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2009-01-13 10:35 AM
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Subject: RE: Vineman Full Ironman : Official Thread
Bumble Bee - 2009-01-12 7:45 PM

For first timers at Vineman, it is helpful to have a friend or family member bring your gear from T1 to the high school.  This is a point-to-point race in that the finish is about 15 miles from the swim.



Good point...the organizers encourage you to do that, actually (hand your swim gear over the fence to a family member or friend).

Another related issue: Numerous people in the past have commented on how problematic the shuttle from the finish in Windsor back to the start in Guerneville can be (at least this was true for the 70.3). If you happen to be racing on your own (i.e., without someone at the finish with a vehicle), make sure you have a clear plan for getting back from Windsor to your car with your bike.


2009-01-14 4:41 PM
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Subject: RE: Vineman Full Ironman : Official Thread

I have an admit 1 ticket to Vineman IM woot.  Um now what?

Ok what I read on the river thing is that you can expect to swim 1 minute faster for the 2nd half of the swim (down stream) than for the 1st half of the swim (upstream) so not very much of a current at all.  It will feel like the first half is 50 yards longer and the 2nd half is 50 yards shorter out of 2.4 miles. 

The bike can't be as bad as Silverman hill wise.  Please let it not be that bad. I think the hot factor will be a big suckage factor though.  Most of the race reports I read included the omg where has my strength gone it is so hot! somewhere in them.  For us slow first timers it should be very pleasant after it gets dark and settles into an 80F for the remaining hours of the race. 

So has anyone actually started their training plan yet for the IM? How many and what distance other races are you guys planning on doing prior to the IM?  I have a full mary um Sunday, but nothing planned other than this yet for the year.   

 

2009-01-14 4:58 PM
in reply to: #1908128

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Subject: RE: Vineman Full Ironman : Official Thread
Baowolf - 2009-01-14 2:41 PM

I have an admit 1 ticket to Vineman IM woot.  Um now what?

Ok what I read on the river thing is that you can expect to swim 1 minute faster for the 2nd half of the swim (down stream) than for the 1st half of the swim (upstream) so not very much of a current at all.  It will feel like the first half is 50 yards longer and the 2nd half is 50 yards shorter out of 2.4 miles. 

The bike can't be as bad as Silverman hill wise.  Please let it not be that bad. I think the hot factor will be a big suckage factor though.  Most of the race reports I read included the omg where has my strength gone it is so hot! somewhere in them.  For us slow first timers it should be very pleasant after it gets dark and settles into an 80F for the remaining hours of the race. 

So has anyone actually started their training plan yet for the IM? How many and what distance other races are you guys planning on doing prior to the IM?  I have a full mary um Sunday, but nothing planned other than this yet for the year.   

I did 70.3, basically the same course as the full.  Very little if any current in the river.  Warm water so no need for a westuit.  At the turn-around the water is really shallow, I stood and turned around and i'm only 5'3"! 

If you did Silverman this should be a piece of cake!  Lots of rollers, so you'll be shifting quite a bit.  The "big hill" is Chalk Hill, it's not awful, but can seem to go on for a while (keep in mind I'm no speedy on the bike).  The course is really pretty lots of vineyards, but the road surface is not always perfect.  watch out for pot-holes, especially when you are in the shade with sunglasses on.

The run is similar but a bit different for the full, I think.  Hills and not too much shade.

Not sure where in Ca you live, but I will be biking the course for training this year.  If you are in the Bay area let me know, I can always use the company   Good luck and happy training!

2009-01-14 5:19 PM
in reply to: #1848945

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Subject: RE: Vineman Full Ironman : Official Thread
X2 to most of what AbbieR said.

Plenty of threads in Tri Talk on the benefits of wearing a wetsuit, esp. when going long...YMMV. If overheating is really an issue and you have or can afford one, sleeveless is a good idea (I'm going to invest in one specifically for Vineman). Most everyone in the 70.3 wore a wetsuit (I did), even though it was a big question right up to race morning whether they'd be allowed or not.

The run basically covers the first 2/3 of the 70.3 course, three times. There's a pretty decent hill that is at roughly mile 3 (downhill) and mile 10 (uphill) on the 70.3 course...which means it's in the course for the Full and you'll see it three times. First/last two miles of each loop are very flat...so you can't judge the course by the early miles.

When my wife and I drove the bike course, my reaction to Chalk Hill was "Is that all?" My reaction when I rode it in the race was not printable. It isn't a long hill, but the last quarter mile is a pretty steep grade and it comes late in the course after a long, relatively flat stretch. But from what I hear of Silverman, Vineman is nothing compared to that.

