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2005-12-28 11:08 AM

Expert
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Miller Place, Long Island
Subject: HELP!!-Going Backwards
On staurday, I was so totally thrilled that I was able to run nine miles for the first time without stopping. I averaged under 10 min per mile and I was psyched about my progress and proud of my accomplishment... BUT...

The last two runs that I have had since have been totally frustrating and disheartening. Today, I was struggling after the first 2 miles of a 53 minute run. My HR went way up, My legs were tired, my breathing was labored and I had no rythym. I even had to take some walk breaks starting at about 38 minutes into the run just to finish up.

I can not begin to explain how frustrating this is. I don't know what happened to me all of a sudden, but I feal like I did 4 months ago when I couldn't run 4 miles. If you look at my logs, you will see all of the progress I have made and now this??

What gives??!?

Edited by mscotthall 2005-12-28 11:09 AM


2005-12-28 11:36 AM
in reply to: #312444

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Crystal Lake, IL
Subject: RE: HELP!!-Going Backwards

I'm sure that much more experienced experts are about to chime in with technical advice that is way beyond me, but here's a response from a fellow beginner for you.  Don't let any short term "setbacks" get to you.  First of all, they are not setbacks.  I think it's part of the tear down/build up process.  Second, after setting a new distance or speed record I almost always see less than stellar results in my next few workouts, especially compared to my new PR.  I just assume that that's what makes a PR a PR.  For us newbies they come pretty often, but we can't expect one every workout.  Third, I've noticed I occassionally need a short break from one discipline.  I try to emphasize one each week and rotate that.  I've been run-heavy lately and need to break out of it.  When I do that I notice I'm stronger in the next discipline and I'm guessing it's because the muscles are rested and my overall fitness is constantly improving. 

Like I said, there will be better more technical responses to follow, but I'm just saying don't let this get to you, overall you will continue making progress.  Stick with it!

2005-12-28 11:37 AM
in reply to: #312444

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Pro
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Virginia Beach, VA
Subject: RE: HELP!!-Going Backwards
Could you be overtraining? Or maybe you just need more recovery from your last long run? Has the weather changes since? Or maybe you'r just too focused on TRYING to run fast/far. Take a few days off from running, then go out with the intent to just relax and enjoy a run.  Forget about your pace and HR...just run easy and let everything else go.  And even leave your watch at home.  You can't begin pushing yourself until running feels good again.
2005-12-28 12:24 PM
in reply to: #312444

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Coach
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Boston, MA
Subject: RE: HELP!!-Going Backwards
Do you usually monitor your resting heart rate?
2005-12-28 1:05 PM
in reply to: #312444

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The Original
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Raleigh/Durham
Subject: RE: HELP!!-Going Backwards
Every run can't be a good run.  If it happened that way, running wouldn't be such a challenge and we'd get bored from it.  I have found that I have bad running days and there's no rhyme or reason behind it.  For that reason, I always try to learn from my bad runs and cherish my good runs.  When I have a good run I talk about it for days because it doesn't happen often   Don't worry- all those bad runs will make your good run even better!
2005-12-28 1:37 PM
in reply to: #312444

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Expert
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McKinney, TX
Subject: RE: HELP!!-Going Backwards
I've had similar problems this week (see my logs) .  Very frustrating to have come so far and then backtrack for some unknown reason.  I just keep telling myself it's one of those flukey things and it'll get better soon.  Don't give up!


2005-12-28 2:33 PM
in reply to: #312444

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Kaneohe, Hawaii
Subject: RE: HELP!!-Going Backwards

Having just set a distance PR of my own a few weeks ago (old PR of 9.5 to new PR of 11.5 miles) I can tell you I experienced some big fatigue in my lower half and even had to fight off a cold. I attribute this to my long run. As noobs our bodies aren't use to such punishment. The demands of running for more than 1 hour are huge and it takes a lot of time to recover. I'm guessing this is what you are experiencing.

It was asked earlier if you monitor your resting heart rate (RHR). Your RHR is a very good indicator of your body's state of fitness. To measure your RHR take a pulse check first thing in the morning BEFORE you sit up or stand up in bed (getting verticle changes all sorts of dynamics with the circulatory system which will change your results). Upon waking look at the clock and count your pulse for 1 minute. Enter that number into your BT Training Log. As the months go by and you continue to train you will probably see this number slowly decrease. However, if you wake and your RHR which is normally in the neighborhood of 48-50 is now 58-60 you know something is going on. The two main culprits are usually 1) Overtraining: take some time off or greatly reduce your volume/intensity and let your body recover, 2) You are getting sick: take some time off or greatly reduce your volume/intensity and let your body recover.

As stated above, every run, bike or swim can not and will not be a PR. Endurance training requires a lot of endurance (I can't believe I just said that) not just in the cardio/pulmanary area but in the patience/tenacity area. Don't get discouraged. Just realize that this is a normal aspect of your training and it will soon pass as long as you treat it accordingly.

