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2008-07-25 10:39 AM

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Subject: Suggestions for Clydes/Athenas & Running?

I'm a future Clydesdale (5'9", 250 lbs) just starting out with training. So far, training swimming is going great--building up distance & speed very nicely. For now, bike is on hold (I don't own one yet)... so that leaves the running...

Oh boy.

I had hoped some of the cardio gains and some of the weight loss would help as I start training to run--but so far that's not true. I was able to dive in (pun intended) to the swimming fairly quickly, but on a one mile route around my neighborhood, I find it tough to keep running. My breathing and heart go nuts (yes, Doctor has checked me out, and I'm okay) after barely any time/distance, and I feel every ounce of my weight with each stride--most of that mile is walked.

I also worry a bit about injury, since I'm still so overweight... Maybe I'm over-worrying, since I'm not sore after my attempts.

How did other Clydes & Athenas start and progress? I've done the walking thing to death. I can walk for a good amount of time/distance on the treadmill or outside, I'm just not seeming to translate that into actual running.

Any suggestions or input would be greatly appreciated. Also, just wanted to thank everyone who posts in this forum, particularly in the race pictures thread. That's been a huge inspiration and motivation for me to do this.



Edited by merlyn411 2008-07-25 10:40 AM


2008-07-25 10:52 AM
in reply to: #1558927

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Subject: RE: Suggestions for Clydes/Athenas & Running?

I used the Couch to 5K plan to kick start me after ACL replacement. My cardio conditioning sank quick post injury and surgery so I started from scratch. Here are a couple of links to get you started. The first is a link to the plan the second is to some podcasts to use along with the weekly schedule. In 9 weeks you can be running a 5k without stopping.....

http://www.coolrunning.com/engine/2/2_3/181.shtml

http://www.ullreys.com/robert/Podcasts/page4/files/category-7.html

2008-07-25 11:14 AM
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Subject: RE: Suggestions for Clydes/Athenas & Running?
I agree about the couch to 5K plan. I am not much of a runner myself. An 11 minute mile is FAST for me.

When I start up running after an extended break I literally have to start with 5 minutes of running or less and build from there. 5 or 6 minutes the next week, then 7 or 8 then 10, then 10 for a few weeks. For me to avoid injury and be a strong, comfortable runner I have to go slow slow SLOW. I also have to integrate walking into my running. I always start with 5 minutes of power walking, then 5 minutes of SLOW running, then I go into my real run. If I'm doing more than 20 minutes I take a break and walk every 10-15 minutes for about a minute. It helps me keep going.
2008-07-25 11:23 AM
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Subject: RE: Suggestions for Clydes/Athenas & Running?

Just keep on keeping on.  You'll get better, it just takes time.  If you treat your training like a 'marathon' and not as a 'sprint' (slow and steady, taking your time, the finish is miles away instead of yards etc)  you'll do fine.  follow the training programs too, they focus on training for an allotted time, not distance.  The distance will come as you become more comfortable working out in the time frame

Also follow the "can I walk and still be a triathlete" thread and look to the galloway method, where you jog a bit and run a bit to help increase time.  I've been doing that and its helped me w/ my endurance and distance.

2008-07-25 12:13 PM
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Folsom, CA (Sacramento Area)
Subject: RE: Suggestions for Clydes/Athenas & Running?
I started running when I was close to 300 pounds and stuck to the 10 % weekly increase rule, religiously. I started doing the walk and run thing. run 1/2 mile and walk 1.5 miles. After a week I would do .6 run /1.4 walk, then .7 /1.3, etc.
I was doing this drill about 3 or 4 times per week and I am now running up to 9 miles in during training. It worked for me but I have to admit it, it is was very boring because I am the results oriented kind of guy but I had to keep reminding myself that I did not want to get hurt. With a swimming background, I was able to get quicker results in the pool and stay motivated that way...

good luck in your training..
2008-07-25 12:28 PM
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Subject: RE: Suggestions for Clydes/Athenas & Running?

Pretty much what everyone else has said.  Don't think you're going to jump right into running and be doing under 10 minute miles for 5 miles.  Remember running is HIGH impact.  Us clydes have a propensity towards repetitive type injuries and overuse type injuries.  So with all that said:

(1) Good shoes are a MUST!  If you're going to break the budget on one piece of equipment make it your running shoes.