You do need to watch out for the water bottles jettisoned courtesy of the potholes. Of course, that does provide you with warning of the potholes. (Actually, the pavement isn't that bad...the worst stretch is on Faught Rd, late in the course, just before you come back into Windsor.)



Edited by tcovert 2009-01-14 5:20 PM
2009-01-14 5:31 PM
in reply to: #1908128

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Subject: RE: Vineman Full Ironman : Official Thread
Baowolf - 2009-01-14 2:41 PM

So has anyone actually started their training plan yet for the IM? How many and what distance other races are you guys planning on doing prior to the IM?  I have a full mary um Sunday, but nothing planned other than this yet for the year.   

 



Not using a plan (not a published one, anyhow) or a coach, but I have started my build for the race...I have targeted long rides and runs from now through early July and am already into them. Partly, I'm starting early because I'm also doing:

--Wildflower HIM (beginning of May). My riding now is largely geared to prepping for the hills on that course (as a cyclist, I am teh suck)...and will take me through the first segment of my build for Vineman.

--LA Marathon (Memorial Day). I'll be getting training for that out of the way by two weeks before Wildflower (meaning a long taper for the marathon, essentially). After the mary, I'll be starting weekly ocean swims and doing all the 90+ mile rides in my schedule, but laying off the long runs for the most part.

I've also got a sprint tri and (trail) half mary in March and probably an Oly at the end of June. Also a supported century ride in early June.

Welcome aboard, Baowolf!
2009-01-15 11:37 AM
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Subject: RE: Vineman Full Ironman : Official Thread

I didn't actually do the Silverman, but I did the Las Vegas HIM, which I think overlaps some, 100% hills kicked my butt.  This will be my first full IM.  I have a wetsuit for the swim and would use it just to decrease the energy output from the flotation if allowed. 

I am thinking of Full Mary January, 10 miler March, Oly April-May, HIM late May then the last harah training for the IM.  It works really well on paper 8).    

So, looks like I need to train in 100 F weather, run and bike hills and work my arse off this summer.

I live about 350 miles NE of the Bay area, so not so close.  Swimming is still problematic as there is no place to swim within 100 miles of where I live during the winter months.  

 

 



2009-01-15 2:32 PM
in reply to: #1909728

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Subject: RE: Vineman Full Ironman : Official Thread
Baowolf - 2009-01-15 9:37 AM

I didn't actually do the Silverman, but I did the Las Vegas HIM, which I think overlaps some, 100% hills kicked my butt.



The Las Vegas HIM is on part of the Silverman course but it does lack most of the BIGGER hills and the 3 sisters from the Silverman course. Not to say that it isn't tough because the entire Lake Mead area has tough hills everywhere.

The Vineman course has a lot of rolling hills, etc. The only BIGGER hill is chalk hill and it isn't too long.


Everyone must beware though because I bring bad weather to IM races. I have yet to race one with nice weather. Although, I have volunteered at 2 that had nice weather.

2009-01-16 4:38 PM
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Subject: RE: Vineman Full Ironman : Official Thread
I'm in ..... gonna get my butt spanked hard!
2009-01-16 4:52 PM
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Subject: RE: Vineman Full Ironman : Official Thread
LJR - 2009-01-16 2:38 PM

I'm in ..... gonna get my butt spanked hard!


Welcome aboard!
2009-01-16 10:10 PM
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Subject: RE: Vineman Full Ironman : Official Thread
tcovert - 2009-01-16 2:52 PM

LJR - 2009-01-16 2:38 PM

I'm in ..... gonna get my butt spanked hard!


Welcome aboard!


Thanks... looking forward to hooking up with all of you!
2009-01-22 1:23 PM
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Subject: RE: Vineman Full Ironman : Official Thread

Yay just did my first marathon last Sunday, Redding Marathon in 3:48:45, very stoked.  And ya I am still planning on doing the IM, but those last 2-3 miles of the Mary did suck.  I took some days off cuz my legs were um sore and figured I would get walking back down before running again (tonight I jog). 

So what do folks "base training" weekly workouts look like?  Now that the mary is done I need to settle into a training week for the pre-IM Plan workous.  I still have to drive 100 miles each way to swim, so I was thinking something like 30 or so miles run, 100 or so miles biked and 6000 or so yards swam per week.  How's that compare to what you guys are doing for base workouts? 



2009-01-22 2:35 PM
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Subject: RE: Vineman Full Ironman : Official Thread
Baowolf - 2009-01-22 11:23 AM

Yay just did my first marathon last Sunday, Redding Marathon in 3:48:45, very stoked.  And ya I am still planning on doing the IM, but those last 2-3 miles of the Mary did suck.  I took some days off cuz my legs were um sore and figured I would get walking back down before running again (tonight I jog). 

