2009 IMKY Swim start

Member

10

Subject: RE: 2009 IMKY Swim start

It wasn't too bad. I was maybe 150 people back and I entered the water in about 2 min and 30 seconds after the cannon.

Regular

255

PA

Subject: RE: 2009 IMKY Swim start

It was horrible. I was about 1. 5 miles back from the swim start and I didn't enter the water until 0736 am. Next year they should make a rule no family or friends in line, only athletes. The line was too long!

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Veteran

283

Va Beach

Subject: RE: 2009 IMKY Swim start

I got to bike transition early (4:40) and they let us in. I took advantage of this and was in & out in 5 min, I ditched my bike pump in the weeds on my way to swim start (can't leave there and had no one to pass it to). It was there later when I picked my bike up. I walked quickly to swim start and got there at 4:55. I was near the front and was in the water within 2 minuted. I had no family or anything to save a spot for me, so I did not waste time in T area.

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Champion

10154

Alabama

Subject: RE: 2009 IMKY Swim start

GP160 - 2009-08-31 3:06 PM It was horrible. I was about 1. 5 miles back from the swim start and I didn't enter the water until 0736 am. Next year they should make a rule no family or friends in line, only athletes. The line was too long!

Really?! Dang. 1.5 miles x 5280 ft/mile = 7920 ft. / 2500 people = 3 feet per person. Dang, you must of been at the end of the line?

So there wasn't 2 lines?

~Mike

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Master

1411

Lexington, KY

Subject: RE: 2009 IMKY Swim start

The TT swim start was not a problem, imo. Definitely not a free-for-all. I didn't get kicked/dunked at all.

Thanks to my Dad waiting in line with my two boys, I was able to get a spot about 1/3 of the way back. They probably got there about 5:25. And the wait in line went by quickly. We had a good time talking with the people around us. Fun way to get psyched up for the day. Once the line started moving, it went really fast. And my heart started racing when I got to the switchback ramp leading down to the swim start. That was a blast.

I think the only reason to try to get in line earlier would be if you are worried about the impact of 5-10 minutes on your overall race time. I had to stop several times during the swim to get around groups of people swimming slower than me. And then I had to ride the brakes a bit for the first 30-40 minutes of the bike while trying to pass folks that started earlier than me.

But none of that took away from the fun of the day. And it is something that makes IMKY unique. I liked it.

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Master

1411

Lexington, KY

Subject: RE: 2009 IMKY Swim start

Rogillio - 2009-08-31 4:27 PM

GP160 - 2009-08-31 3:06 PM It was horrible. I was about 1. 5 miles back from the swim start and I didn't enter the water until 0736 am. Next year they should make a rule no family or friends in line, only athletes. The line was too long!

So there wasn't 2 lines?

~Mike

Just one line. Only the last 50 feet or so gave you a chance to choose which dock to jump off. So, technically, there was a long and short version of the IMKY swim this year, with the long version being about 50 feet (?) longer than the short version, depending on the line you took up-river. I wasn't about to get short-changed, so I took the long version.

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Champion

10154

Alabama

Subject: RE: 2009 IMKY Swim start

wiky - 2009-08-31 3:37 PM

Rogillio - 2009-08-31 4:27 PM

GP160 - 2009-08-31 3:06 PM It was horrible. I was about 1. 5 miles back from the swim start and I didn't enter the water until 0736 am. Next year they should make a rule no family or friends in line, only athletes. The line was too long!

So there wasn't 2 lines?

~Mike

Just one line. Only the last 50 feet or so gave you a chance to choose which dock to jump off. So, technically, there was a long and short version of the IMKY swim this year, with the long version being about 50 feet (?) longer than the short version, depending on the line you took up-river. I wasn't about to get short-changed, so I took the long version.

Good for you! I think I'd do the same.

Location: MOP

That's pretty funny.

~Mike

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Master

2381

Frisco, Texas

Subject: RE: 2009 IMKY Swim start

I had no problems with the swim start. I got to transition about 5 am, loaded up fluids, then headed to swim start. I was probably a couple hundred yards down the line. Talked to the other athletes around me, laid on my back and looked at the stars. Once the line started moving, it went fast. The specatators had formed a gauntlet leading to the ramp and switch back. I jumped in and started swimming. Very little contact. I liked the start.

