RE: Tri vs road bike : Again?
you are riding a tri bike right now, you have a forward seat angle, aerobars, not road bars and a 73degree seatpost. what you dont have is an aero frame.

2008-06-27 11:37 AM
in reply to: #1493798

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Subject: RE: Tri vs road bike : Again?
It can depend on, which muscles you are more comfortable riding with.  It can also depend on how well your road bike is set up. However it mostly depends on what color and how fast the Tri-bike looks.
2008-06-27 2:23 PM
in reply to: #1494418

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Subject: RE: Tri vs road bike : Again?
newbz - 2008-06-27 11:09 AM

you are riding a tri bike right now, you have a forward seat angle, aerobars, not road bars and a 73degree seatpost. what you dont have is an aero frame.



Its not just aero he is missing... its the difference in length of the chainstays, the headtube, the fork angle... not just aero shaping.

2008-06-27 4:40 PM
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Subject: RE: Tri vs road bike : Again?
Thanks for the replies. I think. Now I am back to step one which is what should I do?
I guess based on everything I have read, I am only going to gain a few minutes on my 40k switching to a tri-bike. At the end of the day, those few minutes are not going to help me place. They might in a year or two, but not now.

I can always look at the bright side. Every time I pass another athlete in a race that is riding a tri-bike, I will know that I am that much more prepared and fitter then he is.



2008-06-27 4:44 PM
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Subject: RE: Tri vs road bike : Again?
Buy the tri bike -- one can never have too many bikes!

Mike
2008-06-27 7:09 PM
in reply to: #1495412

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Subject: RE: Tri vs road bike : Again?
Rollin' Thunder - 2008-06-27 5:44 PM

Buy the tri bike -- one can never have too many bikes!

Mike


You have about 8k I can borrow?

I really want a Guru... Ok make that 4,900. I setle for the ultegra groupo.
2008-06-27 7:10 PM
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Subject: RE: Tri vs road bike : Again?
snowriderinfl - 2008-06-27 4:47 AM
...As a matter of fact we had the angle set at 78% at one point, but it was way too aggressive for my body and I needed to back it off. I need to work on my flexibility in my neck and hamstrings.
What are your thoughts?


There is your answer right there. A tri bike is going to put you in a very aggressive position. If you are not comfortable there, you won't be faster.

I just got a tri bike. I am no faster or slower at this point on either bike. The road bike is far more comfortable on the man parts. The road bike steers better when I am on the hoods.

I can get more aero on the tri bike as the handlebars are 3 inches below the seat, on the road bike they are even. When on the aero bars, the tri bike steers better than being on the aerobars on the road bike.
2008-06-27 7:20 PM
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Subject: RE: Tri vs road bike : Again?

I have both carbon tri bike and carbon road bike..Kuota K Factor and Orbea Diva..Orbea is much lighter than my tri bike. I ride my Orbea in the winter and with my racing team rides, but spring-fall I ride my Kuota 95% of the time. I love bringing it out in the spring as my pace increases. When I bought it my mph jumped probably 1.5 but end of June my cycling typically jumps so it may be two factors (new bike and fitness) on top of each other.

I have had 3 road bikes set up in tri position..just not the same as a tri bike riding it like it is designed.

We all have various bodies, flexibility and the like. I think key is to find a bike designed to be ridden how you can ride it. My Kuota fit me out of the box built up. Sure I could have gotten a sexier tri bike but it would have required stackers so I wouldn't be riding it like it was designed.

My bike fit guy is trying to get me to buy an Guru tri bike....sweet bikes! 

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