General Discussion Triathlon Talk » Has anyone sucessfully changed their running form? Rss Feed  
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2011-03-06 10:15 AM

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Subject: Has anyone sucessfully changed their running form?

Folks,

I am contemplating trying to change my running form. I used to think that you can't really change your form and that it is what it is. I'm still not sure how much you can change it, but am willing to try. What works for triathletes Pose method Chi?

Kevin 



2011-03-06 10:30 AM
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Subject: RE: Has anyone sucessfully changed their running form?

I used to be a heel striker and had quit running due to knee pain.  Took up Chi running about 10 mos ago and it set me free.  I can now run for hours without pain. 

Caveat:  Changing form is difficult.  It's like learning to walk again.  You have to re-train years of muscle memory = you feel like a retard for months.  Take classes, take it slow, be patient with yourself and concentrate on your form and it can change for the better.

2011-03-06 10:39 AM
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Subject: RE: Has anyone sucessfully changed their running form?
Yes. I had to focus on form and dropped speed and distance but now the old way is very uncomfortable. Took about two months of feeling foolish then several more months to get the speed and distance. Amazing to see the difference in my shoe wear. I feel better and am now faster than before.
2011-03-06 11:13 AM
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Subject: RE: Has anyone sucessfully changed their running form?
About 30 years ago, I switched from forefoot to heel stile because of stress fracture in my metatarsals. I also have also always worked on making the foot strike as quiet as possible. I think it has kept me injury free. TW
2011-03-06 11:40 AM
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Subject: RE: Has anyone sucessfully changed their running form?
I read the Chi book but never really felt like I was able to implement the forward lean very effectively. After a couple of months away from running at the end of tri season a couple years back. I rebuilt my form on a mid-foot strike, abandoning the heel strike. The form seemed to click immediately. I ran track in high school, and that's the way you run in spikes. I started slowly and built up slowly. Even still, my Achilles and calf muscles were tight for months. I stretched all the time. Every time I added more distance, there was tightness. It was totally worth it for me. It's better for my posture and it just feels right.

Why do you feel you need to change your form?
2011-03-06 11:51 AM
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Subject: RE: Has anyone sucessfully changed their running form?
La Tortuga - 2011-03-06 8:30 AM

I used to be a heel striker and had quit running due to knee pain.  Took up Chi running about 10 mos ago and it set me free.  I can now run for hours without pain.  

 

x2 on Chi Running.  I started to change my form in July 2010.  It's a work in progress, so the changes don't happen overnight.  It's a little tedious at first implementing all of the changes.  After a while it becomes second nature, and I'm glad I took the time to do it. 



Edited by betyoursilver 2011-03-06 11:53 AM


2011-03-06 11:57 AM
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Subject: RE: Has anyone sucessfully changed their running form?
La Tortuga - 2011-03-06 10:30 AM

I used to be a heel striker and had quit running due to knee pain.  Took up Chi running about 10 mos ago and it set me free.  I can now run for hours without pain. 

Caveat:  Changing form is difficult.  It's like learning to walk again.  You have to re-train years of muscle memory = you feel like a retard for months.  Take classes, take it slow, be patient with yourself and concentrate on your form and it can change for the better.

Off topic but forgive me I can't help it.  Please rethink your choice of words.  Thanks.

2011-03-06 12:34 PM
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Subject: RE: Has anyone sucessfully changed their running form?
tbcoffee - 2011-03-06 12:57 PM
La Tortuga - 2011-03-06 10:30 AM

I used to be a heel striker and had quit running due to knee pain.  Took up Chi running about 10 mos ago and it set me free.  I can now run for hours without pain. 

Caveat:  Changing form is difficult.  It's like learning to walk again.  You have to re-train years of muscle memory = you feel like a retard for months.  Take classes, take it slow, be patient with yourself and concentrate on your form and it can change for the better.

Off topic but forgive me I can't help it.  Please rethink your choice of words.  Thanks.

PUCHICA!!  Busted by the PCG!  (Political Correctness Gestapo)



Edited by La Tortuga 2011-03-06 12:35 PM
2011-03-06 1:05 PM
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Subject: RE: Has anyone sucessfully changed their running form?
I used to be a heavy heel striker, but got ot where the pain in my low back with every foot strike was intolerable. I read Chi Running & implemented some of his stuff, then took some clinics by Bobby McGee in Boulder, CO (best run coach ever), and now when I run I have zero pain. I did have to start back from scratch as far as endurance goes, but it didn't matter because I couldn't run with my old form anyway.
2011-03-06 1:09 PM
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Subject: RE: Has anyone sucessfully changed their running form?

thanks for the replies. Here are the reasons for contemplating a change. I am burning through running shoes in about 8 weeks. I am wearing the outside of the heels off at very steep angles indicating that I am heel striking and supinating. My ankles are very tight. I have always been a supinator, but it appears to be getting worse based on shoe wear pattern. I have been experiencing calf and hamstring cramps during races and long training runs.

