Strength Training and weightloss

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I'm not an expert but it worked for me I think and my diet is no where near as constrained as yours.

I actually am new to triathlon but started the year working on adding strength training to my cardio work (which at the time was walking the dog). The information I've read in my research indicates that adding lean muscle mass will increase your base metabolism resulting in more calories burned per day. These are calories you burn essentially at rest...so the more lean muscle you have the more likely you are to be running a calorie deficit or to increase that deficit if you're already beyond your intake. Increasing base can have a larger overall impact since it's always working for you (as opposed to walking or other cardio which burns calories during activity and raises base for a few hours afterwards).

So I started working on areas of large muscle volume (chest, arms, back, legs) and started working them in simple ways...mostly body weight stuff. Push ups, pull ups, squats, planks...as my strength went up, pounds started to come off. Not even an hour ...20-30 minutes a 3-4 times a week seemed to do the trick. I'm down about 40 pounds since January (down to 5'10" 177) and now I'm trying to stabilize a bit so I'm having to consciously up my calorie intake carefully so I don't keep losing weight (some of which has been muscle) especially with the increased activity of training for a sprint.

I also throw in some stuff here and there during conference calls sitting at my desk...arm circles, reverse plank on my chair...stuff like that to keep my body awake during the day.

Anyways, just my thoughts, not really scientific or anything. Good luck in reaching your goals.

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I've wondered about the calories my Garmin devices say I'm burning while working out. They seem high. I hope it's accurate. My edge says I burn over 1000 calories on a 1 hour ride. Ran 4 miles this morning at about 10:00 min/mile pace. My Forerunner says I burned 500 calories. I'm 33 5'10" and 173 lbs. Think those numbers sound accurate? I must be sustaining a deficit though, I've gone from 176 to 173 in 2 weeks!

If your heart rate is roaring high for an hour it is very easy to burn that many calories in an hour, I would trust your HRM and make sure you are giving yourself enough calories.  If you don't your body will hang onto the weight.  Obviously weight training will help build muscle, but again you have to give yourself enough calories and protein to build muscle.  Watch the calories to make sure you are not restricting more than 1000 calories a day, that would be 2 lbs a week.  It is best to do about 500 calories a day which is 1 lb a week, but a true lb of fat, lard, blubber is a lot.  I would also make sure you are giving your body a chance to recover, you might be over training and need to rest or do some active recovery sessions.  Then the last advice I would give is try some interval training, 1 min max, 2 minutes rest, do that during one of your tri training sessions, it will fire your motabolism to go after the body fat...

I have been using a Bodybugg since 3 months now which measures calorie burn of the body. I wear it 24 hours a day (except when swimming) and for me I found out the following:

Calorie burn during running is about calories the Garmin said -10% (so pretty accurate)

Calorie burn during biking is about 1/3 of what the Garmin says (so way off!!)

If I compare my weightloss and the deficit the Bodybugg analyses gives me for the last 3 months it fits 99% (considering that 1lbs loss is 3500 calories deficit).

 

When I trained for my HIM I had many 12-14 hour weeks and always had a weekly deficit of 7000 or more so it is possible! I lost 20lbs in 12 weeks of HIM Training. It just takes lots of commitment and some hunger

 

But back to the original question. I did a lot of strength training last year and I lost NOTHING on the scale but a lot of inches....

Edited by Joblin 2009-08-28 3:29 PM

the increase in metabolism from strength training is basically a myth, of course muscle burns more calories than fat, but you'd have to gain almost 10 lbs of muscle to be burning significantly more calories in a day to make any noticable fat loss, and that is not really going to happen when you're dieting.  The actual activity of weight training doesn't burn much either, about 300 cals per hour when you burn above 100/hr sitting on a couch (at least someone your size and training experience).

I used a HRM for my cal expenditures, but even that was usually pretty close to those online calculators.  Most of the triathlon specific steady state isn't going to be much more than 12 cal/minute, but you're bigger so you might touch on 14-15 if you're really pushing it.  Losing .5lb per week takes some true diligence.. which is why I would never want to try and lose weight during the season. 

Edited by Bioteknik 2009-09-01 9:37 AM

I'm not sure how you can say that it's a myth?  Post Exercise Oxygen Consumption, or PEOC, Afterburn as it's informally called is a scientifically proven phenomenon.  Heavy strength training - mainly circuits will boost your metabolism for hours after your workout.  I recommend anybody who is interested in this thread to do some of their own research before making any decisions.  www.bodybuilding.com is a good website.  I wouldn't ask a body builder how to train for a triathlon, it probably wouldn't be wise to ask triathletes how to strength train either.  No offense to anyone intended.    Some individuals are simply more versed in certain areas than others.

