General Discussion Triathlon Talk » Calves Cramping During the Swim? Rss Feed  
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2012-01-23 3:23 PM

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Subject: Calves Cramping During the Swim?

New to the tri scene and have only recently discovered this forum. What wealth of information.

 

So here is my newbie question. I have only done a couple of tri's (Oly and and IM 70.3). Both took place in water that was around 62. In both events my calves cramped up less than half way through the swim to the point where I couldn't kick and had to swim the rest of the way arms only. I was wearing a full wetsuit. I really started swimming 2 yrs ago and in preperation for the races have been swimming with a masters group at least 3 if not 4 times a week. I never cramp during swim workouts and as soon as I hit the bike they work themselves out. No further problems with cramping on the bike or run. 

Anyone else face this problem? Any thoughts or advice as to a solution. I am signed up for IMCDA and am a little concerned about the swim.

Thanks for the help in advance. Look forward to making some new virtual friends.

 



2012-01-23 4:12 PM
in reply to: #4006616

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Subject: RE: Calves Cramping During the Swim?

This is common - legs cramping during Race Day swim.  Despite 4 years an approx 800k of consistent swimming, it still happens to me.  My foot also falls asleep - but only during races.

My Theory is: despite trying to replicate Race Day intensity in training, we can't.  You can't duplicate the adrenaline, the intensity, how our muscles react to a taper. 

One thing I've done is used the kickboard a lot more.  Yes the Triathlon Swim kick is not of paramount importance; however, it is highly underrated.  Again, despite the fact we usually focus on our front quadrant when swimming, in Race Day conditions I believe we kick harder and faster than we are accustomed to in training.  And it's not that we do it on purpose, it's just part of Race Day adrenaline and competition. 

I've been using the kickboard every pool session, and I'm even timing my KB 100's to track progress.  I've been told to relax my ankles and kick from the hips.  And the beauty of using the kickboard is promotes Active Recovery in the legs from Running and Cycling.  So it's a win-win.

 

2012-01-23 5:26 PM
in reply to: #4006717

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Subject: RE: Calves Cramping During the Swim?
Dream Chaser - 2012-01-23 5:12 PM

This is common - legs cramping during Race Day swim.  Despite 4 years an approx 800k of consistent swimming, it still happens to me.  My foot also falls asleep - but only during races.

My Theory is: despite trying to replicate Race Day intensity in training, we can't.  You can't duplicate the adrenaline, the intensity, how our muscles react to a taper. 

One thing I've done is used the kickboard a lot more.  Yes the Triathlon Swim kick is not of paramount importance; however, it is highly underrated.  Again, despite the fact we usually focus on our front quadrant when swimming, in Race Day conditions I believe we kick harder and faster than we are accustomed to in training.  And it's not that we do it on purpose, it's just part of Race Day adrenaline and competition. 

I've been using the kickboard every pool session, and I'm even timing my KB 100's to track progress.  I've been told to relax my ankles and kick from the hips.  And the beauty of using the kickboard is promotes Active Recovery in the legs from Running and Cycling.  So it's a win-win.

 



I've experienced the same thing. I've also wondered if wearing a wetsuit plays into it, too...
2012-01-23 8:29 PM
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Subject: RE: Calves Cramping During the Swim?
The lifeguard saw me go under water when I first started swimming because of a bad cramp. She said she knew I was new to swimming if I was cramping. she said I had more of the "runner's kick". Maybe you are tensing up and not allowing for full ROM??? I'm def no expert when it comes to swimming though (LOL), but I don't get cramps anymore when I swim. Maybe the wetsuit won't let you flex as much????
2012-01-24 6:48 AM
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Subject: RE: Calves Cramping During the Swim?

I would guess that the wetsuit adds some compression and actually helps the situation some. I'm thinking along the lines of what DreamChaser said. How much open water practice was there? I'm thinking we go harder than we believe in a race and also that it's a continuous swim. In the pool there are lots of mini-breaks from the position at the wall (no matter how fast you turn). It could have something to do with the extended time with the foot extended, meaning the calf is in the flexed position. It may just be me, but I've noticed in running that calf cramps will happen more towards the back of the stride. In cycling, at the top of the pedal stroke. In all three, the calf is in its most compressed position for the activity.

More swim fitness does help, but so does briefly changing things up. In sprints I just swim straight through, but in Oly on up, I might do the breaststroke once or twice mid-race. A little more often the longer the race. I've seen this recommended and done just before guys finish the swim leg to help them be able to run up better. And that includes sub 1 hr IM guys.