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Veteran

283

Va Beach

Subject: RE: 2009 IMKY Swim start

I took the short line, made all the difference in the world. Must have saved me ten minutes (in my mind).

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Regular

90

Des Moines, IA

Subject: RE: 2009 IMKY Swim start

I'm trying to figure out why it matters when you get in the water if you are worried about time. Isnt' there a mat that you cross to activate your chip timing? Or does everyone's time start with the cannon regardless of water entry?

Sorry if I'm late to the discussion.

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Veteran

1097

Elizabethtown, KY

Subject: RE: 2009 IMKY Swim start

Iowa Action - 2009-09-01 11:12 AM I'm trying to figure out why it matters when you get in the water if you are worried about time. Isnt' there a mat that you cross to activate your chip timing? Or does everyone's time start with the cannon regardless of water entry? Sorry if I'm late to the discussion.

Nope, there were several chip timing mats leading up to the jump-off points, and they only use the latest time recorded.

At L'ville, the only folks that should care about starting "on time" are the pros.

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Extreme Veteran

373

Subject: RE: 2009 IMKY Swim start

I was really close to the front - I was in the water at 7:01 - I took the longer swim also!

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Master

1249

Atlanta, GA

Subject: RE: 2009 IMKY Swim start

I thought the swim start went smooth and I was pretty close to the back of the line- right across from the Sea Ray building. Left t-area at 5:40, got to start by 6am. If I had to do it over, I'd get to the start MUCH earlier. I got stressed to see how long the line was and was glad that friends and family were allowed to stay with us- I'd have freaked out alone. I think the worst part of the back of the line was having to swim through the crowd once in the water. I felt the swim was my weakness on Sun and normally it's my stregnth but overall it didn't impact my race more than a few min maybe. I'd be in line by 5:15 or so next time.

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221

Subject: RE: 2009 IMKY Swim start

roch1009 - 2009-09-01 12:32 PM

Iowa Action - 2009-09-01 11:12 AM I'm trying to figure out why it matters when you get in the water if you are worried about time. Isnt' there a mat that you cross to activate your chip timing? Or does everyone's time start with the cannon regardless of water entry? Sorry if I'm late to the discussion.

Nope, there were several chip timing mats leading up to the jump-off points, and they only use the latest time recorded.

At L'ville, the only folks that should care about starting "on time" are the pros.

If you are worried about finishing close to/under 17 hrs and take 30 min to get in the water, you only have 16.5 to complete the race. Therefore, people worried about finishing close to 17 hrs may want to start "on time"

Member

70

Nashville

Subject: RE: 2009 IMKY Swim start

I kept a good attitude and I don't gripe often, but I thought the lack of planning on the swim start was unforgiveable. The TT start isn't the issue, and I'll even let them go for letting it be 'first-come/first-served'. But the absolutely lack of line planning was insane.

I got to transition at 5:50am, pretty early. And walked the 0.75 miles to the swim start by 6:10am. A full 50 minutes before start. But, like another poster above, I had to walk another mile to the back of the line. You were literally down River Road so far out of sight of the swim start... it felt like you weren't even in an organized event. People were sh*tting and p*ssing up in the woods. You couldn't hear the announcer. You couldn't hear the cannon. Etc. Very disappointing. Then once the line started moving, you had to walk BACK to the swim start 1 mile. So before the day began, you had walked 4+ miles (mile from the hotel, mile to swim start, mile to back of line, mile from line to swim start)... which is more than you need for a warm-up... it's a little taxing. Not to mention- frustrating.

The improvement would be to stack up 4-5 columns of line queues right at the start. Stop each line 500 people deep, then begin a new line right next to the first. And so on. Then let out line 1, then line 2, then line 3. That way nobody has to walk so far, and everybody feels like they're in the middle of the action.

It was obvious no thought went into crowd control this year. Hopefully it's something they address for years to come, as I'm sure they'll get quite a few complaints.

Edited by kevinlbrown 2009-09-01 12:10 PM

Champion

7595

Columbia, South Carolina

Subject: RE: 2009 IMKY Swim start

First, I'll say that apart from the swim start, the race was run beautifully. The level of preparation and organization (not to mention the friendliness of the volunteers and officials) was top-notch.

But yeah, the swim start was no good. I too was at the back of the line. Now, I blame myself for this, because I swore that I would just wait at the start and let the line come to me, and then made one of those idiotic race-day decisions and walked to the end of the line. (Had I known how far I was about to walk, I wouldn't have been so stupid.)

