General Discussion Triathlon Talk » Running Form - Upper Body Rss Feed  
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2011-10-28 11:53 AM

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Subject: Running Form - Upper Body

I'm about three weeks removed from my marathon race, and one of the biggest things I noticed about my running this season was how tense/tight I feel in my arms and shoulders, particularly during and after runs longer than 7 miles. When I do longer runs I find myself periodically having to break away from my normal arm swinging motion and really shake out my arms muscles to loosen them up. I get shoulder tightness during runs. On really long run my trapezius muscles near my neck are always sore the following morning after sleeping (not painful, mind you).

I'm pretty big into constantly self assessing my technique and motion (which likely stems from my swim coaching background) so I'm pretty self-aware of what I'm doing. I don't feel like I'm tensing or shrugging my shoulders as I run, but the muscle tightness suggests otherwise. My inclination is to blame my arm motion. I run pretty up right (i.e. no slouching - see avatar), I hold the bend in my arms with a strict 90 angles or smaller, and have a slight but not dramtic body cross over with my hands. My thinking, based on this, is that I need to open up my arm angle a bit and create a slightly larger/looser swinging motion. I would like to experiment this offseason with this, although it wouldn't feel to natural, at least at first. What say you BT, any thoughts?



2011-10-28 12:02 PM
in reply to: #3742446

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Runner
Subject: RE: Running Form - Upper Body
You can definitely try opening up your arms a little more, and that might help some. But mostly, I find that it comes down to practice. You have to practice running relaxed, which may actually mean letting your body go and finding its own natural state. Be aware of things, but try not to get too involved with them.

When you run, how do you feel? Do you feel smooth, fluid, loose and relaxed? Do you feel "in control", meaning that you are focused on holding your arms a specific way, moving your legs a specific way?

The other thing that helps is shrugging your shoulders every so often. Helps to break the monotony and to get you aware of how tight you might be. When you do notice yourself tensing or getting tight, imagine a knotted rope, and as you untie a knot, focus on relaxing a part of your body.
2011-10-28 12:20 PM
in reply to: #3742446

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Subject: RE: Running Form - Upper Body
From just looking at your profile picture it looks like you are carrying you arms too high.  I try to make sure my hands are passing just about waist high as I run.  As the other post mentioned, it should feel smooth as you run.  Try to concentrate on where your arms pass.  Easy to do and you may feel a difference right away.
2011-10-28 12:20 PM
in reply to: #3742463

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Subject: RE: Running Form - Upper Body

Scout7 - 2011-10-28 12:02 PM When you run, how do you feel? Do you feel smooth, fluid, loose and relaxed? Do you feel "in control", meaning that you are focused on holding your arms a specific way, moving your legs a specific way?

When I'm running well and feeling good on a run I am very much in control, almost machine-like; every motion is moving in a designed way. The training itself is relaxing but I wouldn't necessarily say my body is relaxed or loose.

I like your suggestions, and perhaps I'm attempting to get "too involved." My initial thinking is that if I tweak my motion it will force a more relaxed motion, especially on longer runs when I go into zone out mode.

2011-10-28 12:25 PM
in reply to: #3742506

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Subject: RE: Running Form - Upper Body
Barkeep - 2011-10-28 1:20 PM

Scout7 - 2011-10-28 12:02 PM When you run, how do you feel? Do you feel smooth, fluid, loose and relaxed? Do you feel "in control", meaning that you are focused on holding your arms a specific way, moving your legs a specific way?

When I'm running well and feeling good on a run I am very much in control, almost machine-like; every motion is moving in a designed way. The training itself is relaxing but I wouldn't necessarily say my body is relaxed or loose.

I like your suggestions, and perhaps I'm attempting to get "too involved." My initial thinking is that if I tweak my motion it will force a more relaxed motion, especially on longer runs when I go into zone out mode.



Yeah, I was guessing that would be your answer based on your initial post.

Your swimming background has trained you to focus on very detailed, specific body position and technique. Running is more natural, and much less technique oriented. The hardest thing sometimes is getting our brains out of the way of our bodies.
2011-10-28 1:30 PM
in reply to: #3742446

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Subject: RE: Running Form - Upper Body

I agree with Scout completely.  In addition to zoning out and shrugging shoulders occasionally, I find a few other things (besides doing drills occasionally) helpful, especially if I notice that I'm tense or feeling awkward or uncomfortable.

1.  Deep exhalation.  Hold your breath for a second, then take deep relaxing breath out.

2.  Change of pace.  Doing a 30s stride where I focus on staying relaxed helps.  Think 'float' and 'glide' not 'push'.

3.  Do something silly.  If I'm really feeling awkward, I might stop and do ten jumping jacks or some such thing.  I don't know why this works.  Sometimes it does.  I feel it's like hitting the 'reset' button on my brain.



2011-10-29 3:41 PM
in reply to: #3742446

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Subject: RE: Running Form - Upper Body

I have a bit of a different take.