2005-12-28 4:32 PM
in reply to: #312444

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Subject: RE: HELP!!-Going Backwards

I jsut glanced at the other responses, but my first guess would be overtraining, or not enough rest between a big workout and a medium workout.

1. start loging your resting heart rate.

2. stretch after your runs for 10 to 15 minutes, for a few minutes of that have your legs elivated, it's my belief that it helps flush the lactic acid out of your muscles. On the day after a big workout do a very short run just to get your heart rate up and repeat the stretching process.

3. Don't expect to have a great performance a couple of days after a real tough workout.

4. This is something I can't say I understand, but like gravity, I know it's true. Long runs ran at a low heart rate do more good in training than long runs where you push yourself too hard. A heart rate monitor is a must for optimal training.

5. This advise is coming from somoen with no formal training, just what I have noticed over the years.

6. If any of my advise is contrary to TH3_FRB, listen to him, he's one well informed dude!

Good Luck and Happy Holidays

Jim

2005-12-28 4:55 PM
in reply to: #312680

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Pro
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Virginia Beach, VA
Subject: RE: HELP!!-Going Backwards

You're right on Jim...and I appreciate the compliment!  A simple lack of recovery would be my first guess but it could also be overtraining....or maybe just a bad day.  Regardless, a HRM is a "must have" training tool IMHO.  They can be had for $50 or less if you're on a budget and will provide instant feedback during your training session.  You can also monitor your resting HR on a daily basis to get a feel for your current state...a resting HR that is considerably different from usual can tip you off to over training or the need for additional recovery before pushing again.  Spinning or easy swimming can be great for recovery from long/hard runs.  It's low impact and will help circulate blood and flush the muscles of the nasties generated during your abuse the day before.

crusevegas - 2005-12-28 5:32 PM

I jsut glanced at the other responses, but my first guess would be overtraining, or not enough rest between a big workout and a medium workout.

1. start loging your resting heart rate.

2. stretch after your runs for 10 to 15 minutes, for a few minutes of that have your legs elivated, it's my belief that it helps flush the lactic acid out of your muscles. On the day after a big workout do a very short run just to get your heart rate up and repeat the stretching process.

3. Don't expect to have a great performance a couple of days after a real tough workout.

4. This is something I can't say I understand, but like gravity, I know it's true. Long runs ran at a low heart rate do more good in training than long runs where you push yourself too hard. A heart rate monitor is a must for optimal training.

5. This advise is coming from somoen with no formal training, just what I have noticed over the years.

6. If any of my advise is contrary to TH3_FRB, listen to him, he's one well informed dude!

Good Luck and Happy Holidays

Jim

2005-12-28 10:36 PM
in reply to: #312444

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Elite
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Racine, WI
Subject: RE: HELP!!-Going Backwards

Another vote for not enough recovery. today is Wed (right? I hope...LOL) You did a hard run on Sat and you've already run twice since then. And Sat was your longest run to date. I think some rest/crosstraining might help. Other options....feeling sick? Sleeping enough? Eating right? Either of these could easily lead to short term poor trianing quite suddenly.

I would do easy crosstraining for a couple of days, make sure you eat/sleep well, and then go out and run how you feel...but don't go for another PR on speed OR distance.    You did the distance once and you  WILL do it again   ( although I don't mean to try it on the next run....absolutely not! )   don't worry about a couple of bad runs everyone has them. 



Edited by CindyK 2005-12-28 10:38 PM
2005-12-28 10:48 PM
in reply to: #312444

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Master
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Subject: RE: HELP!!-Going Backwards

I know others have been saying it, but I dont think it can be said enough... Triathletes are usually A type people who are diriven to win at all cost... This is what makes us cool, interesting, and fun folks to be around and also drives us to do silly things like an IronMan or a 200 mile bike ride, however in our drive to "win" we often over do it...

You probably need a bit of rest from running.



2005-12-29 7:03 AM
in reply to: #312444

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Coach
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Boston, MA
Subject: RE: HELP!!-Going Backwards

Mike – I reviewed your logs for the last 3 months to try to figure out what’s going on. From Oct to date you had been increasing your running volume carefully with the exception of a few weeks where your jump in volume was a lot more than the usual 10% rule. Also you usually add 1 day rest every week which is good. What surprised me was that fact that for those 3 months your intensity (pace) for every single run is pretty much the SAME. Did you ever determine your different HR training zones? I think what’s happening is that you’ve been constantly stimulating your body at the same intensity for 3 months and even when I don’t know your intensity training zones you might be training at a higher intensity that you should and this might be causing fatigue…

2005-12-30 8:46 AM
in reply to: #312444

Expert
1030
100025
Miller Place, Long Island
Subject: RE: HELP!!-Going Backwards
Thanks everyone for all of your help. I am going to take a look at my training plan and possibly put something together that will give me more time to recover and the opportunity to train at different intensities throughout the week. I also realize that I need to get back to the 10% rule and I have gone a bit overboard lately. Hopefully, when I make these adjustments, things will improve.

Thanks!
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