General Discussion Triathlon Talk » Courtosy on the bike path? Rss Feed  
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2009-08-12 12:47 PM

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Oakland, Fl
Subject: Courtosy on the bike path?
Last night I was out for my nightly ride.  I normally ride late enough that the number of riders dwindles and I have a pretty open path around me.  Anyhow, it's 12 ft wide.  Well, last night I was approaching my half way/turn around point when I came around a blind bend and encountered 4 people standing in the path chatting, 2 on bikes blocking the road.  I had 1.5 ft behind them and made the pass no problem.  After I turn around, I am headed back and have a pretty good clip going on when I am coming up to the bend....again....and this time, between the trees I see 2 people approaching on bikes in the other direction.  These 2 people are taking up the whole path.  I am hugging the last 3inches of path before dirt as this lady is staring at me and shrinking my room even more...ugh...target fixation, I think.  4 miles later I see a family approaching, half on bikes.  There is a kid weaving all over the path and then starts pedalling towards me as if to cut me off.  I manage to snake by while his family walks 4 a-breast behind him, once again shrinking my ride area.

This is getting a little annoying that people do not have consideration for others.  If you are going to stop and chat....get off the path.  Do not take the whole path...stay on your side, especially if yo see someone coming your way.  Punt the kid that thinks it's fun to run you off the road into the dirt while his family has the same inconsiderate mindsent. 

This wasn't the 1st time of having some issues, but it seemed to be in abundance lately. (ie...the dog, his leash and the owner that came out of the trees and blocked the whole bike path, the family walking 4 abreast and not making way when they have a ride coming from ahead and behind, making them have to stop/slow up a lot....)

OK...off my soap box.  I was just a bit irritated by this.


2009-08-12 1:01 PM
in reply to: #2344162

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2009-08-12 1:01 PM
in reply to: #2344162

Resident Curmudgeon
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Subject: RE: Courtosy on the bike path?
Plenty of reasons to avoid multiuse paths.
2009-08-12 2:24 PM
in reply to: #2344162

Master
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Metro NY Area
Subject: RE: Courtosy on the bike path?
I think paths are safer than streets especially late in the day. I too get frustrated that people don't consider others, there should be something nice to say that will make people realize yet not put them off but I have yet to figure it out.
2009-08-12 2:33 PM
in reply to: #2344162

Expert
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Subject: RE: Courtosy on the bike path?
If you want to train on a bike path, get a mountain bike or crusier with big knobby tires to slow you down and provide resistance. If you are on road bike or tri bike clipping along at 20+ MPH you need to get on the road or bike lanes.
2009-08-12 2:35 PM
in reply to: #2344429

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Subject: RE: Courtosy on the bike path?
Nelg - 2009-08-12 2:33 PM If you want to train on a bike path, get a mountain bike or crusier with big knobby tires to slow you down and provide resistance. If you are on road bike or tri bike clipping along at 20+ MPH you need to get on the road or bike lanes.


My opinion exactly.


2009-08-12 2:39 PM
in reply to: #2344162

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Subject: RE: Courtosy on the bike path?
Bikes belong on the road.  At least, bikes going fast, or being ridden seriously belong on the road.  A multi-use trail is just that.  I expect to see families, dogs, toddlers, and depending on the area, horses, on the trail.  In my own experience, people riding on the bike paths are riders who are less confident in their riding (kids, newbies, etc), who may not have the control skills to hold a line, or the experience and knowledge that it is needed.

I could see a posting from the other points of view - "I was on the path with my 3 year old, who was acting like 3 year olds do, wandering from side to side to see the clowers, grass, bunnies, when this crazed cyclist in spandex came zooming down the path like she owned it - I had to block her from running into my kid who zigs and zags".  Or "I was out walking my dog in the evening, when there are fewer people for him to upset or scare, when this lady comes by on the bike, triggering his pulling instinct. It was all I could do to keep in from yanking me off my feet.  When did bike riders stop using their bells to let us know they are on the path?".  Or "I was out for a walk on the path when I ran into some friends.  We stopped and chatted, but this cyclist gave us dirty looks, like we should have stood in the mud for her convenience." Or "I took my kid to the nice wide multiuse path to learn to ride her bike.  She only had the training wheels off for a couple of days and is obviously pretty unsteady.  You shouold have seen the look this biker gave her as she nearly ran her over!"
2009-08-12 2:44 PM
in reply to: #2344409

Extreme Veteran
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Subject: RE: Courtosy on the bike path?
losta - 2009-08-12 2:24 PM

I think paths are safer than streets especially late in the day. I too get frustrated that people don't consider others, there should be something nice to say that will make people realize yet not put them off but I have yet to figure it out.


