NCAA and Indian Mascots

Honestly I am NDN and I don't really care one way or the other who is having a sweat lodge or who is calling themselves a Brave or whatever. (Seminole and Arapaho as well as Swedish, go figure. I even have my BIA trading card, as I call it). I probably should be upset about it and there are plenty of "the People" that are up in arms about this and certainly I respect and honor the way they feel but it does not bother me. I have tried to look at it from all sides and I cannot see how changing a team name or removing a mascot will benefit my people.

I do not speak for all of the NDN's out there and in fact I only speak for me. Don't want to be a poster child, thanks.

If a bunch of white dudes want to romantacize the NDN way of life then so be it. I have been to the rez. It is a hard life, even now. Political rant off for the day. I do not mean to offend anyone else at all who happens to be NDN. I know we do not all share my feelings and I understand why but there are so many other problems with our people that we could put our efforts into solving.

NDN is short for Indian and many of us use that term online to denote "Native American" or "First People". Not really something a non native would use. In fact some don't like the term at all.



Edited by nliedel 2005-08-05 1:54 PM

My in-laws are from the Florida panhandle and I love them dearly but a lot of em make moonshine and do some other pretty stereotypical stuff so The Rednecks come to mind

I'm Irish and I demand all schools depicting me as fighting be banned from using said mascott - AT LEAST IN THE POST SEASON

Ahem, well some sterotypes are true.. lol

I suppose I should explain that my adopted Mom was Black Irish and "Fightin Irish" worked for her. She was something else.

Edited by nliedel 2005-08-05 3:11 PM

Why can't the Polish have a Fighting School Mascot? The Fighting Polka Kings. We love stompin' you.

Ok maybe not so good.

And anybody called Vikings, should be stopped also.  They were pillagers and plunderers.  Plus they drank alot.  Well that's what it showed in that Kirk Douglas/Tony Curtis movie.

Ya know I think I am in trouble here. Ancestors that were marauding Indians and marauding Vikings! You all better watch your backs because I am likely to scalp you and then steal your virgins!

Only if you bash people with an accordian.

One word, rediculous!!!

I'm waiting for someone to get offended enough to file a lawsuit against the local university to change its mascot: the Ragin' Cajuns! IMHO it's the best nickname in the country.

Personally I think aligators should sue Florida and for that matter the manufacturers of Gatorade! They should be incensed!

There are so many more things wrong in the Native Communities. Poverty, educational issues, alcoholism. Honestly! Don't even start me. This seems like such a silly thing to worry about to me. Sometimes we are so busy trying to be PC that we miss the target altogether. I see it at Pow Wow every year. People trying to dress like they think a NDN should look and people wondering what someone who looks like me is doing in Regalia (traditional clothing) Ummm guess what? there are blonde NDN's and redheaded ones and some of us even talk pretty fast too.

Don't get me wrong I am honored that people think enough of what we do to want to watch and celebrate and when people get up and dance in the intertribals it's a lot of fun for everyone. Sometimes tho people get carried away with the romantic notion of a dream that never was. They tell me how they always use certain terms and assume that all NDN's want the same things. We are just like any other group of people. We have our share of every idea, dream and need that any other group does.

Rant off.

NOOOOOOO.. They have already changed the official name of the school. Well, they maybe could change it to the ULL Hot Peppers!

Have you ever noticed on the back of some ULL hats (My old hat is a USL) the little tag has like a hot pepper. That might work.

I mean, what else could they call them over at USL, the "The fighting crawfish"????


I got one then.... If they want to ban Native Americans, they should also ban Vegetables. I mean, who would really want to put any undue stress on a fighting Okra in post season?

Edited by nickatnite 2005-08-06 6:45 AM






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Oh yeah... Sorry for new post, had an ADD moment here, remember when LSU won the National Championship? Well, one of my best friends is an Alumni from ULL, which he refuses to acknowledge since his diploma has USL.

Anyway, he was passn thru the drive up at Mickey D's there on campus and noticed that they were selling LSU National Championship mugs on the campus. He got so bent of shape, wrote a letter the McDonalds and everything saying how it was a "disgrace" to the students of ULL to put this in their face and such.

waaaah.. honestly! Did you tell him you had a tiny violin? Then did you show him how fast you could run away?

Edited by nliedel 2005-08-06 6:47 AM

Yeah...