Kevin

   

2011-03-06 1:09 PM
in reply to: #3384874

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Subject: RE: Has anyone sucessfully changed their running form?

thanks for the replies. Here are the reasons for contemplating a change. I am burning through running shoes in about 8 weeks. I am wearing the outside of the heels off at very steep angles indicating that I am heel striking and supinating. My ankles are very tight. I have always been a supinator, but it appears to be getting worse based on shoe wear pattern. I have been experiencing calf and hamstring cramps during races and long training runs.

Kevin

   



2011-03-06 1:12 PM
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Subject: RE: Has anyone sucessfully changed their running form?

I bought into the midfoot strike deal a few years ago and slowly changed my form. I can't say that it's the sole reason that I've improved, but I'm very comfortable running in this form now and have never been faster.

Good luck!

2011-03-06 1:40 PM
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Subject: RE: Has anyone sucessfully changed their running form?
Are you using the same shoes all the time?  Maybe you are just not using the right shoes for your type of running, I'm sure there are shoes that have support for supinators.  Honestly I wouldn't mess too much with your gait as far as what part of your foot strikes first, but rather where it strikes in relation to the rest of your body.  For the most efficiency you should be striking beneath your center of gravity and running at a cadence of about 180 steps/min.  Try upping the cadence first as that alone will help keep you from overstriding and may get you to land your feet where they should.  As La Tortuga said, it can take months to change your gait and you pretty much have to start from scratch.
2011-03-06 1:43 PM
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Subject: RE: Has anyone sucessfully changed their running form?

Back in '06 my tri coach put on a running clinic and wanted me to change from heel striker to mid foot lander. I did what he recommended adn within 2 weeks had PF issues then got achillies issues both which I struggled with for over a year.

Older you are the harder it is to change your running form and avoid getting injured as your body is used the movement pattern you have had for many years.

I was 45 when I made the change. Just be careful

2011-03-06 1:50 PM
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Subject: RE: Has anyone sucessfully changed their running form?
tbcoffee - 2011-03-06 12:40 PM

Are you using the same shoes all the time?  Maybe you are just not using the right shoes for your type of running, I'm sure there are shoes that have support for supinators.  Honestly I wouldn't mess too much with your gait as far as what part of your foot strikes first, but rather where it strikes in relation to the rest of your body.  For the most efficiency you should be striking beneath your center of gravity and running at a cadence of about 180 steps/min.  Try upping the cadence first as that alone will help keep you from overstriding and may get you to land your feet where they should.  As La Tortuga said, it can take months to change your gait and you pretty much have to start from scratch.


This is really good advice. That's actually the major change I made was WHERE my foot landed in relation to my center of gravity. This changes other components of your stride along with it, but you don't need to think about it as much. As more time goes by i am moving from a heel first landing (but still under my center of gravity) to a midfoot landing (still under my center of gravity) because it's feeling more and more natural.

It's most noticable when I'm coaching on the pool deck and doing quick jogs from one end to the other...very clear forefoot landing, since I'm barefoot on concrete. Fatigue not being an issue (short 25 yd sprints), I actually enjoy these little runs from one end to the other as part of my running "tune ups".
2011-03-06 2:13 PM
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Subject: RE: Has anyone sucessfully changed their running form?

This is coming from someone who doesn't really believe in the new 'running form' hype, but I do believe in a number of studies that showed that the cerebellum (lower-order brain function) is responsible for most of the run/walk motions, meaning it is subconsciously programmed. You can sever the spinal cord of a cat to disconnect the brain, walk them on a treadmill, and they'll still have a spinal walking and even running reflex. 

 

I'd recommend for all interested in changing their running form, to focus less on the mechanics of the form, and incorporating more short, fast (and even VERY fast) 100-200m pickups throughout their runs.

 

The purpose won't be to develop leg speed or explosiveness (although that is a good side effect if you do a lot of them) but rather to settle into a more efficient gait. As you start getting used to running very fast, you will automatically eliminate a lot of the inefficient motions.

 

Having run a lot in the past before, I'll also caution runners that looking as smooth as an olympic marathon runner at fast speeds is highly a function of fitness. If you're not a strong runner, it will be pretty much impossible to look like a strong runner at high speeds. In ramping from 30 to 70,80, and beyond miles per week, running 6-6:30 min/mile became not as big a deal, and I started to get a lot of comments about how 'smooth' I looked, when in reality, it was way more about the aerobic engine which allowed me to take those smooth strides.

 

PS for newbs as well - run technique (or the lack thereof) is vastly different than swimming, where actively acquired technique is crucial and fundamental. I pretty much never focus on my technique on running and just focus on running faster whereas I obsess about technique on swimming even if it means going slower.



2011-03-06 3:43 PM
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Subject: RE: Has anyone sucessfully changed their running form?
KathyG - 2011-03-06 11:43 AM

Back in '06 my tri coach put on a running clinic and wanted me to change from heel striker to mid foot lander. I did what he recommended adn within 2 weeks had PF issues then got achillies issues both which I struggled with for over a year.

Older you are the harder it is to change your running form and avoid getting injured as your body is used the movement pattern you have had for many years.