(2) take it slow.  start with a walk/run program, make incremental increases in your training each week but no more than 10% in volume.

(3) listen to your body, if you start to break down, i.e. pain in the shins, of the achilies, or the bottom of the foot, take it down a notch.  Suffering a significant run related injury as a clyde can set you back months, thereby destroying any gains you made in pushing yourself too hard.

(4) Remember, you're in this for the long haul.  Don't expect to be racing in the IM world championships in Kona this year.   Make realistic goals.

(5) And yes walking during a race is totally acceptable!

(6) Have fun!!!!!



Edited by ASA22 2008-07-25 12:28 PM


2008-07-25 1:03 PM
in reply to: #1558927

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Subject: RE: Suggestions for Clydes/Athenas & Running?

I'm 265 and running can definitely be tough on the legs. There has been some excellent advice given already. I definitely 2nd the getting fitted for proper shoes if you haven't already (so important). I only run on grass, newer tracks (better/softer materials) or my gym's treadmills (most have some impact absorption) as I feel that reducing stress on the leg joints while heavy now will not only help reduce issues today, but hopefully prevent arthritic knees & all in the future.

I too did the couch to 5k program and think that the Jeff Galloway method ( http://www.jeffgalloway.com/training/walk_breaks.html) should be incorporated as part of it's design is to help reduce injury (a longer run doesn't have to be all running, the walk breaks are so helpful).

Many of us have been in this position and I'm sure you'll find something that works well for you, stick with it!

2008-07-25 11:15 PM
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Subject: RE: Suggestions for Clydes/Athenas & Running?
A lot of poeple like the couch to 5k thing... but to be honest it was just too progressive for me at my size.

I did the walk thing for months too to start off with and when I got down to a weight where I felt okay to baby-steps into running (230) I started a 13 week learn to run program from the book with the same name. It tooks me only a week or two longer then that.

Basically you

week 1 walk 4 run 1 - week 2 walk 3 run 2 - week 3 walk 2 run 3.... and so on progressing from week to week and repeating weeks when you feel your body isn't ready to move on yet. It's a much more gentle way to tranisiton into running.

I can now run (slow!) for about an hour and a half. I started in January with running.

Edited by IdealMuse 2008-07-25 11:16 PM
2008-07-26 12:59 AM
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Subject: RE: Suggestions for Clydes/Athenas & Running?
I might have to buy that book.  I still can't run solid at all and I've been doing this for a while.  Maybe if I got on a structured program I might actually become a runner.  Of course, running more than once a week would help that as well.
2008-07-26 8:13 AM
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Subject: RE: Suggestions for Clydes/Athenas & Running?
Just another Couch to 5K recommendation here.  It worked great for me.  And yes get properly fitted for running shoes at a running store.
2008-07-26 10:14 AM
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Subject: RE: Suggestions for Clydes/Athenas & Running?

How's this for fate/kismet/luck: my wife's cousin just emailed us a 30% off coupon for FootLocker!  Looks like I'm buying shoes today...

 



2008-07-26 2:15 PM
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Subject: RE: Suggestions for Clydes/Athenas & Running?

Can I suggest that you stay away from Footlocker??  The majority of people in Footlocker have absolutely no idea how to fit someone for running shoes.  Saving 30% in the short term will seem pale in comparison to the problems the wrong shoes can cause you when running.  While I am new here and still debating the tri or not to tri question, I have completed 11 marathons and countless half marathons, so I can say that proper fittings are as important as the shoe you buy and actually may save you money since reputable running stores don't steer you to a shoe simply because it is new and the most expensive.

If anything, buy at the running store and then buy a second pair at Footlocker of the same kind and alternate your usage.  Rule of thumb is 300 to 500 miles on a pair of running shoes.

 

Happy Running!! 

 



Edited by SGriepsma 2008-07-26 2:16 PM
2008-07-26 2:43 PM
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Subject: RE: Suggestions for Clydes/Athenas & Running?
x 1 million staying away from chain athletic stores when buying running shoes.  You REALLY need to go to a running speciality store where they are trained to analyze your gait and suggest the right shoes for you.    Running shoes are the most important equipment for that leg of the race, and having the right shoe really helps limit the occurance of injury.
2008-07-26 3:17 PM
in reply to: #1558927


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Subject: RE: Suggestions for Clydes/Athenas & Running?
Though I am new to the tri sport I have been running 5-10k races for about 4 years. I suggest that you do go to a running store and have them analyze your gait . Then  they can fit you in the proper shoe. Be it a stability, motion control, etc. shoe. Being big usually means you need a shoe with better support. I have done really well with the Brooks Beast model.  It holds up well and helps eliminate the aches you may get from another type of shoe.