"get the EF out of the way" has worked for me. lol
2009-08-12 2:52 PM
in reply to: #2344449

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Subject: RE: Courtosy on the bike path?
gearboy - 2009-08-12 3:39 PM Bikes belong on the road.  At least, bikes going fast, or being ridden seriously belong on the road.  A multi-use trail is just that.  I expect to see families, dogs, toddlers, and depending on the area, horses, on the trail.  In my own experience, people riding on the bike paths are riders who are less confident in their riding (kids, newbies, etc), who may not have the control skills to hold a line, or the experience and knowledge that it is needed.



+1  Unless you're going for a leisurely ride, stick to the roads.

As far as the whole courtesy thing; don't get me going.
2009-08-12 3:02 PM
in reply to: #2344162

Expert
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Oakland, Fl
Subject: RE: Courtosy on the bike path?
I have pretty much stuck to the path since I am newer at the road bike w/clipless pedals from a mountain bike.  The roads around my place do not have shoulders and I see so many cyclists on the path.  All of the people involved were of ages to use thier mind to be safe.  The kid that dive bombed me was probably about 10 yrs old and should know better.  I always give a shout "On your left!" as I am coming up to them from behind or nod as I pass.


I understand the road point of view and have thought of it...I just don't like that i do not have a shoulder to ride on and the drivers in C. FL are quite deadly towards bicyclists. 
2009-08-12 3:20 PM
in reply to: #2344162

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Subject: RE: Courtosy on the bike path?

I understand the frustration, but how frustrated and therefore how rude I get to be depends on the situation.  If it's a multi use path, my right to ride or skate is sadly just as strong as someone else's right to stand in the middle of the path and fix their hair.  In which case I suck it up and deal.  Note, I ride a MTB with slicks and average about 16 mph and I average about 10 mph on my skates.  However, if it is a bike path and there is a walking path next to it then it's a different story.  In this case if you are standing in the middle of the path, walking on the path, going the wrong way, or running on the path I will feel perfectly justified in yell at you to "MOVE".  Sorry these people have their own path and they would be equally upset if I started skating or biking down the middle of the walking/running path.  And I get that running with all the slow people walking is a pain, but suck it up and get out of my way.



2009-08-12 3:25 PM
in reply to: #2344162

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Buffalo Grove
Subject: RE: Courtosy on the bike path?
Here is the deal, with Multi Use paths you are going to have families, dogs, children, etc.  These paths are not designed to be used as training routes for bikes (road bikes). 

I understand that you feel that the path is safer the the road but, to be honest, the road is where you belong on your bike if you are training.

The path is for the use of everyone and not everyone is going to "get out of the way" for the person on the road bike.  Just the way it is.

You have to make a decision.  Either ride on the path and know that you are going to have these issues or you will have to move to the road. 

FYI - Riding on the road will make you a better rider. 

2009-08-12 3:30 PM
in reply to: #2344162

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Subject: RE: Courtosy on the bike path?
Just ride on the road, those paths are designed for people like you just mentioned. 
2009-08-12 3:39 PM
in reply to: #2344162

Master
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Subject: RE: Courtosy on the bike path?

The times I am on a path, I expect to slow down frequently for circumstances such as those you mention.  Doesn't really bug me since I figure I'm going to run into all sorts of things on a trail, and I'm making an explicit decision to take the trail in order to avoid vehicle traffic.  With the good comes the bad. 

I do have to say though that I don't understand people walking several abreast and not making any room for others coming from the opposite direction.  That's just a lack of courtesy or manners.  I encounter this walking on a trail at lunch, and it's not an unusual occurrence.

2009-08-12 4:21 PM
in reply to: #2344162

Minneapolis, MN
Subject: RE: Courtosy on the bike path?

Although I would much prefer the road I usually ride on a multi-use path because my alternative in most cases is to either ride on the highway or residential streets (stop sign every 1-2 blocks) or drive to a better location.  I fully understand that the path is multi-use and therefore accept the fact that I may have to slow up a bit at times to get around traffic etc.  I also always announce my presence when passing so as not to scare anyone.  However, since we are talking about sharing the path why does it not work both ways?  It is clearly divided into two lanes with a dashed line down the center.  I don’t mind walkers, etc. in the right lane.  What gets me is the people that walk, bike, whatever in the wrong lane and then get mad when you try to pass them.  I am willing to share the path with them, I only expect the same courtesy in return.  