And for me, at least, the TT start did not really eliminate the melee (but maybe it was reduced somewhat? I don't know.) I got whacked in the head pretty hard, and kicked in the gut pretty hard, and definitely had to weave through several packs of swimmers, and at one point, walkers! Apparently it was shallow enough to walk at one point....

I will say that they were putting people into the water very quickly.

As for the public displays of bowel-movements in line, I don't blame the organization for that. There were loads of porta-johns, which everybody HAD to have seen since you passed by them to get in line. So those people couldn't hold it until the line passed back by the porta-john (which is what I did in fact), or have their place in line held while they made the trip? Being in line for an IM start doesn't excuse one from common decency.

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Expert

939

Tulsa

Subject: RE: 2009 IMKY Swim start

You people are crazy! The longer jump off point was maybe 10 feet longer. They were right next to each other.

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Master

1485

Subject: RE: 2009 IMKY Swim start

I was near the back of the line and I had no problem with the swim start.

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Expert

762

Missouri

Subject: RE: 2009 IMKY Swim start

The swim start and swim line to start are a big cluster. I am a faster swimmer (55 min) and it was very annoying swimming through so many people. I know, poor me. . booh hooh hooh. . well, those 25+ people that I ended up hitting and or kicking, I am sorry, but at the same time, I don't feel that bad. When doing a mass start, I am able to get out pretty quick and either swim with other fast swimmers or be out in front and not have to worry about hitting or kicking the slower swimmers. I don't feel so bad about hitting a guy, but when I hit a girl or older woman, then I do feel bad, I want their day to go as smooth as possible and I know how the swim can be a stressfull event for a lot of people. So for that fact, I do feel bad.

As for the line, that was dumb. It was waaaaayyy backed up, there were specators standing in line too which added to its length. I really cannot believe that they still do a TT start at this race. It is the ONLY Ironman to do this. . .Not sure how they can fix the TT start but they need to.

Probably won't make a lot friends with this post I guess.

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Champion

7595

Columbia, South Carolina

Subject: RE: 2009 IMKY Swim start

Tell3131 - 2009-09-01 3:44 PM

The swim start and swim line to start are a big cluster. I am a faster swimmer (55 min) and it was very annoying swimming through so many people. I know, poor me. . booh hooh hooh. . well, those 25+ people that I ended up hitting and or kicking, I am sorry, but at the same time, I don't feel that bad. When doing a mass start, I am able to get out pretty quick and either swim with other fast swimmers or be out in front and not have to worry about hitting or kicking the slower swimmers. I don't feel so bad about hitting a guy, but when I hit a girl or older woman, then I do feel bad, I want their day to go as smooth as possible and I know how the swim can be a stressfull event for a lot of people. So for that fact, I do feel bad.

As for the line, that was dumb. It was waaaaayyy backed up, there were specators standing in line too which added to its length. I really cannot believe that they still do a TT start at this race. It is the ONLY Ironman to do this. . .Not sure how they can fix the TT start but they need to.

Probably won't make a lot friends with this post I guess.

I agree. I'm a slow swimmer, but was still fighting my way through quite a few people. I mass starts, I can 'seed' myself in about the right place, and I think I end up with fewer -- or at any rate, no more -- tussles.

Having seen the venue now, I doubt that wave starts is the answer. That channel is narrow enough that I really don't think you'd want even a few hundred people starting simultaneously there.

I think the answer is pre-defined starting times, or blocks of time. For example, they could do it like a pool swim (at least the ones I've done) and let people seed themselves based on projected time and establish the order based on that information. Or they could establish blocks of time for various projected swim times (for example, 'anybody who will swim under 55 minutes starts between 7:00 and 7:05; 55-65 minutes starts between 7:05 and 7:10' and so on. Doesn't solve all problems, and creates a few new ones, but I think it would be far better that way.

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Bob

2194

Binghamton, NY

Subject: RE: 2009 IMKY Swim start

Experior - 2009-09-01 4:05 PM

Tell3131 - 2009-09-01 3:44 PM

The swim start and swim line to start are a big cluster. I am a faster swimmer (55 min) and it was very annoying swimming through so many people. I know, poor me. . booh hooh hooh. . well, those 25+ people that I ended up hitting and or kicking, I am sorry, but at the same time, I don't feel that bad. When doing a mass start, I am able to get out pretty quick and either swim with other fast swimmers or be out in front and not have to worry about hitting or kicking the slower swimmers. I don't feel so bad about hitting a guy, but when I hit a girl or older woman, then I do feel bad, I want their day to go as smooth as possible and I know how the swim can be a stressfull event for a lot of people. So for that fact, I do feel bad.

