General Discussion Triathlon Talk » To train on road bike or tri bike Rss Feed  
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2008-10-13 4:02 PM

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Subject: To train on road bike or tri bike

I did a 55 mile ride on Saturday and decided for that distance to use my road bike instead of my P2C.  It seems like I use different muscles on my road bike and I am a lot slower. 

I am training for a HIM in May and was curious what others use when training.  Do they use their Tri bikes for all training?  I also am interested in joining a biking club.  My understanding is that they don't like you using tri bikes when riding with a group because of safety. 

The other issue is inside on my trainer.  I find it very difficult to ride my tri bike on the trainer for any length of time.  I am much more comfortable on my road bike. 

The other thing that seems wrong is with power.  I have a Power Tap and on my road bike the power output is about 15% less with the same preceived effort as my tri bike.  It just seems like too drastic of a difference.

Over the last 3 months I have trained hard and 90% on my Tri bike.  While doing this training I had a lot of pain in my hammys.  Like the muscles were really growing.  Now they are bigger.  Yes in 3 months.  I wonder if these muscles are just so much stronger.  Also I did get a professional fit with the Tri bike but not the road bike.  SOmething I plan on doing.  But it is hard to believe the fit would make that much of a difference.



2008-10-13 4:45 PM
in reply to: #1739472

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Subject: RE: To train on road bike or tri bike
I like to mix it up a bit, but keep in mind you will race on your Tri bike, so train on it the most.

During the off season, I put a ton of miles on a Cyclocross bike, Fixie and Roadbike. When I get back on the Tri bike I am rewarded with faster flats and downhill speed. I find my Road bike is faster when climbing, the Tri bike is faster everywhere else.

Keep in mind your Tri bike is using muscles differently than a classic road bike set up will. You might also fit your Tri bike better too.

When I started in Tri's I only had a Tri bike, few years later when I got a Road bike, I found it slower to ride till my leg muscles developed into it.
2008-10-13 4:57 PM
in reply to: #1739472

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Subject: RE: To train on road bike or tri bike


Road bike for group rides. Tri bike for solo training. As your race gets closer do mostly if not all tri bike. It's ok to use a tri bike for very small group rides, but leave plenty of room for emergency braking while aero.







Edited by joker70 2008-10-13 4:59 PM
2008-10-13 4:59 PM
in reply to: #1739472

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Champion
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Subject: RE: To train on road bike or tri bike

I ride my P2C everywhere. (Training, Commuting etc.)

But then, I don't train with anyone so group riding is not an issue for me.

But when I do ride with my Tri Club, most everyone I would be riding with also have Tri Bikes and so we would not ride in a pack close together like roadies do. (Unless we were training for a Team Time Trial that is)

If find the P2C to be very light and nimble and easy to ride in road situations. It climbs well, decends very well, and of course does great on flat stretches of road. (Especially with a headwind)

I certainly don't find it to be nearly as squirrelly as some of the bikes I tested. It is very solid and predictible.

2008-10-13 5:02 PM
in reply to: #1739472

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Champion
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Subject: RE: To train on road bike or tri bike

Interesting most folks say on their road bike they put out more power but are slower compared to their tri bike.

Do you have a power tap so you swap wheels between bikes?

I have power tap and switch between my bikes and don't see much of a difference in power between bikes. I find tri bike much more comfortable to ride long as my upper body is supported by my skeleton. I have had issues with shoulder as I separated it in a bike crash and also carpal tunnel acts up on road bike.

Lots of triathletes train during off season on road bike and pull out tri bike in time to adjust to it for race.

If you are not comfortable on your tri bike you may want to look into tweaking your bike fit. Being a little less aggressive can make it more comfortable which is key for longer races.

 

2008-10-13 5:07 PM
in reply to: #1739472

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Subject: RE: To train on road bike or tri bike
My road bike is set up with tires with treads on the edges and smooth in the middle and I use it almost exclusively for rain or other bad weather. If the roads are not wet it's the tri bike.

I'm not sure which will get the most time on the trainer this winter but I think it's going to be the tri bike just so I get used to sitting in it for three/four/five hours at a shot.


2008-10-13 5:50 PM
in reply to: #1739472

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Subject: RE: To train on road bike or tri bike

Interesting topic... I just a new tri bike, and can really tell a difference.  I have been riding a Cervelo Soloist for the past 3 years (and have it set up pretty aggressive- for a road bike version ) and just started w/ the Xlab Avenger TT last weekend.   1st ride, 25 miles, this weekend 52 miles... I can feel a difference in my hips.  I think because my body is tighter (positioning wise) I am working different muscles.  But I am glad this thread started.... I was thinking about this....

 

 

2008-10-13 5:59 PM
in reply to: #1739785

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Subject: RE: To train on road bike or tri bike

I don't have a road bike, but plan to build one.

BUT, I think that I would be in the mindset that if I'm training for a race, I'm going to ride on what I race with as much as I can - the tri bike.  I do that with my MTN bike.  If I'm in a plan, I hang it up.  Between races and/or plans, I pull it down. 

If I'm doing a group ride, or just riding, I could see using the roadie...

I'm not sure it make a huge difference, as long as you are getting your time in the saddle.