I was 45 when I made the change. Just be careful

If you made that change without drastically reducing your mileage and intensity, then it only stands to reason you had the physical issues.

2011-03-06 3:47 PM
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Subject: RE: Has anyone sucessfully changed their running form?
La Tortuga - 2011-03-06 12:34 PM
tbcoffee - 2011-03-06 12:57 PM
La Tortuga - 2011-03-06 10:30 AM

I used to be a heel striker and had quit running due to knee pain.  Took up Chi running about 10 mos ago and it set me free.  I can now run for hours without pain. 

Caveat:  Changing form is difficult.  It's like learning to walk again.  You have to re-train years of muscle memory = you feel like a retard for months.  Take classes, take it slow, be patient with yourself and concentrate on your form and it can change for the better.

Off topic but forgive me I can't help it.  Please rethink your choice of words.  Thanks.

PUCHICA!!  Busted by the PCG!  (Political Correctness Gestapo)

More like busted by somebody who realizes what's acceptable and what's not on BT.

2011-03-06 3:49 PM
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Subject: RE: Has anyone sucessfully changed their running form?
agarose2000 - 2011-03-06 1:13 PM

This is coming from someone who doesn't really believe in the new 'running form' hype, but I do believe in a number of studies that showed that the cerebellum (lower-order brain function) is responsible for most of the run/walk motions, meaning it is subconsciously programmed. You can sever the spinal cord of a cat to disconnect the brain, walk them on a treadmill, and they'll still have a spinal walking and even running reflex. 



The cerebellum is responsible for balance, and the spinal cord contains a "cross reflex" that allows for movement of the opposing side of the body. But there are conscious choices as far as how to put these things in motion. The cerebellum & cross reflex activities are very much in play in activities like throwing a baseball or swinging a golf club as well...there are parts of the activity you don't have to think about. That doesn't mean that you can't "fast track" to a more efficient stride by making some conscious choices and allow the primitive brain & reflexes to do their thing as well.

2011-03-06 4:03 PM
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Subject: RE: Has anyone sucessfully changed their running form?
chevy57 - 2011-03-06 12:09 PM

thanks for the replies. Here are the reasons for contemplating a change. I am burning through running shoes in about 8 weeks. I am wearing the outside of the heels off at very steep angles indicating that I am heel striking and supinating. My ankles are very tight. I have always been a supinator, but it appears to be getting worse based on shoe wear pattern. I have been experiencing calf and hamstring cramps during races and long training runs.

Kevin

   

Obviously you're heel striking. Whether you're supinating is uncertain. Lots of overstriders land on the outside edge of the heel, then roll through to the big toe area. Supinators tend to wear out the entire outside edge, not just the heel. What kind of shoes are you running in? If you're running in a shoe meant to control overpronation, it could be part of the problem.

Anyway, as evidenced, people can successfully change their running form. It takes lots of work and it's a slow process, but it can be done. I did it several years ago and it took a year or so to get back to where I was speedwise. However since then I've continued to improve because the new form allows me to run more. I'm still getting better. Set a new 10 mile PR today.

2011-03-06 4:20 PM
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Subject: RE: Has anyone sucessfully changed their running form?

Many have. I made the final phase of my switch in the last year. But it was also part of essentially starting over from scratch anyway due to other issues. In any case, what you want to do is this:

* Take shorter, quicker strides. Meaning your feet will hit the ground more often and spend less time on the ground on each step. Some people think the golden number os a 180 cadence. Just go in that direction.
* RELAX the lower leg. Don't try to stay on your toes.
* Keep your foot contact under your center of gravity. This means don't overstride. Much of the heel strike talked about so vigorously in the barefoot running community is a direct result of reaching out with your leg to meet the ground too soon, lengthening the stride by reaching forward instead of pushing behind.
* Use your hips and hamstrings for propulsion instead of the calves.

Forefoot or midfoot landing is your most likely result of doing the above, but should NOT be a goal in and of itself.

I just wrote up a post on my blog a few days ago about this...

Anyway, hope that helps.



2011-03-06 4:29 PM
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Subject: RE: Has anyone sucessfully changed their running form?
briderdt - 2011-03-06 4:43 PM
KathyG - 2011-03-06 11:43 AM

Back in '06 my tri coach put on a running clinic and wanted me to change from heel striker to mid foot lander. I did what he recommended adn within 2 weeks had PF issues then got achillies issues both which I struggled with for over a year.

Older you are the harder it is to change your running form and avoid getting injured as your body is used the movement pattern you have had for many years.

I was 45 when I made the change. Just be careful

If you made that change without drastically reducing your mileage and intensity, then it only stands to reason you had the physical issues.

I had a coach and he had a plan to have me gradually adapt and make the change. I had zero intensity but all easy running. They worked with other athletes (all were younger than I) to make changes to. I was the only one that had lingering issues from making the change.

About 4 months after I was struggling with PF and Achillies issues I read something Friel wrote that basically said if you are over 40 don't change your running style as it can cause injuries.

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