Your running form sounds pretty spot on. Arms 90 degrees or less, little body cross over, etc.

Could it be that the muscles in your shoulders/back are tighter than most others from your swimming background? Or even that your shoulders/back are conditioned for the endurance part on the run but you are using other muscles in running that aren't developed from swimming.

My recommendation is to start with some shoulder and back stretching to loosen up that area before running. IMO, your form is good.



Edited by SCamp07 2011-10-29 3:42 PM
2011-10-29 4:14 PM
in reply to: #3743714

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Subject: RE: Running Form - Upper Body
SCamp07 - 2011-10-29 4:41 PM

I have a bit of a different take.

Your running form sounds pretty spot on. Arms 90 degrees or less, little body cross over, etc.

Could it be that the muscles in your shoulders/back are tighter than most others from your swimming background? Or even that your shoulders/back are conditioned for the endurance part on the run but you are using other muscles in running that aren't developed from swimming.

My recommendation is to start with some shoulder and back stretching to loosen up that area before running. IMO, your form is good.

Just to be clear: I wasn't making any claims about OP's form -- I've never seen him run.  I was discussing techniques for relaxing, because it is clear that OP is tensing up during the run.  (Relaxing should also have the positive side effect of helping him run with good form.)

In general, swimmers would have looser than average shoulders and backs (i.e., greater than average range of motion).

2011-10-30 10:46 AM
in reply to: #3742446

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Subject: RE: Running Form - Upper Body

caveat: I am by NO means a running expert, but I am going to just throw a few things out there as I have learned from my own experience/observations:

The fact that the tense upper body occurs after you have put in several miles (as opposed to right out the gate), seems like maybe there is fatigue or tightess occuring somewhere else? How do you feel in your lower body when this starts to happen? Is your gait changing as your legs or core get tired? Be very observant about this.

I have been dealing with tight hip flexors. My run, even at a fast pace has always been the "shuffle". I have been having some muscle activation therapy done on my hips and glutes and the first run or bike after these tight mucsles are released is amazing! On my run this morning, I noticed I naturally wanted to lift my knees higher as I had much better range of motion and power than before. In addition, I noticed that my upper body was very relaxed and my hands were lower, brushing my waistine. Normally, I have to consciously keep my upper body in check throughout the entire run, I am usually very tense, hands up high and clenched.

Just somethig to think about, I hope you get it figured out!

 

2011-10-30 11:20 AM
in reply to: #3744245

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Subject: RE: Running Form - Upper Body
kc_racer - 2011-10-30 11:46 AM

caveat: I am by NO means a running expert, but I am going to just throw a few things out there as I have learned from my own experience/observations:

The fact that the tense upper body occurs after you have put in several miles (as opposed to right out the gate), seems like maybe there is fatigue or tightess occuring somewhere else? How do you feel in your lower body when this starts to happen? Is your gait changing as your legs or core get tired? Be very observant about this.

I have been dealing with tight hip flexors. My run, even at a fast pace has always been the "shuffle". I have been having some muscle activation therapy done on my hips and glutes and the first run or bike after these tight mucsles are released is amazing! On my run this morning, I noticed I naturally wanted to lift my knees higher as I had much better range of motion and power than before. In addition, I noticed that my upper body was very relaxed and my hands were lower, brushing my waistine. Normally, I have to consciously keep my upper body in check throughout the entire run, I am usually very tense, hands up high and clenched.

Just somethig to think about, I hope you get it figured out!

Those are some good observations.  In general, tension in one area of the body will create more tension in other areas.  So yeah, if the lower body is tense, the upper is likely to follow suit.

2011-10-30 11:45 AM
in reply to: #3742616

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Subject: RE: Running Form - Upper Body
Experior - 2011-10-28 1:30 PM

I agree with Scout completely.  In addition to zoning out and shrugging shoulders occasionally, I find a few other things (besides doing drills occasionally) helpful, especially if I notice that I'm tense or feeling awkward or uncomfortable.

1.  Deep exhalation.  Hold your breath for a second, then take deep relaxing breath out.

2.  Change of pace.  Doing a 30s stride where I focus on staying relaxed helps.  Think 'float' and 'glide' not 'push'.

3.  Do something silly.  If I'm really feeling awkward, I might stop and do ten jumping jacks or some such thing.  I don't know why this works.  Sometimes it does.  I feel it's like hitting the 'reset' button on my brain.

 

When I get tense on a run I find my arms coming in to my sides tigh and not swinging pace shortens up and I feel like I am crawling.

 

1.The deep inhalation and exhalation is like some sort of trigger realease.  Bang, I am loose again.

2.Sometimes I do the goofy, When no one is looking I'll run to the groove of the music for a while, waving my arms around "like a rock star".  Its a small town so I have tobe careful.  Don't want to be seen and embarass my middle school kids.

 

 



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