2008-10-13 6:09 PM
in reply to: #1739802

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Subject: RE: To train on road bike or tri bike
I ride to and from work a lot, if I go the short route, it's 30 miles each way. We live half way up the local mountain pass, so it's not a flat ride. I also get a head wind in the morning and a head wind in the afternoon....

I find it really interesting just how much difference bikes and aero positioning comes into play. On a really windy day, I can be 5 mins faster on my Tri bike over my Road bike (which I have set pretty low/high seat to bar drop). I'm 15 mins faster on my Tri bike over my Cyclocross bike set up as a road/wet weather bike, that's huge over 30 miles. I try to hold the same level of effort (by HR) on the bikes too.

On the way home with a lot more up hill sections and climbs, if I really push it. I'm 5 mins faster on the road bike day after day. It just climbs that much better for me. Feels like I engage my hams more during the climbs, it's also way stiffer of a bike.

The funny thing is, I likely ride my Cross bike the most. I like being able to rip down trails, jump curbs, bunny hop stuff... and love the second set of brake levers for commuting. Plus it has full fenders on it, so I can enjoy 5am rainy morning rides!
2008-10-13 8:16 PM
in reply to: #1739472

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Subject: RE: To train on road bike or tri bike

Yes I just move the wheel back and forth between the bikes.  I develop way less watts on the road bike.  About 10%. 

2008-10-14 9:46 AM
in reply to: #1740192

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Subject: RE: To train on road bike or tri bike
bartturner - 2008-10-13 6:16 PM

Yes I just move the wheel back and forth between the bikes.  I develop way less watts on the road bike.  About 10%. 

 

WOW 10%!! That is a lot... I am surprised!



2008-10-14 9:54 AM
in reply to: #1741082

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Subject: RE: To train on road bike or tri bike
swbkrun - 2008-10-14 10:46 AM
bartturner - 2008-10-13 6:16 PM

Yes I just move the wheel back and forth between the bikes.  I develop way less watts on the road bike.  About 10%. 

WOW 10%!! That is a lot... I am surprised!

Me too as that does not make any sense at all ..........

Now if he were to say that at XX mph he makes less wattage on the tri bike then that would make sense.  Aerodynamics and positioning make the difference in needed effort.

Your engine doesn't change by changing bikes.



Edited by Daremo 2008-10-14 9:54 AM
2008-10-14 10:03 AM
in reply to: #1739472

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Subject: RE: To train on road bike or tri bike
Regarding power: Does your road bike fit you reasonably well? Is it in good condition (like the cranks are tight and the bottom bracket isn't worn out?)
2008-10-14 10:29 AM
in reply to: #1739472

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Subject: RE: To train on road bike or tri bike

If the premise of this is based on what to do in training for the HIM, you need to use whichever bike you'll use in the race for your long rides. If it's the tri-bike you'll need to get comfortable riding the vast majority on the aerobars. I've seen far too many people get a tri-bike then waste the advantage by sitting up or using the cowhorns.

You can use a tri-bike on group rides if you either ride in front or off the back. While it's nice to ride with a group, those skills aren't necessarily things needed for triathlons. Plus you can ride your road bike in these situations, assuming they won't make up the bulk of your riding.

The power discrepencies sound very much like a poor fit on your road bike that is causing you to be in a position that doesn't allow a full transfer of power.

2008-10-15 8:44 AM
in reply to: #1739472

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Subject: RE: To train on road bike or tri bike
I don't have a Tri Bike I did get a new road bike though, I wanted to start riding a dedicated road bike at least versus my 38 pound MTB. I got me a Fuji Team Pro road bike all Carbon. My question is I was thinking of putting aero bars on it, how much will that change the geometry?
2008-10-15 1:56 PM
in reply to: #1739472

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Subject: RE: To train on road bike or tri bike

Well tested again and I am producing 10%+ less wattage on road bike versus tri.  Now I wonder if the PowerTap needs to be reset.  I have not done this.  I was riding on the trainer last night so could not do it.  I will reset, coast and set, tonight and see if makes a difference.

The road bike is only a year old and is a nice bike with componets very similiar to Tri bike and better in some aspects.  I can only conclude it is bike fit and my fitness.  My fitness as in the muscles are better that are used on the tri bike versus the road bike.  Either naturally or from the training I have done over the last 3 months on the tri bike.  I have been riding pretty hard.

I am going to get a bike fit done on the road bike.  Also reset PowerTap and see where I am at.  If still 10% difference, which I think is possible, then I will just ride tri bike most of the time.



2008-10-15 3:16 PM
in reply to: #1739472

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Subject: RE: To train on road bike or tri bike

Bart,

If you would ride more on your road bike then use that.  If your training is the same on either bike then use your tri bike.  For most of us, the bike that gives us the most training stimulation will prove optimal.

When I wanted to really breakthrough with my cycling I asked Bjorn Andersson for tips on riding fast in triathlon -- the #1 thing he told me was to ride my tri-bike all the time and get super comfortable with my position.  That advice paid off for me.

Make sure that your tri bike is comfortable, though.  If you are riding the road bike because your tri position is uncomfortable then you are unlikely to race well on it.

gordo

2008-10-15 3:25 PM
in reply to: #1739472

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Subject: RE: To train on road bike or tri bike

If this guy rides comfortably in this postion and as fast as he does it, it is good to listen to his advice.





(Bjorn Agressive.jpg)



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