BT Development 2012 Summer Olympics » Sports that don't need to be Olympic events: Rss Feed  
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2012-08-06 5:55 PM
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Subject: RE: Sports that don't need to be Olympic events:

Gee sorry tri, I was in no way trying to have a shot at you, or anyone else (sorry if it came came across that way).

 

Out of interest, baseball WAS in the olympics (as was softball), and on another thread, at least one person is suggesting football as an olympic sport.

 

I love the idea of a sport NOT being included if the olympic gold is not the pinnicle of that sport. Will never happen of course, but its a nice way of thinking about it in my opinion



2012-08-07 2:21 AM
in reply to: #4350031

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Subject: RE: Sports that don't need to be Olympic events:
alburyscott - 2012-08-07 6:55 AM

Gee sorry tri, I was in no way trying to have a shot at you, or anyone else (sorry if it came came across that way).

 

Out of interest, baseball WAS in the olympics (as was softball), and on another thread, at least one person is suggesting football as an olympic sport.

 

I love the idea of a sport NOT being included if the olympic gold is not the pinnicle of that sport. Will never happen of course, but its a nice way of thinking about it in my opinion

Oh no, I was genuinely delighted about being wrong (I am a TERRIBLE know-it-all) ... also I put a winkey-smiley after what I wrote, which means all is well.

I can see where if Olympics isn't the pinnacle of the sport might be a criteria for exclusion. However, I don't know that modern Olympic Games were ever meant to be that ... really more of an opportunity for goodwill and hearty competition, for countries to get together on the basis of sport.

Also, wherever the Olympics isn't the pinnacle, you're talking about a competition where there is an enormous amount of money involved (either directly or as a result of). And though most (but not all) Olympic sports have agreed that professionals may compete, in the interest of having the very best represented at the Games, that's just a whole 'nother can of worms.

2012-08-09 9:52 AM
in reply to: #4346566

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Subject: RE: Sports that don't need to be Olympic events:
As a life long equestrian I have to defend my sport a little too. Everybody thinks it looks easy, and if all someone ever does on a horse is get on and have a nice leisurely trail ride - sure that's easy. Just like anyone can get in a pool and splash around, or anyone can jog around a track. The horses do deserve medals as well, you're right (and it's why any olympic stallion gets the word "Olympic" stuck onto the front of their name in breeding journals). They are athletes too, in a major way. But it really is a team sport... the horse is only as good as it's rider and the rider is only as good as it's horse. That's why you see so many riders giving credit to their mounts when they win a medal. It's also the only sport where men and women compete as equals.

I do think the dressage is boring as hell, but there is a lot more to it than any non-rider would ever understand. My sport is jumping and to say it's difficult and complex is a major understatement. Fitness is definitely a part of it, but so much of it is skill that takes years and years to learn (although most of us never will). Here in the US equestrian sports are not very popular as a spectator event but it's pretty mainstream in Europe, especially the jumping and eventing. They get a lot more TV time and usually have packed stadiums at shows.
2012-08-09 10:58 AM
in reply to: #4347741

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Subject: RE: Sports that don't need to be Olympic events:
TriAya - 2012-08-05 12:30 PM

As for equestrian, there ain't no fat horse riders. You have to be in great shape. Period.

Now there are kinda tubby archers and shooters, but the main aspect of those sports, as well as of equestrian, is that you do have to have extreme physical SKILL to do it. Not necessarily physical exertion, but skill nevertheless.

As for types of arguments that have any merit at all, I can definitely see where the "subjective judgement" (scoring) one does. Unfortunately, that would mean axing way too many sports. But it is a good basis for argument.

Another one is the inclusion argument--that a sport should have some kind of popular base. How you would make that judgment is difficult, but it does argue against including niche sports that a couple or few countries consistently dominate.

On that token, I think it's a much more interesting and productive debate regarding which sports should be further INCLUDED in the Olympic program.

 

Thanks Yanti!  And its also why riders can keep competing till they are older, as long as they maintain strength and skill.  The horses that compete at that level, boy, they are STRONG and can very hard to control. I guarantee those riders have legs that can crack walnuts and guns for biceps!