So what do folks "base training" weekly workouts look like?  Now that the mary is done I need to settle into a training week for the pre-IM Plan workous.  I still have to drive 100 miles each way to swim, so I was thinking something like 30 or so miles run, 100 or so miles biked and 6000 or so yards swam per week.  How's that compare to what you guys are doing for base workouts? 



Congrats on the marathon...pretty smokin' time for a first mary!

Right now, I'm riding 80-100 miles, running about 20, and swimming 2500-5000 yds (depending on whether I do one or two swim workouts). Bike mileage varies with the amount spent on hills, though.
2009-01-23 8:59 AM
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Subject: RE: Vineman Full Ironman : Official Thread
seriously good job
2009-01-23 9:00 AM
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Subject: RE: Vineman Full Ironman : Official Thread
I think I am more concerned about the distance at vineman more than the hills. I am really scared of the hills for Wildflower in May! I have heard terrible terrible things. Defiantly going to get my butt kicked too!
2009-01-26 11:33 AM
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Subject: RE: Vineman Full Ironman : Official Thread
I am torn about what HIM to do as an IM warmup around end of May early June.  Did I just say a HIM as a warmup OMG reality has shifted in a bizzarre direction.  The three I saw were Wilflower (very mean), Auburn (really mean) and the Napa (not quite so mean).  Or there is Vikingman, but I haven't read up on that one yet.   Those distances look good.  I am still trying to figure out what Base training means.  I just spent 15 months building and folks say it is not quite time to start the IM training plans yet, but what to do between now and then..... I am thinking I can fit in 115 ish bike, 35 ish run and 6000 yards swam for now.         
2009-01-26 12:18 PM
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Subject: RE: Vineman Full Ironman : Official Thread
I'm doing Wildflower...but mostly because it's a race I want to do, not as training for Vineman. (I'd committed to WF before I decided to go ahead with an IM this year.) But the timing of the two races works really well, I think.

My attitude about how I'm building my training this year is taking it race-by-race. While I always have in mind (and on paper) what my key workouts are going to be for Vineman, I'm building now for Wildflower and LA Marathon (three weeks later). There's enough time after that for me to then complete the build for Vineman. So I'm not seeing February as killing time till the start of IM training: For me, February means "OMG...only 10 weeks til I start tapering for WF _and_ the marathon!"


2009-01-26 2:10 PM
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Subject: RE: Vineman Full Ironman : Official Thread
I'm seriously considering doing both Wildflower and Auburn. Even though each of them has more elevation gain at half the distance than Vineman, I figure more hills is always good training.

As far as your plan, I've already started a 30-week plan based on the book IronFit. Most plans are not that long, but I figured I needed the additional base since my training has been inconsistent. I took that plan and adjusted the long rides and runs to use my current distances (didn't want to go backwards), and build up to some "B" races: 1/2 marathon in March, Wildflower, Auburn, centuries, etc.

The IronFit plan (with Vineman as the target race) recommends an Oly the week after Wildflower and a HIM the week after Auburn, so doing the WF Oly and doing Auburn fit right into that plan. And based on that plan, it sounds like your idea of targeting the HIM distance at that time is right on schedule. Because both my run and bike distances are up though, I think I'll bump up to the long course at WF.

Cheers,
Mike

Baowolf - 2009-01-26 9:33 AM

I am torn about what HIM to do as an IM warmup around end of May early June.  Did I just say a HIM as a warmup OMG reality has shifted in a bizzarre direction.  The three I saw were Wilflower (very mean), Auburn (really mean) and the Napa (not quite so mean).  Or there is Vikingman, but I haven't read up on that one yet.   Those distances look good.  I am still trying to figure out what Base training means.  I just spent 15 months building and folks say it is not quite time to start the IM training plans yet, but what to do between now and then..... I am thinking I can fit in 115 ish bike, 35 ish run and 6000 yards swam for now.         
2009-01-26 7:24 PM
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Subject: RE: Vineman Full Ironman : Official Thread
I have Wildflower in May (a little terrified especially since I have not been able to put the time or miles in I have wanted to) I am also hoping to get in 2 Oly's pre vineman and then there is a possibility of another Oly the week after vineman (not sure on that one though). All 3 Oly's are a series so my sponsor wants me to compete in the whole series. Those are my pre Vineman training races.
2009-01-26 10:40 PM
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Subject: RE: Vineman Full Ironman : Official Thread
ellismichael - 2009-01-26 12:10 PM

I'm seriously considering doing both Wildflower and Auburn. Even though each of them has more elevation gain at half the distance than Vineman, I figure more hills is always good training.