Also, for long term weight loss, keeping the weight off, body composition is incredibly important -- the amount of muscle mass you have.  Every pound of muscle you have helps you burn approximately 3500 more calories each year.  At a good pace, it takes about a month to put on a pound of lean muscle....you do the math.  Weight training is incredibly important for long term weight loss, and it sure helps you look better too.  Who wants to be 50 lbs lighter and still be flabby?  Not me.

I lost 67 lbs over the last 2 years.  The majority of it from Tri training, but only previously when I started including an additional day of weight lifting and lifting with more focus on certain muscle groups have I started to look the way I want.  The last 10 lbs I have lost has seemed like more progress than the first 57 I lost.

I have to agree with Jonnyfive82.  Strength training can go a long way towards fat loss because of the effect it has on your resting metabolic rate.  I come from a bodybuilding background too and have seen some incredible changes in body composition and some great fat loss with just strength training and watching the diet.  I'm a relative noob to the cardio arena.  But even more important than strength training in the fat loss equation is diet.   

I also frequent bodybuilding.com and they have some great resources on their site. 

Here is another article worth reading on the heirarchy of fat loss, which discusses EPOC in greater detail http://www.tmuscle.com/free_online_article/sports_body_training_performance/the_hierarchy_of_fat_loss

I have successfully lost fat through strength training, and maintain a fairly low body fat percentage for a woman.  However, I would say it's due more to my diet than anything else.  I eat A LOT of protein.. significantly higher than the daily minimums generally recommended - I feel this is the key to maintaining muscle mass while losing fat.

Also, I do not buy into the whole high rep/low weight for endurance athletes thing.  For example, I used to follow the routine set forth in the BeIronFit book, which is definitely not high rep/low weight.

Edited by DMW 2009-09-02 5:09 PM

I always strength train when I am am trying to reduce bodyfat, I also agree about strickness of diet,more protien,no carbs after 6pm,only clean carbs. I will do two whole body workouts per week,3 sets per bodypart, hard sets but not to exhaustion and usually between 10-12 reps. I lose bodyfat and get stronger and keep my workouts around 1/2 hour, it works great for me. When I am just tri training I get all sorts of food cravings, I cant explain it but lifting keeps them away, maybe extra protien helps.

Out of curiosity, what do you consider high rep/low weight?  Being female myself, I'm looking for another woman's point of view on this.   I've been strength training for almost 20 years...so a pretty long time.  Lately, I've been following a sort of reverse pyramid regimen.  For example...let's say I'm doing overhead dumbell shoulder presses.  I typically start with a heavier weight...say 30lb dumbells, and do 8-10 reps.  Then I drop down to 25's, and do 12 reps...drop down to 20's and do 16 reps...and then for my final set, I drop down to 15's and rep out at 20.  I've been doing this routine all summer, and now it's time for a change...so I'm thinking about going back to a more "conventional" lifting routine for awhile, so I'm looking for some opinions from other women who lift on a regular basis.  Thanks!

Well, I tend to lift in a fairly traditional manner, which I'm not sure is a good thing, but it is the most manageable thing for me to do while I am focusing on other goals (fat loss/marathon training).  I guess I personally would consider anything over 12 reps to be high, although to me, pyramids wouldn't fit into that category.  Not that I'm an expert or anything

Right now, I'm following the guidelines set forth on the exrx.net pages, with the first workout template from this page.  Sometimes I do a superset upper body routine for my second lift of the week if my legs are feeling particularly fatigued.  Everything is very simple right now, with 2-3 sets of 8-12 reps.  I find that anything NOT simple while I'm training for other races or trying to lose weight tends to cause a loss of interest (actually I'm taking a one week break from lifting at the moment). 

I'm pretty pleased with my muscles at the moment, but after my marathon I hope to move to a more intense 3x per week lifting routine for 8-10 weeks in the off season.

I'd call anything over 12-15 high reps.  I've been seriously lifting for about a year and half and have made a major transformation in that time.  I like the 5-8 rep range the best personally (where you get great strength gains and hypertrophic response), but its great to throw in different rep ranges for different muscle groups.  For me it seems the more different ways I hit them the better response I get. 

I like my pyramids the other way around.  Start out at the lower weight with higher reps to failure and progressing upwards.  For instance Lat Pulldowns in my last workout were 15@85#, 7@100#, 4@120#. 

If you'd like to work on endurance in your strength training, one thing that may help is playing with tempo on your reps.  I love leg extensions at tempo, up for 2 counts, held at top for 4, down for 2.  I get a much better burn than just doing strait reps.   

