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Pool times vs. OWS
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 2006-06-08 10:22 AM |
Master  2006  Portland, ME |  Subject: Pool times vs. OWSI'm about 3 weeks away from my first tri (Shipbuilders Oly) so I decided to swim a 1500 in the pool (my first continuous swim longer than 600!!!!). I would like to estimate my time for a 1500 OWS based on the following: 1. In the pool I generally glide from the T at the end of the lane to the wall. 2. I don't do flip turns. I touch the end, pull myself to the wall and push off just enough to get my legs far enough from the wall to kick. 3. I will be wearing a full wetsuit in the OWS. 4. assume the open water conditions are "pool like" (i.e. no waves or current) 5. I am a newbie swimmer (prior to April I never swam in a lap pool much less ever tried to swim across one). That being said, what estimated percentage faster should my OWS be? Thanks, Jeff |
| 2006-06-08 10:34 AM in reply to: #447417 |
Not a Coach 11473    Media, PA | Subject: RE: Pool times vs. OWS Impossible to say. OWS courses are nortoriously mis-measured. Will you swim at the same effort level in the race? How will you handle swimming with others around you? Will you swim a straight course? etc... |
| 2006-06-08 10:36 AM in reply to: #447433 |
Cycling Guru 15134 Fulton, MD | Subject: RE: Pool times vs. OWS Same kinds of questions I have, but I know there are way too many variables involved. Only way to find out is to get out there and swim in anger in a race and see what happens! |
| 2006-06-08 10:42 AM in reply to: #447437 |
Not a Coach 11473 Media, PA | Subject: RE: Pool times vs. OWS Daremo - 2006-06-08 10:36 AM Same kinds of questions I have, but I know there are way too many variables involved. Only way to find out is to get out there and swim in anger in a race and see what happens! I recommend YOU swim in peace. Save the anger for the bike & run. |
| 2006-06-08 10:44 AM in reply to: #447417 |
Elite Veteran 1817 Cedar Rapids, Iowa | Subject: RE: Pool times vs. OWS Sadly for me, I live in the midwest and get very little opportunity to practice in OW, so my pool times definitely do not translate to OW. I am much slower. It sucks. |
| 2006-06-08 10:45 AM in reply to: #447437 |
Elite 2915 New City, New York | Subject: RE: Pool times vs. OWS I agree w/ Johnny but here is my most recent actual numbers. In the pool I have difficulty maintining 1:45/100's. My last race 1:30/100 for 1000 yds. so for me about 10% faster in OW w/ a wetsuit in 60 degree water (so I had extra motivation to get out)  We'll see if it's the same on Sunday w/ warmer water. |
| 2006-06-08 11:01 AM in reply to: #447417 |
| Member 65 Apple Valley, MN | Subject: RE: Pool times vs. OWS I only have one indoor tri and one outdoor to compare: Indoor, 30 minutes, 25 yard pool: 1:25 / 100 yards Outdoor, 1/4 mile, with wetsuit: 1:29 / 100 yards |
| 2006-06-08 11:11 AM in reply to: #447433 |
Master 2006 Portland, ME | Subject: RE: Pool times vs. OWS Let's assume I wasn't in a race and that I would give the same effort, swimming alone, and there was a nice bright underwater line guiding my way. Essential I'm wondering how much time I lose turning and not wearing a wetsuit. |
| 2006-06-08 11:16 AM in reply to: #447417 |
| Member 65 Apple Valley, MN | Subject: RE: Pool times vs. OWS They say you'll go :10 faster per 100 with your wetsuit. But in my only OWS race, the confusion and bumping-into-other-people factor slowed me down a bit, and offset my wetsuit speed improvement, so my times were about equal. |
| 2006-06-08 11:17 AM in reply to: #447512 |
Not a Coach 11473 Media, PA | Subject: RE: Pool times vs. OWS Jackemy - 2006-06-08 11:11 AM Let's assume I wasn't in a race and that I would give the same effort, swimming alone, and there was a nice bright underwater line guiding my way. Essential I'm wondering how much time I lose turning and not wearing a wetsuit. In theory, you shouldn't lose time turning. You should gain time because of the wall push. The wetsuit will help but it depends how fast you are beforehand (it will help more if you have poor form). Don't expect to be faster in your OWS. If you are, be pleasantly surprised. |
| 2006-06-08 11:31 AM in reply to: #447417 |
Master 1557 Maine | Subject: RE: Pool times vs. OWS If Shipbuilders is anything like last year (which it is predicted to be) you will be much faster - we swim up the river, with a pretty good current. When I did it last summer I was doing 2:00 per 100 in the pool on a good day, and swam around 1:30/100 at the race. Again, it's hard to estimate the exact difference. Things that will make you faster in open water include the current, the extra buoyancy from the wetsuit, drafting, and not having to turn every 25 yards. Things that could make you slower include your familiarity/comfort with the wetsuit, and going out too hard and starting to panic cause you feel like you are being suffocated in the wetsuit (I made that mistake several times last year). If you have not done so, get in the open water ASAP and start getting used to the wetsuit. |
| 2006-06-08 11:32 AM in reply to: #447519 |
Expert 1023 Malvern, England | Subject: RE: Pool times vs. OWS Excluding the wetsuit factor I am assuming I will be slower in the open water because of all the variables out there. I know my time for a similar distance in a 50m pool is slower than a 25m pool which is because of the push off each end. However, they do say that wearing a wetsuit helps with buoyancy and therefore speed - I am lookin forward to seeing how it affects me in a few weeks time |
| 2006-06-08 3:01 PM in reply to: #447547 |