Edited by brigby1 2012-01-24 7:01 AM
2012-01-24 8:21 AM
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Subject: RE: Calves Cramping During the Swim?
I get this in very cold water. and I would consider 62 to be very cold water. What works for me is to flex my foot (toes toward knee) for a few strokes and the cramps go away. Sometimes I have to do this several times to get through it.


2012-01-24 8:36 AM
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Subject: RE: Calves Cramping During the Swim?

Nipper - 2012-01-24 9:21 AM I get this in very cold water. and I would consider 62 to be very cold water. What works for me is to flex my foot (toes toward knee) for a few strokes and the cramps go away. Sometimes I have to do this several times to get through it.

This happens to me also and I have attributed it to (a) my wetsuit being very tight on my calves, (b) my calves being used to a flex at each end of the pool when I turn, and (c) cold water.  The combination of wetsuit and OWS means no break from pointing the toes, so I just flex my feet lightly every 10 breaths or so and it seems to keep the bad cramps at bay.  I can feel them threatening, but they don't seize up.  Flexing hard (though you'd think it would help) seems to make them cramp more IMHO.

2012-01-24 10:55 AM
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Subject: RE: Calves Cramping During the Swim?

Interesting thread and I appreciate others comments.  In my IM last summer my calves cramped very badly as I was exiting the water.  It is the first (and only) time this had ever happened to me.

I attributed it to pushing myself beyond anything I have done in the water.  My longest OWS before the race was about an hour and at a more relaxed pace.  I think anytime you push exertion beyond a certain limit you are much more susceptable to cramping.

This year I will try to get in a few full distance swims in preparation for my next IM.  I think I'll also take a few short stretching breaks or at least roll my ankles around periodically as I swim to relieve some of the tension built from pointing toes for so long.  I do not want that to happen again. 

2012-01-24 11:43 AM
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Subject: RE: Calves Cramping During the Swim?

??Thanks everyone for the feedback. At least I know I am not the only one that deals with this issue. Embarassed

It seems obvious now that people point it out but I have only done those two open water swims. More OWS will have to be added to the training schedule. Hadn't really thought about the fact that you get a chance to relax the calves every 25 yards in a pool but never relax them in OWS.? A few more kicking sessions during training as well. Hadn't thought about tracking those sets, that's great idea. 

I have wondered if the wetsuit was a contributing factor and will be renting a couple different ones in some of the prep tris that I will be doing. Also, as was also pointed out, it is race day and I am most anxious about the swim, maybe some more experience will help with that.

I have changed to a 1 beat kick (total immersion style) so I am hoping this will not only save the legs for the bike and run but help with the cramping. 

 

Cheers,

Tom

2012-01-24 8:09 PM
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Subject: RE: Calves Cramping During the Swim?

Nipper - 2012-01-24 8:21 AM I get this in very cold water. and I would consider 62 to be very cold water. What works for me is to flex my foot (toes toward knee) for a few strokes and the cramps go away. Sometimes I have to do this several times to get through it.

Dave Scott gave part of the athlete briefing at the 2010 Silverman race and talked about "charlie-horse" style calf cramps, which is what I've gotten in the past. Dave recommended "dorsi-flexing" your feet several times throughout the swim portion of the race to prevent calf cramping. This is stretching your foot by bringing your toes upward, toward your shin.....kind of the opposite of what most of us do with our toes while we're swimming. The extra drag does slow you down, but only for the few seconds it takes to do the stretch.

I've gotten leg cramps before on both IM and HIM distance swims and at the pool. Since I heard Dave give this advice, I've done these stretches during all my longer OWS's and been cramp free. I do the stretch in both feet at the same time, about once every 15 minutes. Don't know for sure if it's a cause and effect relationship or just coincidence, but I tend to belive almost anything Dave Scott says, after all, he is THE MAN. When I do the stretchs, I try and hold them for 10-20 seconds.

2012-01-25 9:54 AM
in reply to: #4009312

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Subject: RE: Calves Cramping During the Swim?

Great suggestion on the stretching during the swim. I have done that once I cramp but I think, as some of you have pointed out, the key is doing it long before the cramps set in. I plan to try that along with more relaxed foot. Found this article that seems to agree with a lot of what you guys are saying.

http://www.swim-city.com/library.php3?id=119

 



2012-01-30 1:22 AM
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Subject: RE: Calves Cramping During the Swim?
I have the same issue. My first year I would cramp in every swim over a OLY, then last year I was on until the second half of the IM distance. I am one who is also not sure why in a race my calf's act different than they do in training. I swim in cold water to train leading into the summer and am in my wet suit. I would say for me it is the stress and pushing a little harder. Thanks for the advaice from you all on some techniques on how to stop them before they start. This in one area that bothers me and I need a lot of help in the swim. I have very bad anxiety in the swim. Thanks!!
2012-02-05 11:26 AM
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Subject: RE: Calves Cramping During the Swim?