2012-08-09 11:47 AM
in reply to: #4346566


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Subject: RE: Sports that don't need to be Olympic events:

Along the same lines as the speed-walking/running debate, the four different types of strokes in swimming seems weird to me. Shouldn't it be: "Who can swim this distance the fastest", not ""Who can swim this distance the fastest by limiting their motion to these specific movements"? If we're racing 100 meters, and you want to do breast-stroke, you go ahead.

By that rationale, we could have the 100-metre dash while running backwards, or the one-legged 100m, 200m, 400m, and team relay. I also don't see why so sports have some many similar events. Again, there are so many medals in swimming: 100, 200, and 400 in 4 strokes, 50m front-crawl, team events of different distances, etc. Why don't we give medals to volleyball players who play to 15, and another medal to those who play to 25, and another medal to those who play to 50, etc.? Tennis matches that are one set. Then, another competition that is 3 sets. Another for 5 sets. The players would, I'm sure, approach each match differently.

Pulling it back to triathlon - why don't they have different distances at the Olympics? The same person that is quickest at a sprint distance is probably not the same who is quickest at the Olympic, or HIM/IM distances. Why not have all those events? If you can have different lengths for running, biking, and swimming, why not different lengths of triathlon?

In the 1900 Olympic Games, they apparently had underwater swimming. That'd be cool. See who can swim the furthest under water by any means necessary. Your distance is marked when any part of your body breaks the surface of the water.

Other events that would be cool to see - obstacle courses, similar to the Ninja Warrior series. Rock climbing would be another - could have speed courses, as well as technical. Until 1920 they had "Tug-of-War" - how sweet would that be? Why not arm wrestling - they have other types.

I didn't know you were only allowed 3 players over the age of 23 in Olympic soccer. That's great - I wish they'd do something like that for other sports professionals play (ie. hockey, basketball, etc). I hate that you have some Olympians who struggle and sacrifice to pursue their passion, and train and work non-stop for years to acheive their dream of participating at the Olympics, and then you have other Olympians who are thrown together, seemingly at the last minute*, to represent their country in a sport they get paid millions of dollars to play. (*In that I mean they are not a national team that trains for years to reach the Olympics).

I wish each nation had it's national team of amateurs. I'm not detracting from the struggle and sacrifice, and amount of training, etc that those other athletes have made (ie. NBA player), but they didn't do that to compete at the Olympics. They did that to have a career that pays them very well...representing their country is just a bonus for being good at what they do.

I wonder what the other Olympian athletes think of the professionals who compete at the Oympics - I wonder if there is that same bond.

2012-08-09 1:23 PM
in reply to: #4349652

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Subject: RE: Sports that don't need to be Olympic events:
dozzman - 2012-08-06 2:54 PM
Dominion - 2012-08-06 1:59 PM
TriAya - 2012-08-05 5:57 PM

I really do hope this entire thread is in jest. It's the only way I can figure most of the comments.

Yes my response of badminton was mostly in jest.  Several people seem to be quite sensitive however in defending their "sports" on here.  I took the OP's tone to be playful and light, so i went with it. Everybody can calm down a little.

On a serious note, i caught Mike Greenberg on ESPN radio this morning discussing the same topic. According to him Tennis and Soccer should not be included based on the reasoning that any sport in which an Olympic Medal is not viewed as the apex of achievement within that sport should not be included.  Example, most tennis players would take a Wimbledon Championship over an Olympic gold and soccer players would take a World Cup title, etc.  Interesting viewpoint but not sure i agree with the premise.

Actually Soccer is different in the Olympics as it has an age limit of under 23 years, with only 3 players that can actually be older than 23. So many of the players competing in Soccer, won't be the same players representing their country in the World Cup.

Actually, the Olympics is a great opportunity to get those U23's big pressure experience so that in 3 years they can withstand it in the WC.  So while they may not have been the one that WAS competing in the WC last year, they very well MIGHT compete in the WC in 3 years.  And if they don't this is their one shot at greatness.



2012-08-09 1:59 PM
in reply to: #4346566

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Subject: RE: Sports that don't need to be Olympic events:

"Halo- I wonder what the other Olympian athletes think of the professionals who compete at the Oympics - I wonder if there is that same bond."

