General Discussion Triathlon Talk » Advancing my swim Rss Feed  
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2013-03-21 11:43 AM

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Subject: Advancing my swim

I have been doing Sprints for years however, I am one of those - "I'll muddle through the swim and make up on the bike" guys.  Now I am trying to get me swimming better and have been able to get to the pool once a week.  Right now I am doing the following:

150m warm up

100m x N intervals at 2:30 (n started at 5 and is now 8)

150m cool down.

Do i now keep increasing N, start increasing the length of the intervals?  Shorten the time of the interval?  Lengthen the warm-up or cool down?

My goal for this year is the sprint (1000m OWS) I've done for years and an Olympic (which I have never done before) and hope to do a HIM next year.

Keep in mind that my schedule will not really allow 2 pool days.  Feel free to look at my training logs.  Thanks in advance.

 



2013-03-21 11:51 AM
in reply to: #4668970

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Subject: RE: Advancing my swim

I would increase N to 10-15 (so your main set is as long as your race distances), then look to shorten your send time (hopefully speeding up some in the process). 

It is going to be difficult to make substantial progress by only swimming 1x per week, though.  Ideally, you would want to be able to take a few months and swim at least 3x and work on a number of different things with your swim (including some coaching, if feasible).  Perhaps something to consider for the off-season before you look to do the HIM if it is not practical for you to do now.

2013-03-21 12:05 PM
in reply to: #4668970


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Subject: RE: Advancing my swim
Originally I was just doing 1 (45 min) swim session a week then realised that It wasn't enough. I am now doing 3 x 35min swim sessions a week before work and my swimming is getting better by the week.
Can you not sacrifice another part of your training to fit in another swim, sounds like your biking e.g. Is strong.
2013-03-21 12:10 PM
in reply to: #4668991

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Subject: RE: Advancing my swim
I agree with the above that increasing the frequency of your swimming is likely to produce the best results.  However, if that isn't possible then Johnny's advice is good.
2013-03-21 5:20 PM
in reply to: #4668970

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Subject: RE: Advancing my swim

1st: I can't stress enough how important it is to get  a coach to help you improve technique, in particular if you're BOP that's where you can find the biggest improvements.

That said, every workout should have a purpose. Discarding technique, you can work on endurance, strength, speed and overall fitness. You should work on these over a period, not just one workout. On the other hand, it's not fun to just repeat the same workout every week.

For endurance you should do longer intervals, for speed shorter intervals. You can alternate, say one week do 8x100, next week 4x200, then 10x100, then 5x200, etc.

Also, do some speed work for variation, say every 4 weeks, for example:

2x (25 - 50 - 75 - 100 - 75 - 50 - 25 10sec rest between each) 30sec rest

where you go max on the 25, hard on the 50, normal-hard on the 75 and easy-normal on the 100.

Or, you can do these as 4 sets or 4 repetitions of a set with one of each:

4x25 MAX/100%

4x50 Hard/95%

4x75 Hard/90%

4x100 Normal/80% <- no, not easy!

The time for each interval should leave you with 10-15sec rest, not more.

BR, Erik

2013-03-21 6:02 PM
in reply to: #4669566

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Subject: RE: Advancing my swim
erik.norgaard - 2013-03-21 6:20 PM

1st: I can't stress enough how important it is to get  a coach to help you improve technique, in particular if you're BOP that's where you can find the biggest improvements.

That said, every workout should have a purpose. Discarding technique, you can work on endurance, strength, speed and overall fitness. You should work on these over a period, not just one workout. On the other hand, it's not fun to just repeat the same workout every week.

For endurance you should do longer intervals, for speed shorter intervals. You can alternate, say one week do 8x100, next week 4x200, then 10x100, then 5x200, etc.

Also, do some speed work for variation, say every 4 weeks, for example:

2x (25 - 50 - 75 - 100 - 75 - 50 - 25 10sec rest between each) 30sec rest

where you go max on the 25, hard on the 50, normal-hard on the 75 and easy-normal on the 100.

Or, you can do these as 4 sets or 4 repetitions of a set with one of each:

4x25 MAX/100%

4x50 Hard/95%

4x75 Hard/90%

4x100 Normal/80%

The time for each interval should leave you with 10-15sec rest, not more.

