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I can't decide on bikes, advice please. (Page 2)
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 2014-01-28 4:41 PM in reply to: ptri1 |
Extreme Veteran  5722   |  Subject: RE: I can't decide on bikes, advice please.Originally posted by ptri1 My vote would be for the NEW P2 assuming you can get the dealer to discount it. i also have a problem paying MSRP for anything. the advantages i see on the new frame is: warranty (not to be undervalued) ability to upgrade to electronic gears easily (when the oem parts wear out) getting power meter cranks to replace the oem ones newest frame design (old P2, even though it is nice, has been around a LONG TIME) relationship with the local dealer I also agree that 1700-1800 for the old P2 sounds about right. cheers I agree with this all above I have a 2009 DA P2 and would be very happy to get 1700 for it. |
| 2014-01-28 6:09 PM in reply to: ptri1 |
Veteran 740  The Woodlands, TX | Subject: RE: I can't decide on bikes, advice please. If you have some time, I'd recommend "watching" some used P2's listed on e-bay and see what they really sell for. To get a feel for what this bike is worth, you'd have to factor in components, shipping, taxes........but having an e-bay baseline to establish value for used P-2s is a pretty good starting point. The other thing to consider when comparing to e-bay is you know the LBS guys have looked it over and not seen any obvious issues. That makes it a pretty safe bet that the bike is sound. |
| 2014-01-28 7:22 PM in reply to: g_shotts |
| 87 | Subject: RE: I can't decide on bikes, advice please. Originally posted by g_shotts If you have some time, I'd recommend "watching" some used P2's listed on e-bay and see what they really sell for. To get a feel for what this bike is worth, you'd have to factor in components, shipping, taxes........but having an e-bay baseline to establish value for used P-2s is a pretty good starting point. The other thing to consider when comparing to e-bay is you know the LBS guys have looked it over and not seen any obvious issues. That makes it a pretty safe bet that the bike is sound. That's a good point. I'm on eBay right now actually looking at them. I'll see what the completed ones are going for and I'll post the results. |
| 2014-01-28 7:34 PM in reply to: 0 |
Master 3205  ann arbor, michigan | Subject: RE: I can't decide on bikes, advice please. Originally posted by metafizx I'd say the reason the used P2 price is firm at $2200 is because the guy shelled out a lot of dough for the Zipp cockpit, and DA 7900 components. Probably came stock with Ultegra. The base bike is probably worth $1200 or so, perhaps another $300 for the DA components, and maybe $300 for the Zipp add-on. So I'd price it at $1800, maybe $1700. Then I'd say it's a good deal. Spot on. A four year old P2 isn't worth $2,200, no matter how nice. Edited by wannabefaster 2014-01-28 7:35 PM |
| 2014-01-28 8:03 PM in reply to: wannabefaster |
| 87 | Subject: RE: I can't decide on bikes, advice please. An unused one (stock) 2010 sold for $1600 A brand new 2012 sold for $1900 A used 2010 with carbon wheels sold for $1850 A used 2013 full ultegra sold for $1900 and a few used ones sold for maybe $1500 |
| 2014-01-28 10:36 PM in reply to: ErikTaylor |
Champion 19812 MA | Subject: RE: I can't decide on bikes, advice please. Originally posted by ErikTaylor An unused one (stock) 2010 sold for $1600 A brand new 2012 sold for $1900 A used 2010 with carbon wheels sold for $1850 A used 2013 full ultegra sold for $1900 and a few used ones sold for maybe $1500 I have gotten folks to drop prices on a big ticket item when I showed him what things were actually selling for on Ebay. It is worth a shot. |
| 2014-01-29 9:10 AM in reply to: ptri1 |