Well, Lebron, Kobe, and Chris Paul were sure engaged in Missy Franklin's last Swimming Finals.  They were cheering like they were her brothers. 

The whole team tweeted pictures of their trip to watch T&F and standing in the blocks on the 100 M line.  I think the NBA guys really get into all the other sports. 

I'd like to see a U23 rule for Basketball, but we'd kill it.  Maybe USA Basketball should make it a reward for the team that wins the final four to play in the Olympics.  The sponsors would never allow that.

Dressage is boring as hell but interesting when you consider that horse-mounted warriors have been doing it since the Roman Empire so they could train their horse to respond to slight foot movements while they were busy swinging a sword.  Maybe throw some people with nerf swords and spears into the competition and then we'll see how good a horse obeys...

Sports that don't belong in the olympics...Aside from the Hunger Games, I think the Olympics should include any and every sport where more than 16 countries say they'll sponsor their athletes for 2 olympiads.  I'm all in favor of a hoge-poge of sports that we'd never see.

 



Edited by GomesBolt 2012-08-09 2:00 PM
2012-08-09 2:39 PM
in reply to: #4355496


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Subject: RE: Sports that don't need to be Olympic events:

I was thinking more in the other direction. No doubt the NBA'ers are having a blast. I wonder what the athletes who make $20,000 a year, training early in the mornings and late into the evenings, not taking any winnings so they can stay an amateur and qualify for the Olympics, thinks of an NBA'er being named to the team a month before the Olympics start, walking away with a gold medal.

2012-08-09 5:33 PM
in reply to: #4346566

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Subject: RE: Sports that don't need to be Olympic events:
I thought there were no more requirements to remain amateurs. Am I wrong?
2012-08-09 7:13 PM
in reply to: #4346742

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Subject: RE: Sports that don't need to be Olympic events:

jmk-brooklyn - 2012-08-04 8:06 AM Re:softball, as I understand it, they IOC dropped baseball because the MLB players union said that they wouldn't agree to subject themselves to Olympic-level drug testing, meaning that no major league players would be participating in the Olympics. Once the decision to drop baseball was made, the IOC decided to drop softball as well, since it was seen as essentially the same sport.

Its actually WAY more complicated and very politcal. I learned this when I was at the US olympic training center as a team doc

1-Only the US and Australia really have teams that are competitive in SB and the rest of the countries and the IOC didnt' like that
2-they can only have X number of athletes at any one olympiad.  If you have a lot of team sports that takes up a LOT of athletes to give out only 3 medals.  If you drop a team sport which to field a competitve pool of ten tems with say 20 athletes thats 200 athetes for 3 medals. If you DROP that sport in favor of some individual sport.....insert some form of martial arts.....you can have the same number of athletes and give away a lot more medals.

2012-08-09 7:17 PM
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Subject: RE: Sports that don't need to be Olympic events:
Im not against sports like handball, field hockey, and speed walking entirely. Im against the amount of coverage some of these sports recieve, why the hell did i watch Latvia play Serbia in handball while the 1 and only male american weight lifter was competing? Do any of you know his name? Why do I see every game of water polo men and womens but we only see 10 minutes total of most field sports like shot put and discus.


2012-08-09 7:25 PM
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Subject: RE: Sports that don't need to be Olympic events:

mkarr0110 - 2012-08-09 7:17 PM Im not against sports like handball, field hockey, and speed walking entirely. Im against the amount of coverage some of these sports recieve, why the hell did i watch Latvia play Serbia in handball while the 1 and only male american weight lifter was competing? Do any of you know his name? Why do I see every game of water polo men and womens but we only see 10 minutes total of most field sports like shot put and discus.

One of the mysteries of the universe...or NBC......If I have to watch one more minute of beach volleyball I will vomit.  And this has nothing to do with what should or should not be an olympic sport.  I have never seen team handball before this olympiad and I have to say it looks freaking COOL and WHY DO WE NOT PLAY THIS IN THE US?  All you need is a gym some nets and a ball.  Looks low cost not too hard to learn ,fast and fun. As  a former collegite field hockey player I am ever so happy to get to see olympic field hockey this year.  I could give a rats about watching USA basketball.  Does anyone seriously think they will loose?  Do I really want to see blow out after blow out?  nope

2012-08-09 8:49 PM
in reply to: #4346566

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Subject: RE: Sports that don't need to be Olympic events:

It's hard to put into words... There are many sports enjoyed and played by many. They are fun, and exciting and offer something to the player. Some people seem to take some folks thinking "their" sport should not be in the Olympics as "it should not be a sport".