BR, Erik

Erik.  Just wanted to take a moment to thank you for your posts.  I always learn good stuff from you.  (Although this one makes me feel like a complete slacker.....I need to pick up the effort some)



2013-03-21 6:44 PM
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Subject: RE: Advancing my swim
erik.norgaard - 2013-03-22 12:20 AM

You can alternate, say one week do 8x100, next week 4x200, then 10x100, then 5x200, etc.

Also, do some speed work for variation, say every 4 weeks

Maybe I should clarify what's the point of above: 

You need to build up both total distance and the distance you can go without rest. So, first up the total distance with more intervals, then next maintain the same total distance doing fewer but longer intervals. When you get to 1200 total you may try 4x300 etc.

Regardless of the length of the interval, rest should be the same, about 10-15sec. As you get faster, shorten the interval time: If you're leaving @2:30 now, then when you can consistently hold more than 15 sec rest it's time to try 2:25.

As you do longer workouts it's easy to forget about speed, but you need that in particular if you only have limited time at each workout, and then speed workouts are fun Smile If the main set of your last long workout is 1000, then you can do a speed workout with a main set of 800.

And when you do max/100% I mean, as fast as you possibly can, and then some moreWink, forget about the interval coming next. 



Edited by erik.norgaard 2013-03-21 6:51 PM
2013-03-21 8:54 PM
in reply to: #4668970


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Subject: RE: Advancing my swim
If you can only get to the pool once a week, you need to reconsider what your doing.  Your a risk to yourself and others in the water when you race with little swim fitness.  There is nothing wrong with duathlons, running and bike races.
2013-03-22 4:22 AM
in reply to: #4668970

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Subject: RE: Advancing my swim
From a confidence point of view, I like to know that I can swim twice the distance of my race without resting. If your race is 1000m, that means doing 2000m. For me, that means I have nothing to fear on race day. When I get out, I'm going to feel like I have lots of energy left. Sounds like you have plenty of time to build up to this if the thought appeals to you as Erik has described above.
2013-03-22 5:21 AM
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Subject: RE: Advancing my swim
To me it seems like you are struggling with the swim yet I cannot find any drill set in your workout! Incorporate some drills and you will increase the distance you are able to swim much more comfortably ( plus other benefits like more energy left for the bike and the run) though you said it is not feasible I strongly encourage you to find one additional day to swim, even just 20min will help! Also while increasing your distance, add it in form of 50m intervals first (easier to focus on form) then as erik suggested make them 100m/ 300m intervals and so on.
2013-03-22 8:17 AM
in reply to: #4668970

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Subject: RE: Advancing my swim

I guess I will have to figure a way to get to pool another day because I am definitely not giving up!

Thanks to everyone for the advice.  That is why I love this site.



2013-03-22 3:59 PM
in reply to: #4669650

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Subject: RE: Advancing my swim
erik.norgaard - 2013-03-21 5:44 PM

Maybe I should clarify what's the point of above: 

You need to build up both total distance and the distance you can go without rest.  



Just wanted to say I really like this phrasing.
2013-05-08 7:48 PM
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Subject: RE: Advancing my swim

Just wanted to update in case other newbies were interested:

I still can only get to the pool once a week, but I have been able to increase my distance to 1500 meters non-stop - but slow...last time was 42:15.  I will say that when I am done, I am not tired or even winded, but always felt like I couldn't swim faster - I was locked into that pace.

So this week I took Erik's advice and did the first interval set he suggested

300m warm-up

25-50-75-100-75-50-25 x 2 sets

300 m cool-down

Did it all (1400m) in 39:15 the first time - and that includes the breaks.  Thanks for the advice Erik.  I look forward to improving even more.  Definitely winded and muscle fatigue now, so I know its working.

Signed up for an Olympic last night too.

2013-05-08 8:33 PM
in reply to: #4668970

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Subject: RE: Advancing my swim

I saw big improvements with swimming 4+ times a week.  Even if its only 30 mins it made a difference.  I actually saw more improvement with less overall time but more frequency.  Ideally, you need to be swimming at least 3hrs+ to see big improvements. But even if you get in the pool two times a week you will be better off.  I would focus on swimming hard has possible to make most of your time.  Quick WU then right into your Main set.

2013-05-08 11:02 PM
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Subject: RE: Advancing my swim
Erik's advice is spot on.  There's a saying "to swim fast, you have to swim fast".  It's  true.  Good Luck!
2013-05-09 2:38 AM
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Subject: RE: Advancing my swim
Great to see you're improving, keep it up!


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