As far as your plan, I've already started a 30-week plan based on the book IronFit. Most plans are not that long, but I figured I needed the additional base since my training has been inconsistent. I took that plan and adjusted the long rides and runs to use my current distances (didn't want to go backwards), and build up to some "B" races: 1/2 marathon in March, Wildflower, Auburn, centuries, etc.

The IronFit plan (with Vineman as the target race) recommends an Oly the week after Wildflower and a HIM the week after Auburn, so doing the WF Oly and doing Auburn fit right into that plan. And based on that plan, it sounds like your idea of targeting the HIM distance at that time is right on schedule. Because both my run and bike distances are up though, I think I'll bump up to the long course at WF.

Cheers,
Mike



I thought you decided not to do the race?
2009-01-26 10:59 PM
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Subject: RE: Vineman Full Ironman : Official Thread
chile7473 - 2009-01-26 8:40 PM

I thought you decided not to do the race?


Just not ready to sign up yet. I'm doing well with the training program, but "balancing it with life" (a.k.a. trying to keep my wife happy enough to not divorce me while doing enough training so that I hopefully will not end up in the emergency room) -- that will be the tricky part.
2009-01-27 11:29 AM
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Subject: RE: Vineman Full Ironman : Official Thread

I am shifting my workout schedule starting this week to help with family time.  Morning bike 15-20 miles, Noon run 5-8 miles leaves only single, shorter workouts for the evenings so 1-2 hours instead of 2-3 hours.  I am also flexing an hour here and there to get out early to get my workout started sooner.  So out at 4pm instead of 5pm allows my workout to be done by 6pm for dinner. 

Now if you were a real morning person you could get in more before work while she is unconscious.  I struggle to get an hour or so in before 7am myself.  This will result in going to bed earlier... which really hurts us night owls.      



2009-01-27 1:39 PM
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Subject: RE: Vineman Full Ironman : Official Thread
Baowolf - 2009-01-27 9:29 AM

I am shifting my workout schedule starting this week to help with family time.  Morning bike 15-20 miles, Noon run 5-8 miles leaves only single, shorter workouts for the evenings so 1-2 hours instead of 2-3 hours.  I am also flexing an hour here and there to get out early to get my workout started sooner.  So out at 4pm instead of 5pm allows my workout to be done by 6pm for dinner. 

Now if you were a real morning person you could get in more before work while she is unconscious.  I struggle to get an hour or so in before 7am myself.  This will result in going to bed earlier... which really hurts us night owls.      



Yeah, I'm totally a night owl trainer. It's going to be tough just to get out the door at 7am, 2 days/week that I have planned in my schedule starting in March. But I hear you -- I'm going to have to get more creative with my time management to keep everything balanced. I have a shower at work which is nice for lunchtime runs or riding to work. I think I'm going to have to get out the door much sooner on the weekends, especially for my long ride/brick, to make it work.

When things aren't balanced (i.e. when my wife is unhappy), it really throws me. It gets really tough for me to stay motivated through that because the first solution that comes to mind is to stop training. But that's not a good solution because I get resentful. And if I let it go on too long, I'm out of time to get ready for a big race like IM.

Mike
2009-01-27 3:50 PM
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Subject: RE: Vineman Full Ironman : Official Thread
Since I know noone who really exercizes, over Christmas I had my sister-in-law ride a mountain bike while I ran.  It is really easy to ride a mountain bike at 6-7 mph for 8 miles.  Although even that little exercize had her sore for 2 days.  This summer I should have my kids try to paddle the canoe on my swim route at the lake.  As long as they don't kill me we are probably fairly evenly matched... until they get more practice stearing and working together.  Then they can practice paddling circles around me.  Another fun thing is to meet the family somewhere.  Like you set up a time to like go to a movie in the next town (60 miles away) and you get a head start then meet up with them hit the movie and drive back.  They are all wow this is a long drive in the car and you rode that far.  Or I take my 3 year old in the back on the mountain bike for shorter rides, he loves it.  Joging stroller too, but a pain.  With my oldest son I will go on a longer run and have him join me for the first 1.5, 3 or 4 miles and then I continue on.  There are some things that can work out with the family, but they take some planning and may screw up your pace.  
2009-02-03 7:08 PM
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Subject: RE: Vineman Full Ironman : Official Thread
I find its really hard for me to train during the day because I work a graveyard shift so early mornings are not really possible. Have to train at night! makes it difficult sometimes but other times not.
2009-02-10 10:54 AM
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Subject: RE: Vineman Full Ironman : Official Thread
3rd week of 5:30 am bike rides, ugh I am so not a morning person, but really need to get my bike miles up for this first IM.  So, 5:30 am it is.  How's everyone's base training going?
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