As for the line, that was dumb. It was waaaaayyy backed up, there were specators standing in line too which added to its length. I really cannot believe that they still do a TT start at this race. It is the ONLY Ironman to do this. . .Not sure how they can fix the TT start but they need to.

Probably won't make a lot friends with this post I guess.

I agree. I'm a slow swimmer, but was still fighting my way through quite a few people. I mass starts, I can 'seed' myself in about the right place, and I think I end up with fewer -- or at any rate, no more -- tussles.

Having seen the venue now, I doubt that wave starts is the answer. That channel is narrow enough that I really don't think you'd want even a few hundred people starting simultaneously there.

I think the answer is pre-defined starting times, or blocks of time. For example, they could do it like a pool swim (at least the ones I've done) and let people seed themselves based on projected time and establish the order based on that information. Or they could establish blocks of time for various projected swim times (for example, 'anybody who will swim under 55 minutes starts between 7:00 and 7:05; 55-65 minutes starts between 7:05 and 7:10' and so on. Doesn't solve all problems, and creates a few new ones, but I think it would be far better that way.

This is probably a feasable resolution but I don't think it will ever be put in place. Last year I just stayed away from the center where the crowds were. Once you got clear of the island it was pretty open unless you tried to cut the distance by taking the shortest possible route. When you made the turn around you basically have the entire river to swim in and should not have had any crowds. I plan on doing the race again in the next couple years and will take my time getting to the start and swim around everyone I can. (Unless they implement the "Projected Swim Time" system )

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Master

1411

Lexington, KY

Subject: RE: 2009 IMKY Swim start

Iowa Action - 2009-09-01 11:12 AM I'm trying to figure out why it matters when you get in the water if you are worried about time. Isnt' there a mat that you cross to activate your chip timing? Or does everyone's time start with the cannon regardless of water entry? Sorry if I'm late to the discussion.

As far as the swim goes, it probably doesn't make much difference. Unless you're among the very first to get in the water, you're going to end up having to navigate thru/around others. So everyone has a similar challenge.

However, there is a difference in the bike. If you are a strong rider and start at the end of the swim line, you are going to have to pass a lot of people. Since you aren't supposed to cross into the oncoming lane, this can cause you to have to ride the brakes a fair amount of time. In contrast, if you start earlier in the swim, you don't have to worry about this as much.

Having said that, it probably isn't too much of an issue for most folks. A handful of minutes at most, I'd guess.

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Champion

8540

the colony texas

Subject: RE: 2009 IMKY Swim start

for the people at the back of the line,, were you made to go stand at the back of the line?? Could you have just hung out closer to the start and when the end of the line came up to you got in it then?? Maybe it's me but I doubt I would have walked a long way to be at the back of a line when I know the line is going to come back around anyway..

just curious

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Member

70

Nashville

Subject: RE: 2009 IMKY Swim start

Gaarryy - 2009-09-01 8:11 PM for the people at the back of the line,, were you made to go stand at the back of the line?? Could you have just hung out closer to the start and when the end of the line came up to you got in it then?? Maybe it's me but I doubt I would have walked a long way to be at the back of a line when I know the line is going to come back around anyway..

just curious

In theory, yes. But again... there was no organization whatsoever. There were volunteers taking morning clothes bags, but nobody directing foot traffic. I had to stop and ask people what was going on. And near the front of the line, right at the start, it was crowded as heck with people coming and going... definitely wasn't a good place to "park".

By the time you walked all the way out to River Road, it was a nervous situation and I personally just wanted to snag a spot in line before it got any more crowded. But in hindsight- I wish I would have known that the line was a mile deep and I would have maybe just waited. But being my first IM, I had no idea if I would need all the time I could get.

Again- it's all back to organization and communication. For such a well-run event overall... this was obviously an area that was not done right. I worked in major event production for years, and any time you're making adjustments a week before the event (e.g., changing swim cut-off times, etc.)... things aren't right and people are scrambling to figure out the best solution. For a third-year venue, this is unacceptable.

2009 IMKY Swim start

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