I have noticed that this problem does seem to vary greatly depending on where you are.  I spent a few months in Denver and rode on multi-use trails there and avid cyclists were the majority of the traffic.  Having only been riding in MN for a couple of weeks it is a much different experience.  Once I find a good route I will probably be getting off the trail.

2009-08-12 5:17 PM
in reply to: #2344162

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Subject: RE: Courtosy on the bike path?
I spend equal time probably on roads or bike paths. I'm lucky enough to live where there is a great trail where bikes and people pretty peacefully co-exist, from bike racers and triathletes, to casual riders, walkers, and runners. Early and late tends to be the fitness oriented folks, so you can go hard core. During peak times though, there are "whole-trailers" that walk 4 abreast and don't move despite multiple warnings, and there are also bikers who insist on riding in the peleton on the trail no matter who is coming the other way. My solution is to stay off during peak times unless I'm running or riding with my kids.


2009-08-12 6:21 PM
in reply to: #2344162

Champion
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Subject: RE: Courtosy on the bike path?

My regular riding area involves multiuse paths and road... I find the my pace is slowed on the paths but I do try to get out early enough that the usual kids/families etc arent around but this isnt always the case!

In addition to this I always give people heaps of warning Im coming... with an 'on your right' (other side of the road here) and then when they move over I slow down, yell out a thank you or if they look a little worried I will smile and say something like 'just wanted to let you know I was here'.

Ive been thanked a few times for it as apparently not everyone is so polite! But if Im out riding over the main period of the day, especially on the weekend I just accept Im going to have to be a lot slower and ride defensively... will slow down if I see a group approaching and just assume they arent going to be the most helpful...

If Im feeling cheeky I will often call out 'Good Morning' ahead of me... being a nice person seems to convince people to be considerate

2009-08-12 6:34 PM
in reply to: #2344162

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Subject: RE: Courtosy on the bike path?

About the only people I get upset at are the other cyclists riding 2 or 3 wide using up the entire trial and don't move over when they see me coming or pay zero attention to someone coming up from behind. I will usually let them know that it's a pretty big trail.

2009-08-12 6:47 PM
in reply to: #2344162

Expert
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Oakland, Fl
Subject: RE: Courtosy on the bike path?
Well, I unbderstand everyones points.  I am more comfortable on the bike path and usually keep about 18mph on the flat areas.....I do slow up when approaching people and I give them plenty of room.  It just seems that the past couple times out it has been nothing but a cluster.  Normally, I have not had issues with people on the trail and have never scared anyone....that I know of.

I will be moving to the street soon....just still need to build a little more conficence on the clipless pedals.
2009-08-13 8:18 AM
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2009-08-13 8:41 AM
in reply to: #2345041

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Subject: RE: Courtosy on the bike path?
I'm a pretty new rider (I've had my bike for maybe 3 weeks now), so I've been using a multi-use trail to get the hang of things. Heck, I think when I first got on my bike, I looked worse than the 3-year olds zig-zaging all over the place!

The only thing that does bother me is that other cyclists, who are clearly experienced (or at least look the part on an expensive bike, jerseys, etc), well ride side-by-side 2 or 3 people, and will take up almost the entire trail. Being a pretty new rider, I'll be honest that I get a little nervous when I get boxed in like that. When my friends and I ride, we will always move over and get in a single-file line.

Edited by aaron.ard 2009-08-13 8:41 AM


2009-08-13 9:13 AM
in reply to: #2345064

Pro
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Subject: RE: Courtosy on the bike path?
DolphinGirlMB - 2009-08-12 7:47 PM Well, I unbderstand everyones points.  I am more comfortable on the bike path and usually keep about 18mph on the flat areas.....I do slow up when approaching people and I give them plenty of room.  It just seems that the past couple times out it has been nothing but a cluster.  Normally, I have not had issues with people on the trail and have never scared anyone....that I know of.

I will be moving to the street soon....just still need to build a little more conficence on the clipless pedals.


I think 18 mph justifies being on the road.  Way too fast for a multiuse trail, IMHO, where you can quickly come up on walkers, small children and dogs. (relative to someone walking on the trail, for example, you are making them potentially as nervous as you are being in traffic with cars coming up at 30, 40, 50 MPH).