Master 2006 Portland, ME | Subject: RE: Pool times vs. OWS huskyboy - 2006-06-08 11:31 AM If Shipbuilders is anything like last year (which it is predicted to be) you will be much faster - we swim up the river, with a pretty good current. When I did it last summer I was doing 2:00 per 100 in the pool on a good day, and swam around 1:30/100 at the race. Again, it's hard to estimate the exact difference. Things that will make you faster in open water include the current, the extra buoyancy from the wetsuit, drafting, and not having to turn every 25 yards. Things that could make you slower include your familiarity/comfort with the wetsuit, and going out too hard and starting to panic cause you feel like you are being suffocated in the wetsuit (I made that mistake several times last year). If you have not done so, get in the open water ASAP and start getting used to the wetsuit. Heck, who needs open water, I can just slap the wetsuit on and swim down Route One with all the rain we had. I did know that the Kennebec has a pretty strong current in our favor which is why I decided to make the Shipbuilders my first tri instead of one of the late summer sprints. Good advice on getting out on the water, perhaps I'll take the wetsuit along to the Close to the Coast 10k on Saturday and go for a refershing dip in Casco Bay after the race. Ocean temp is a toasty 51 degrees right now!!! |
| 2006-06-08 3:06 PM in reply to: #447417 |
Master 2006 Portland, ME | Subject: RE: Pool times vs. OWS thanks to everyone that responded. Bottom line is that it appears that the only thing I might be able to out swim right now is driftwood. On the bright side, that leaves more people to blow by on the bike.  Edited by Jackemy 2006-06-08 3:07 PM |
| 2006-06-08 3:07 PM in reply to: #447417 |
| over a barrier | Subject: RE: Pool times vs. OWS your normally slower in open water, its very difficult to swim a straight line and with the extra drag you create trying to sight. However, the wetsuit will help overset some of that. In a pool, I was 3 secs faster with a wetsuit over 100 yds.... |
| 2006-06-08 3:38 PM in reply to: #447417 |
| Master 1534 | Subject: RE: Pool times vs. OWS Big factor ---> Comfort level in open water. |
| 2006-06-09 12:30 AM in reply to: #447417 |
| Veteran 138 Ames IA | Subject: RE: Pool times vs. OWS I second the comfort comment. I am slower in OW than in the pool. However, having said that each time I do an OW swim my times get faster as I get more comfortable with it. Gettign some open water swims in before the race could surely help out (allthough at 51 degrees you are braver than I) |
| 2006-06-09 5:13 AM in reply to: #447417 |
Expert 702 Manchester, NH | Subject: RE: Pool times vs. OWS I was recently disapointed to see that my new wetsuit (although I love it) didn't really improve my per 100 times in a recent OWS race. So many variables - it seems like a lot of folks say OWS times are slower, and the wetsuit only helps to get back to your pool times. That was my experience last week, anyway. |
| 2006-06-09 6:25 AM in reply to: #447512 |
Master 2099 Madison, WI | Subject: RE: Pool times vs. OWS You also have to take into account where the timing stops. For me, there was a 300 yard run after the OWS befoe the timing stopped for the "swim." But, unlike some others, I went slower in OW. I did a 400 indoor in 7:49 and my OWS 400 was a smidge over 10. That's a pretty big difference. So, perhaps it was measured wrong. I think that you also have to recognize that while the glide/turn/push is slowing you down, it's also keeping you from getting overtired. I really really recommend doing some open water swimming before your race to see if your fitness level is where you think it should be. |
| 2006-06-09 7:10 AM in reply to: #447417 |
Champion 19812 MA | Subject: RE: Pool times vs. OWS Good question. First most OWS are not measured accurately so it is hard to really know. My 100 time when doing a 1000 yd TT is 2:07/100 yds, my Oly swim last week I did 2:25/100 yds. I didn't push as much as I do in a TT but my goal for this first Oly was to feel comfortable in open water as earlier in the week I was a bit freaky about doing ows. My goal for the season is to get them times as close together so what I lose in bad sighting, I should gain back with my wetsuit. |
| 2006-06-09 7:24 AM in reply to: #448401 |
Master 2006 Portland, ME | Subject: RE: Pool times vs. OWS 5:13am? damn immyfish, you are and early riser!!! I am surprise to see that most people swim at the same pace or slower in open water as I would think that the mere fact that you have to turn around in a pool every 25 yards would slow your time down considerably. It sounds like I do need to get into the open water and it would be a big mistake to do my first OW wetsuit swim the day of the race. One thing that makes me real nervous about going is that I'll probably have to swim alone. Also I'm lucky enough to have a lap pool at my golf club which is five minutes from my house and office open from 6am to 10pm everyday and 95% of the time I have the entire pool to myself. So the incentive to brave the Maine lakes at this time of year is pretty low. Caution!!! Pool porn: http://www.thewoodlands.org/index.cfm?ID=87 |
| 2006-06-09 7:41 AM in reply to: #448444 |
Expert 1023 Malvern, England | Subject: RE: Pool times vs. OWS DON'T GO ALONE Just don't - basic safety - especially as it will be your first experience. Not worth the risk. At the very least have someone on the shore line watching you. |
| 2006-06-09 8:11 AM in reply to: #448444 |
Master 2099 Madison, WI | Subject: RE: Pool times vs. OWS Check out the local thread on here to see if you can recruit any others to join you. We set up an informal swim group that meets a couple times a week for OW swims. Or, check for a local triathlon club. You'll definitely feel more confident knowing that there are other people around you. That being said, if you have a wetsuit, and follow the shore line, it's pretty hard to get into too much trouble. |
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