Edited by bigolbigun 2008-07-26 3:21 PM
2008-07-26 5:18 PM
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Subject: RE: Suggestions for Clydes/Athenas & Running?
I would agree on the shoes. Do not worry about the brand than the fit and feel. You might go threw a few pairs of shoes until you get the right ones for you.

When you walk do you want normal or do you try to walk pretty fast? I know walking helped out my running alot. I started from walking and when I am hurt and once I can walk I walk.

The other great way to be a better runner is to lose weight. I am sure you know this but it helps alot. this year after drop 30 lbs I dropped 30 minutes of my marathon time without even training for it. I was able to do 50k and 3 marathons in 8 weeks.

Thing I would remember is running is hard and it takes time. If you that tired and your heart is pounding that much it means your running too fast and you need to slow down.

2008-07-26 5:42 PM
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Subject: RE: Suggestions for Clydes/Athenas & Running?

Lots of great advice on getting started. As you progress, you might find that as your endurance increases and new enemy in the form of chafing will rear its ugly head.

1. Compression Shorts - Under Armor are the best, but expensive. C9 stuff at Target works pretty good and is much cheaper.

2. Don't shy away from the Body Glide/Chamois Butter/Bag Balm.  



2008-07-26 7:56 PM
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Subject: RE: Suggestions for Clydes/Athenas & Running?

Funny you should mention the Footlocker issues... wound up using the coupon to get the kids new shoes (sheesh do the little ones grow fast!), but not for me. First of all, the footlocker was staffed by high-school aged kids who looked at me like a dog being taught calculus when I asked about over-pronation. And the selection was miserable, to boot. 

Wound up at two different stores, both with very knowledgeable guys--runners themselves.  At the first store, he had me try a few different shoes, but I still overpronated a tad too much in all of them.  To my shock--and deep gratitude--he suggested I head upstairs to their rival (apparently he worked there previously). He suggested I talk to the manager and try on some of the Brooks shoes. 

The manager he sent me to was also very knowledgeable, and after watching me walk and run (if you can really call it that at this stage), and checking my feet, my posture, and the tread of my current shoes, he had me try on several different shoes, including Asics Kayanos with an insole.  After jogging around a bit in 3 different pairs of shoes (with and without insoles inserted) and his recommendation, I settled on the Brooks Beast shoes--and gave me his card in case after a few runs if I don't like the shoes, I can return them. As I was making my purchase, the first guy dropped by the store to make sure I'd been taken care of.

Unbelievable, to me.  Or ...is that kind of care and concern for a noobie runner normal at the more "specialized" stores?  All I know is I'm feeling very lucky. 

And I feel very lucky to have discovered this site.  Thank you all very much for the advice and support.  

(Can't wait to try the shoes out tomorrow!

2008-07-28 1:10 AM
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Subject: RE: Suggestions for Clydes/Athenas & Running?

+1 on getting running shoes from a running shop.

Last week I purchased new shoes. Tried on over 16 shoes. Ran in 3 outside the store (Yes, they encourage you to do so to get a feel for the shoe and they watch you run as well) and bought the best 1 for me. I walked away with Brook Infiniti's. 

2008-07-28 4:14 AM
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Subject: RE: Suggestions for Clydes/Athenas & Running?
Good job on getting properly fitted for shoes. That's definitely a must for Clyde/Athena runners.

As for the C25K plan, I found the Cool Running version too aggressive for me as well. I was thrilled when I found a couple of plans here in the programs section. Neither of them require a performance membership, so you should be able to access them. Here are the links:

Couch to 5k "Aggressive" 16 week plan

Couch to 5k "Conservative" 28 week plan
2008-07-28 11:12 AM
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Subject: RE: Suggestions for Clydes/Athenas & Running?
Couch to 5k program, good shoe fit and get a heart rate monitor so you stay in the proper training zone without over doing it.
2008-07-28 3:09 PM
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Subject: RE: Suggestions for Clydes/Athenas & Running?
Looks like you have been told everything you need to know from the shoes to taking it slow.