To add more to this, mainly because I have more time now, use the Garmin for HR only, you should have a cheap set of bodyfat calipers if that is truly your goal, foget calculating calorie burn, its all about burning fat and Garmin does not calculate that. You want to build or maintain muscle and loose fat through cardio,diet,strength training its that simple. The diet has to be strict,not just healthy. You should follow a calorie regimen each day and spread it out over 5-6 meals so you are getting nutrients throughout the day and not overeating(even if its healthy)when I say strict you need to calculate each meal down to the grams, then make adjustments down to the grams accordingly based on fat loss or lack of and energy levels. This is not fun or easy, ask any bodybuilder (who competes).Your Garmin will not tell you how much bodyfat you use during exerise and that should be your main goal,that will flutuate also. You will need to do some sort of resistance training,dont worry so much about the reps, thats trivial if your goal is to loose bodyfat,just keep the workout and rest brief. You should be eating lean carbs(low glycemic), lean protien(stay away from fatty protien)healthy fats(fish oil,flaxseed,Peanut butter). Keep training in zone 1&2 and use water before during training, if you need electrolites use Motortabs or Nuuan. If you are just trying to loose weight then by all means just focus on calorie deficit, just be prepared to loose muscle and fat, it works, just look at the contestants on the show Survivor!

EPOC is a fact for sure.. it's the amount that is the myth.  At most, EPOC from a weight training bout is 50 calories, and that requires an extremely high level of conditioning. 

You might want to go out and get some better sources of training science.  BB.com and t-nation are usually bad sources of data, cherry-picking studies that support the hypothesis of the author and ignoring other facts out there which dispute their views. 

www.bodyrecomposition.com

www.alanaragon.com

On bb.com and t-muscle you get a lot of different authors and a lot of different perspectives and they don't always agree with one another.  There's also a much larger collection of science there, not one man's perspective.  But they cater to the bb crowd, so they tend to be analyzing study data done on body builders, not on endurance athletes.

The first link you posted, bodyrecomposition.com is Lyle McDonald who also happens to be an author on bb.com

And here's Alan Aragon's bodyspace on bb.com http://bodyspace.bodybuilding.com/alanaragon/

Edited by Verti-gal 2009-09-03 3:28 PM

I respect your point of view biotek.  I have viewed some information and science to the contrary.  However, given some of the articles I have read, along with my own personal experience -- I dropped 10 lbs in 3 weeks from increasing my strength training and doing circuits and only spent 30 minutes in the gym 5 times a week instead of the volume training I was doing while tri training.  All I can say is it worked for me, and that is damn good   I'm just hoping to spread the word and hope it works for others as well.

I am arguing for EPOC with regards to circuit strength training, which is essentially cardiorespitory exercise as well as strength training simultaneously.  That is where I saw the results.   I will not argue the point that taking even 1-2 minutes rest period between sets will do much for fat loss, that I can agree with.

-Jono

Dang woman!  Those are some pretty hefty weights you're doing!  Don't think I could do a 120# lat pulldown to save my life!  I might be able to pull it down about 4 inches for 1 rep, and that would be the end of that...LOL   I top out at the same weight you start with...and I've been lifting for 20+ years.  Of course, I'm also 43...so, being old might have something to do with it. 

Yah 120# is badass!  My husband doesn't do that much I don't think!  I can do 12x80#.  But I'm also practically a little person so cut me some slack.   

Are you suggesting that the addition of circuit training increased your metabolism by 1700 calories a day?  (since that's how much it takes to lose 10 lbs of fat in 3 weeks) 

Nope, not suggesting that at all.  I'm sure the weight was not all from fat.  Also, before I started that program I was consuming fewer calories, probably a bit too few, I upp'd my intake by 300 cal a day and started the circuit program, which led to better weight loss.  Some of it was probably my body letting go of weight it already wanted to (it might have been in preservation mode from the low cal intake the previous 2-3 weeks) and the rest I can guarantee was from the intensity of the workouts.  People at the gym were looking at me like I was an insane man -- I was dripping sweat all over the mat and gasping/panting for breath.  This from a guy who at the time was 6' 3" 189 pounds and in great cardiovascular condition.  Circuit training EPOC is definitely high -- it is the highest?  Maybe, maybe not...I can't say for certain, but I can tell you it gave me fantastic results.

I have read in certain places, can't remember exactly where honestly, perhaps men's health?  After intense exercise your metabolism can be boosted by 25% for up to a few hours afterward.  If you do the math on that that's maybe an additional 100 cal i'll burn or so?  Big deal, right?  Well, I was also alternating the workouts between my legs and my arms within the circuit.  Apparently, this actives a mechanism called "Peripheral Heart Action" I believe is the term, (I'm typing this post off memory, not looking up the exact terminology, forgive me) which apparently can have a multiplicative affect on your metabolism during the time you are working out.  If you combine all of these factors, does it add up to 1700 cals a day burned?  Not a chance in hell -- but is it possible that I lost an extra pound a week or so from the circuit training, PHA, and EPOC? -- definitely.  The rest of the weight I lost i'm sure was from diet -- I was on a 1K cal deficit during that time.

I'd recommend giving circuit training a try.  It definitely lives up to the hype.  Why waste time lifting and doing cardio seperately when you can do both at once? 

-Jono

Edited by jonnyfive82 2009-09-16 8:52 PM