I was like, "Chrs. Dude, it's a McDonalds; it's NOT like they are selling the crap in the Union."

Funny. ULL's the second biggest state school, has that No. 2 chip-on-the-shoulder syndrome. I'm all for the local school spirit, but ULL football sucks (it is getting better, though), so if you want to pull for a successful local football team, it's LSU. There are probably MORE LSU football fans in Lafayette, and more fanatical fans, than ULL, so that was probably good marketing by Mickey D's.

How many times do i have to tell you sven pillage then burn...!!!

As an FSU SEMINOLE alumni I can tell you that this is an rediculous ruling. Typically schools pick nicknames that represent some historical aspect of the region or school, or some name that denotes a feeling of power, or strength. That's why there aren't a whole lto schools named "The Fighting Wussies"

There is certainly a difference between a nickname like the "redskins" which has always been a term of derision, and something like the Seminoles or Illini. The interesting thing is that the Seminole nation regularly participates in campus events at FSU. At home coming there is always a campus king and queen and then a king and queen from the Seminole Nation. In essence teh NCAA has determined that the Seminole nation should be offended by the university using their name. Even though the Seminole nation is not offended.

FSU originally was an all womans school, after WWII it opened its doors to men, the potential nicknames for its sports teams were "The Statesmen" (Because tallahassee is the State capital); "The Crackers" and "The Seminoles". The Seminoles were choosen because they are one of the native Indian tribes of Florida and are the only tribe not to have signed a treaty with the U.S. government, thereby never having surrendered. Pretty good representation of strength, perserverance and high ideals for sports teams.

Just another example of P.C. idiots dictating what other people should think. Some beurocrate has determined that we as a nation should be offended by the use of names like The Illini, The Seminoles, The Chippawas, The Fighting Sioux.

I knew this decision was coming and I sent a letter to the NCAA as an Irish American telling them I find the FIghting Irish nickname and the little red headed irish guy offensive!

Well as I said I cannot speak for the entire Florida Seminole Nation but it does not bother me in the least if a school wants to call itself the Seminoles.

Edited by nliedel 2005-08-06 7:36 PM

Next thing you know PETA will want all teams with the names of animals changed.

Faced with this NCAA ruling the Seminole Tribal Council, the governing body of the Seminole Indian Nation issued the following resolution:

The Tribal Council's resolution reads, in part, that the "Seminole Tribe of Florida has an established relationship with Florida State University, which includes its permission to use the name, 'Seminole,' as well as various Seminole symbols and images, such as Chief Osceola, for educational purposes and the Seminole Tribe of Florida wishes to go on record that it has not opposed, and, in fact, supports the continued use of the name 'Seminole.'" The resolution also supports the use of the Seminole head logo, which is endorsed by the university.

In responce to the NCAA ruling the presidnt of FSU issued the following statement:

"Florida State University is stunned at the complete lack of appreciation for cultural diversity shown by the National Collegiate Athletic Association's executive committee, which announced today a policy banning schools using Native American names and symbols from hosting NCAA championship events. That the NCAA would now label our close bond with the Seminole Tribe of Florida as culturally "hostile and abusive" is both outrageous and insulting.

On June 17, the Tribal Council of the Seminole Tribe of Florida spoke unequivocally of its support for Florida State University in its use of the Seminole name and related symbols. Accordingly, I intend to pursue all legal avenues to ensure that this unacceptable decision is overturned, and that this university will forever be associated with the "unconquered" spirit of the Seminole Tribe of Florida.

National surveys have shown in recent years that an overwhelming majority of Native Americans are not offended by the use of Native American names and symbols. In making its decision, the executive committee has been swayed by a strident minority of activists who claim to speak for all Native Americans. It is unconscionable that the Seminole Tribe of Florida has been ignored.

The rules as we understand them would have us cover the Seminole name and symbol as if we were embarrassed, and any committee that would think that is a proper and respectful treatment of Native Americans should be ashamed."

Bottom line, I guess the NCAA is telling the Seminole nation what they should think. P.C. B.S.

I am waiting for the latest copy of the Seminole Tribune to come out to read the letters. Always interesting. I do think the council handled this well in their statements and support of the school. If it does not bother us as a nation why should it bother the US Government?

Edited by nliedel 2005-08-08 7:44 AM