Great job on getting out there and getting going. I know how it is. I started running at 310 pounds now I'm 240 (need to really watch what I eat) and have ran one full marathon, two half marathons, many 5 and 10K's and now two tri's.
I log between 25 and 55 mile per week depending on what I'm training for.
So just because you're bigger then the other's you can do it and do it well. It's kind of fun to race and see the looks on people's faces when they see they got beat by a guy 100 pounds bigger then them. lol


2008-08-02 8:04 AM
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Subject: RE: Suggestions for Clydes/Athenas & Running?

Thanks all for the great advice and words of encouragement! I finished my first week doing the Coolrunning.com 9 week Couch to 5k in my brand new Brooks Beasts, and am feeling great about it, and looking forward to ramping up next week from 60 sec run/90 sec walk to the reverse. It was tough for the first run, but by the third my cardio had improved enough that I wasn't gasping like a blowfish on dry land.

From browsing and searching the forums, I know ChiRunning is something of a controversial topic, but I have to give it some of the credit... after reading the book and giving the techniques a try, I'm surprised by how little (almost NO) soreness I have after my runs!

I've had none of the debilitating shin splints, ankle pain, knee pain of the past. It's more like they know I did something yesterday, but not as if they're in actual pain. Neither do I have the sore and screaming quads & calves... I know not everyone's a fan, but frankly, this ChiRunning thing has allowed me to run without the super-long recovery required previously with "traditional" heel striking, quad/calf intensive striding (I have kinda big, freaky strong slow-twitch quads--and tended to run by "powering" through strides). And more running equals more progress.

For this (badly) overweight Clydesdale-in-training, it's been all that and a bag of Sun Chips.
2008-08-02 8:14 AM
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Subject: RE: Suggestions for Clydes/Athenas & Running?
wingsfan - 2008-07-26 6:42 PM

Lots of great advice on getting started. As you progress, you might find that as your endurance increases and new enemy in the form of chafing will rear its ugly head.

1. Compression Shorts - Under Armor are the best, but expensive. C9 stuff at Target works pretty good and is much cheaper.

2. Don't shy away from the Body Glide/Chamois Butter/Bag Balm.

Also, I've been meaning to ask... what's the deal with compression shorts? I've been running in my baggy old sweat-shorts or basketball shorts. Do they make that much of a difference? If so, I may need to take a trip to Target...

2008-08-02 9:42 AM
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Folsom, CA (Sacramento Area)
Subject: RE: Suggestions for Clydes/Athenas & Running?
I lie compresion short because they keep "things" in place and you avoid chafing in the inner thighs. there may be other benefits too but I don't really see them. comfort and NO chafing are worth the price. I think this shorts are worth the price once you start doing more distance.

By the way, great job on getting started and on the progress overall.....BE CAREFULL !!!!! YOU MAY GET ADDICTED to the Triathlon thing ...
2008-08-02 9:52 AM
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Subject: RE: Suggestions for Clydes/Athenas & Running?
270 something pounds last year when I decided to try a double sprint. Running killed my back so I thought I could build up the aerobic base by biking and swimming. Mistake, big time. This year I have lost down to around 255, run more than anything. I run till my heart rate skyrockets, then walk, then run some more. It is getting easier and easier. Just make sure you get in the distance, or minutes, however you are doing it, increasing slowly. You also might try to get your increases at a track to start with. I can run farther on the indoor track at the YMCA (nice and cushiony too, less hard on the knees) than I can outside with hills and all thrown in. I know I will eventually have to tackle hills while I run, but right know I want to build up my aerobic base in minutes. Also try throwing in a few weight workouts, working the legs hard. I am biking less, but the biking seems easier this year also. Swimming is improving also at a faster rate than last year. Funny thing, the more I swim, the less problems I have with my back. I did the same double sprint this year in July, all my times were a little better, and the whole thing was much easier to get through. Last year I thought I was gonna die, this year I just cruised through the whole thing. Now I wish I would have tried to push the swims and bike a little more. Looking forward to doing two more sprints this summer, along with a bicycle race. My goal is to complete an olympic distance next year at a weight of around 220.

Edited by deputygene 2008-08-02 9:56 AM
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