General Discussion Triathlon Talk » When will I start listening to good advice? Rss Feed  
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2012-02-05 2:34 PM

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Subject: When will I start listening to good advice?

My last two 1/2 Marathons I PR'ed but on both I went out too fast at the start and faded at mile 9.

At Surf City today I started at 1:50 pace and it felt great until mile 9 when I just faded hard.

My question is this.  If I had stuck to my original plan at Surf City and went out at 1:52 pace how much of a difference would it have actually made at the finish if any?

Insight, thoughts?  Maybe I should have planned to start at an even slower pace?  



2012-02-05 3:01 PM
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Subject: RE: When will I start listening to good advice?

What was your finish time at Surf City?

2012-02-05 3:14 PM
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Subject: RE: When will I start listening to good advice?

I guess that would help.

1:53:43

2012-02-05 3:22 PM
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Royal(PITA)
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Subject: RE: When will I start listening to good advice?

Dude, that was smoking fast.  What was your goal time? 

My last half mary I set a goal of sub 2 hrs and missed it by about 3 min and change.  Like you it was around mile 9 or 10 that I knew that was all I had in the tank with screaming hamstings to feet. 

Sometimes it's the runner going out too hard, sometimes it's external conditions.  The race I reference I was told weather would normally be mid 40-50 degree for.  It wasn't .....it was a bit colder and it was on an island, I hadn't factored in the winds coming off the ocean. (not a local race for me)

2012-02-05 3:36 PM
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Subject: RE: When will I start listening to good advice?

Starving when I wrote this so my thoughts are really disjointed.  My goal was 1:52.  My previous PR last month at So Cal 1/2 was 1:54:42.  

I've been running somewhere between 20-25/30 miles a week.  All pretty easy, some hills here and there.  Usually around 9:30 pace for my training runs, ave HR 146 -ish.

2012-02-05 3:58 PM
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Subject: RE: When will I start listening to good advice?
Do you know what your splits were? Might help in figuring out if you're going too fast or should take the hurt more.


2012-02-05 4:02 PM
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Subject: RE: When will I start listening to good advice?

I was pretty much at 8:23 average splits all the way up to 8.  At 9 and 10 it dropped to about 8:50, 11-12 about 9:20, 13 8:54.

Also my HR stayed steady about 172 from mile 5-13 with a slight drop at mile 12.



Edited by Panda_Jack 2012-02-05 4:03 PM
2012-02-05 4:16 PM
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Subject: RE: When will I start listening to good advice?


Edited by bhc 2012-02-05 4:17 PM
2012-02-05 4:25 PM
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Subject: RE: When will I start listening to good advice?
make up for it at the Hollywood Half in April!
2012-02-05 5:47 PM
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Subject: RE: When will I start listening to good advice?

Many years ago I read this (in reference to marathons):

If you go out fast, as you inevitably will, you will finish slow.
If you go out slow, as you know you should, you will finish slower.

2012-02-05 6:11 PM
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Subject: RE: When will I start listening to good advice?
A 1:52 HM is a 8:33 m/m pace.  Looking at your logs you are rarely running that at that pace.  I'm wondering if that might have something to do with it.  I don't know myself, maybe some of the running veterans out there can chime in.  I like to at least have some miles each week at my HM pace.


2012-02-05 6:22 PM
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Subject: RE: When will I start listening to good advice?
Could definitely be a fitness endurance/pacing issue, but what about nutrition?  Maybe you're running out of fuel.
2012-02-05 11:25 PM
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Subject: RE: When will I start listening to good advice?

At 25 miles per week you may just not have enough miles in your legs to prepare you for a continuous 13.1 miles at race pace.  Doubtful it's nutrition or hydration as long as you are drinking some gatorade from the aid stations and it wasn't extremely hot.  Your pace was consistent for the majority of the race then started to slow at the end... that happens with a lot of people, even more so if your training is on the lower mileage side.

2012-02-06 12:41 AM
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Subject: RE: When will I start listening to good advice?
Congrats on the PR
2012-02-06 2:02 AM
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Subject: RE: When will I start listening to good advice?
I really like to easy into my hm pace and leave some for the last 5k (especially if I don't know the course). It is not a big deal to take off 10-15 seconds slower than your goal pace for the first 2-4 miles and then make it up later. Going out slow has always paid off for me in races longer than 10k. The last hm I did was a tune-up race for a marathon, so I went out at marathon pace for the first 9 and then started picking up the pace. The course got hilly, but I was pretty fresh, and as I was passing people, my pace kept picking up. I was able to finish strong and picked up a surprise PR. 
2012-02-06 8:28 AM
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Subject: RE: When will I start listening to good advice?
With the exception of the 5k, and maybe the 10k in some situations, negative splitting a race is almost always a good idea and will usually produce your optimal time. But you have to approach the calculation of those splits based on the data you've gathered from your training.

How did you pick 1:52 as your goal? What had your training indicated to you that this would be a reasonable goal?

If 1:52 was your goal, why did you suddenly think you could race a 1:50?

Without exception, the races where I ignore my race plan that was based on solid training data (and we all do it), I end up with a bad race.

How much would the pace have made a difference for YOU in THIS race? Hard to say. You came in not far off your goal, which tells me your 1:52 goal was probably spot on. My guess is you had a legitimate shot at nailing 1:52 had you gone out a bit slower ... maybe even at a 1:54 pace ... and then picked it up for the final 4 miles.

But it's just a guess ... I don't have a lot of information. 


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