I understand how a lot of people are nervous being on the road with traffic.  I use a small helmet mounted mirror, that might make me look like a Fred, but helps me to keep a close eye on things that come up fast behind me.  If I am on a mtb trail, closed course, or riding with some friends who ONLY will go MUT's, I leave it off. On the one or two times I forgot to replace it when I got on the road, I admit feeling a little more nervous and "naked" on the road.
2009-08-13 9:19 AM
in reply to: #2345920

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Subject: RE: Courtosy on the bike path?
gearboy - 2009-08-13 9:13 AM
DolphinGirlMB - 2009-08-12 7:47 PM Well, I unbderstand everyones points.  I am more comfortable on the bike path and usually keep about 18mph on the flat areas.....I do slow up when approaching people and I give them plenty of room.  It just seems that the past couple times out it has been nothing but a cluster.  Normally, I have not had issues with people on the trail and have never scared anyone....that I know of.

I will be moving to the street soon....just still need to build a little more conficence on the clipless pedals.


I think 18 mph justifies being on the road.  Way too fast for a multiuse trail, IMHO, where you can quickly come up on walkers, small children and dogs. (relative to someone walking on the trail, for example, you are making them potentially as nervous as you are being in traffic with cars coming up at 30, 40, 50 MPH).

I understand how a lot of people are nervous being on the road with traffic.  I use a small helmet mounted mirror, that might make me look like a Fred, but helps me to keep a close eye on things that come up fast behind me.  If I am on a mtb trail, closed course, or riding with some friends who ONLY will go MUT's, I leave it off. On the one or two times I forgot to replace it when I got on the road, I admit feeling a little more nervous and "naked" on the road.


To what end? What would you have to see to make you change your riding position on the road? And would you have time to make that decision and change? I would think that feeling of confidence it gives you is false.

15mph is the speed limit on a lot of MUT's that I've seen, and rightly so.
2009-08-13 9:36 AM
in reply to: #2344162

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Subject: RE: Courtosy on the bike path?

I think whether you choose to ride your bike on the multi-use path or road depends quite a bit on the path and the kind of riding you're doing. Right where I live, we have a wonderful multi-use path, but it is not really suitable for zooming down on my road bike (narrow, not very smooth, very busy at times). I, and others, though, will use it to access the Natchez Trace Parkway because it's often safer and easier than taking the exit. Fortunately, nearly everyone is courteous, gives plenty of warning and room to pass. However, about 90 minutes south from where I live is a much longer multi-use path that is quite wide, marked down the middle, and perfectly suitable for riding the road bike at fairly good clips. Certainly, there are portions of the path that get a little busy, so it's necessary to slow down and be mindful, but it's a great path to ride on and a huge relief to not have to deal with cars for a change.

2009-08-13 9:39 AM
in reply to: #2345943

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Subject: RE: Courtosy on the bike path?
the bear - 2009-08-13 10:19 AM
gearboy - 2009-08-13 9:13 AM
DolphinGirlMB - 2009-08-12 7:47 PM Well, I unbderstand everyones points.  I am more comfortable on the bike path and usually keep about 18mph on the flat areas.....I do slow up when approaching people and I give them plenty of room.  It just seems that the past couple times out it has been nothing but a cluster.  Normally, I have not had issues with people on the trail and have never scared anyone....that I know of.

I will be moving to the street soon....just still need to build a little more conficence on the clipless pedals.


I think 18 mph justifies being on the road.  Way too fast for a multiuse trail, IMHO, where you can quickly come up on walkers, small children and dogs. (relative to someone walking on the trail, for example, you are making them potentially as nervous as you are being in traffic with cars coming up at 30, 40, 50 MPH).

I understand how a lot of people are nervous being on the road with traffic.  I use a small helmet mounted mirror, that might make me look like a Fred, but helps me to keep a close eye on things that come up fast behind me.  If I am on a mtb trail, closed course, or riding with some friends who ONLY will go MUT's, I leave it off. On the one or two times I forgot to replace it when I got on the road, I admit feeling a little more nervous and "naked" on the road.


To what end? What would you have to see to make you change your riding position on the road? And would you have time to make that decision and change? I would think that feeling of confidence it gives you is false.

15mph is the speed limit on a lot of MUT's that I've seen, and rightly so.


It may well be.  Like I said, I just feel more secure when I have it.  But also the roads around here don't really have a shoulder to ride on, so when I see someone coming up, I know I can pull further over to the side when it is safe for them to pass, or to signal to them with an arm wave to pass me.  If I am riding with mrs gearboy, or my kids, or a friend, I might ride alongside them (especially if I am with the kids).  But I will pull up into single file if there is any traffic approaching. I also can tell if there is more than one car coming up.  The flip side of not using the mirror is to check behind periodically.  I would ask you if you do that, or just maintain your line without looking at traffic patterns?
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