Fine if it is a great sport... but why should it be in the Olympics?

Everyone will have a different opinion... and as such we have 1000 events and some think there should be 2000.

Personally, I would be OK with NO team sports. Seriously. Individuals, and if we must, we could do relay teams, but that's it. I love watching Olympians with only themselves to rely on. It all comes down to them. Victory or failure.

I would be good with no sports that rely on "something" to do the task. Archery, shooting, bobsled. Totally cool sports, high high level of skill, but it should be most dependent on the athlete doing athletic stuff. Horse back riding... well it needs a horse... ton of skill, don't take it personally. It should not be in the Olympics.

Synchronized anything. Seriously.. if you are a diver, and you are competing to do a dive, and the medal depends on how close you did it to your partner... it should not be in the Olympics. Sorry. I don't care if your goal in life is to be exactly like the person next to you. Tons of skill, high level of dedication. Lots of timing and team work... but ya, no.

Anything that requires a judge... well actually, that one is really tough. All gymnasts can perform moves... but then you have to judge how well they did it to find a winner. And gymnastics has all the other stuff I like. So unfortunately, we have to have judges... but anything artistic... no. I love the ballet. I love plays. If I want something artistic, I'll go to a show... but something that needs judges, and then they are judging artistic merit... getting into some real gray areas.

What does that leave.. athletes, competing against other athletes, doing athletics stuff... that requires athleticism. That would be a good start.

2012-08-09 9:57 PM
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Subject: RE: Sports that don't need to be Olympic events:
Socks - 2012-08-09 7:25 PM

mkarr0110 - 2012-08-09 7:17 PM Im not against sports like handball, field hockey, and speed walking entirely. Im against the amount of coverage some of these sports recieve, why the hell did i watch Latvia play Serbia in handball while the 1 and only male american weight lifter was competing? Do any of you know his name? Why do I see every game of water polo men and womens but we only see 10 minutes total of most field sports like shot put and discus.

One of the mysteries of the universe...or NBC......If I have to watch one more minute of beach volleyball I will vomit.  And this has nothing to do with what should or should not be an olympic sport.  I have never seen team handball before this olympiad and I have to say it looks freaking COOL and WHY DO WE NOT PLAY THIS IN THE US?  All you need is a gym some nets and a ball.  Looks low cost not too hard to learn ,fast and fun. As  a former collegite field hockey player I am ever so happy to get to see olympic field hockey this year.  I could give a rats about watching USA basketball.  Does anyone seriously think they will loose?  Do I really want to see blow out after blow out?  nope



NBC seems to be of the opinion that the American viewing public only wants to watch stuff where the US is guaranteed a victory, unless it involves Usain Bolt or hot chicks in small outfits.
2012-08-09 11:28 PM
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Subject: RE: Sports that don't need to be Olympic events:

I'm going to go with table tennis.

I don't have a particular problem with the sport, but there just isnt the competitive balance. If China was allowed to send 3 competitors, they would have swept the medals. It isn't even close.

2012-08-11 9:50 PM
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Subject: RE: Sports that don't need to be Olympic events:
uclamatt2007 - 2012-08-09 11:28 PM

I'm going to go with table tennis.

I don't have a particular problem with the sport, but there just isnt the competitive balance. If China was allowed to send 3 competitors, they would have swept the medals. It isn't even close.

By that logic, basketball would have to go too, no?



2012-08-12 12:22 AM
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Subject: RE: Sports that don't need to be Olympic events:
lamb_y2003 - 2012-08-11 8:50 PM
uclamatt2007 - 2012-08-09 11:28 PM

I'm going to go with table tennis.

I don't have a particular problem with the sport, but there just isnt the competitive balance. If China was allowed to send 3 competitors, they would have swept the medals. It isn't even close.

By that logic, basketball would have to go too, no?

That's cool.

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