62 degrees is cold water, the water was 61 degrees at IMAZ and I had a sleeveless wet suit to allow more flexibility for my shoulders but I was so cold both legs just totally cramped up at the two mile mark and I ran out of time since the last .4 miles seemed like a million miles with no legs. They said time was up just as I approached swim exit, bummer!

 

I have both a Weak Kick and Leg Cramp issues in long swim workouts or open water swims over one mile. I usually have such bad leg cramps at the swim exit, it is had to walk to transition for the first few steps. I have heard beyond taking electrolytes, Vitamin E helps. Also this season I am working with a trainer on leg strength and doing regular sets of leg presses with 30 lbs on each leg.

 

I thought more kick drills at Masters swimming might help and  it has gotten better but my legs still cramp up after around one mile in Open Water or more than one hour of heavy kick drills  at Maters swims.

 

I also know my ankle flexibility is an issue since I almost go nowhere with no fins and no arm movements in kick drills. I am going to try some ankle stretching drills at LA Fitness and see how that does this season.

2013-01-25 5:00 AM
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Subject: RE: Calves Cramping During the Swim?

G Shotts - Thank you so much for the advice on stretching your ankles and feet during the swim to help avoid cramps before they occur.

Not to be dramatic...but it has changed my life.  Before I was hobbled both physically and mentally by the cramps that would set in (and the knowledge that they were on their way) at many points in my long swims.  After following this advice, it doesn't happen anymore and I can press on with my longer swims confidently.

Thanks again.



Edited by jacoboldham 2013-01-25 5:04 AM
2013-01-25 7:30 AM
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Subject: RE: Calves Cramping During the Swim?

I would regularly get calf cramps right around the 3000yds mark in the pool and sink like a rock.  Took a good month of 3500+ yards workouts to get over it.  No idea what caused it other than fatigue.  One thing I tried to emphasis toward the end of my workout though was not pushing so hard on the wall at my turns.   

Also in almost every race I do that has a ladder exit, as soon as I step on the ladder I get a cramp. I have never gotten a cramp during the actual race swim part though so I guess what I am saying is "I have no idea".   

2013-02-04 9:46 PM
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Subject: RE: Calves Cramping During the Swim?
One issue I have found personally and with others is that they don't stretch well, at all, Let alone while swimming. It is not likely the wetsuit, the amount of swims done in open water, or the temp. Make sure you have thoroughly stretched before the race and are hydrated. A few salt tabs with water 30 minutes before the race will go a LONG way on the swim. Guaranteed.


2013-02-04 11:19 PM
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Subject: RE: Calves Cramping During the Swim?
g_shotts - 2012-01-25 1:09 PM

Nipper - 2012-01-24 8:21 AM I get this in very cold water. and I would consider 62 to be very cold water. What works for me is to flex my foot (toes toward knee) for a few strokes and the cramps go away. Sometimes I have to do this several times to get through it.

Dave Scott gave part of the athlete briefing at the 2010 Silverman race and talked about "charlie-horse" style calf cramps, which is what I've gotten in the past. Dave recommended "dorsi-flexing" your feet several times throughout the swim portion of the race to prevent calf cramping. This is stretching your foot by bringing your toes upward, toward your shin.....kind of the opposite of what most of us do with our toes while we're swimming. The extra drag does slow you down, but only for the few seconds it takes to do the stretch.

I've gotten leg cramps before on both IM and HIM distance swims and at the pool. Since I heard Dave give this advice, I've done these stretches during all my longer OWS's and been cramp free. I do the stretch in both feet at the same time, about once every 15 minutes. Don't know for sure if it's a cause and effect relationship or just coincidence, but I tend to belive almost anything Dave Scott says, after all, he is THE MAN. When I do the stretchs, I try and hold them for 10-20 seconds.

Oh I'm gonna try this in my OWS squad tomorrow - I do think it's something to do with race intensity.  Last week at OWS squad we did 50m races - about 90 of us in deep water, can't help but get swum over punched and kicked which in turn makes you kick hard in a panic - by the end had bad cramp both legs.

I will try this tomorrow see how I go!  I barely kick but doesn't seem to help.

2013-02-05 7:37 AM
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Subject: RE: Calves Cramping During the Swim?

I've never cramped during a swim. I do kickboard and calf flexing during every practice I also do tons of calf stretching every day.

When i wake up, before bed.. whenever I think of it, I flex my feet upward.  

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