Pro 6582 Melbourne FL Gold member | Subject: RE: I can't decide on bikes, advice please. $2800 for 105 & lower drivetrain and low-end base & aerobars, no thanks! Great frame though. IMHO, I would have to have a solid discount to get the new P2 because there would be $ sinked into it. Many years ago (2006) I bought my 1st tri-bike when the end of year closeouts were happening. I bought the most bike I could and ended up with a Felt S22, sure it was Al frame with some carbon (seat stays, fork, seatpost) but it had solid components (DA drivetrain, Vision ally base bar carbon aerobars, etc). Had the $ left over to get aero helmet, tri-shoes, pedals, wireless speedo, etc., I was ready to roll well under budget for a brand new. The old style frame sure wasn't holding me back any with overall top 10% bike in the last couple of local sprint races. I just built up a 2013 Felt B12 frame (found on eBay) with full 11 spd Ultegra drivetrain, Tririg front brake, 11 spd rear hub & redish for $700 less than a new 2014 B12 11 spd Ultegra. LBS was more than willing to work with me on the assembly & fitting. My advise, offer lower on the used P2 and wait. You can always do your 1st tri on the RB with aerobars and wait for a bike deal to land in front of you later. |
| 2014-01-29 9:18 AM in reply to: Donto |
| 87 | Subject: RE: I can't decide on bikes, advice please. Donto a part of me feels this way. It'll have everything I'd do to a bike, and then pedals, computer, sonic wing bottle cages, etc. Then the 800 extra I was going to spend to get the base P2 I could spend on a helmet, wheels (although I already have some) and whatever else I need. However, if the new frame is that much better, than I'll pony up the dough. |
| 2014-01-29 9:19 AM in reply to: KathyG |
| 87 | Subject: RE: I can't decide on bikes, advice please. Originally posted by KathyG Originally posted by ErikTaylor An unused one (stock) 2010 sold for $1600 A brand new 2012 sold for $1900 A used 2010 with carbon wheels sold for $1850 A used 2013 full ultegra sold for $1900 and a few used ones sold for maybe $1500 I have gotten folks to drop prices on a big ticket item when I showed him what things were actually selling for on Ebay. It is worth a shot. I couldn't agree with you more Kathy. Thanks for the idea! |
| 2014-01-29 10:11 PM in reply to: #4939490 |
| Member 102 Indiana | Subject: RE: I can't decide on bikes, advice please. If the cockpit is the alumina clip set up with the Vila base bar then it is extremely flexible for fit purposes. If it's not the alumina clip the the flexibility is much more limited. FYI the fit parameters of the 2014 p2 are significantly different than the older model. The new one is suppose to be much more flexible but also a bit more tricky for those who really fit long bikes. There is a great review/write up on slowtwitch about the new bike and it's fit vs the old. |
| 2014-01-30 9:48 AM in reply to: bet |
| 87 | Subject: RE: I can't decide on bikes, advice please. Bet, I'm not sure if you're referring to the old P2 or the new one. The new P2 comes with the Profile Designs bar and extensions and the old one comes with the full carbon Zipp bar and extensions! |
| 2014-01-30 9:52 AM in reply to: bet |
| 87 | Subject: RE: I can't decide on bikes, advice please. I'm also tempted to email him this thread so he can see that I'm truly not making up that his bike shouldn't be priced that high. Especially since the bike shop are selling last years P2 for $2,000 brand new. |
| 2014-01-30 10:09 AM in reply to: wannabefaster |
Champion 7036 Sarasota, FL | Subject: RE: I can't decide on bikes, advice please. Originally posted by wannabefaster Originally posted by metafizx I'd say the reason the used P2 price is firm at $2200 is because the guy shelled out a lot of dough for the Zipp cockpit, and DA 7900 components. Probably came stock with Ultegra. The base bike is probably worth $1200 or so, perhaps another $300 for the DA components, and maybe $300 for the Zipp add-on. So I'd price it at $1800, maybe $1700. Then I'd say it's a good deal. Spot on. A four year old P2 isn't worth $2,200, no matter how nice. x2.
Mark |
| 2014-01-30 10:27 AM in reply to: 0 |
Pro 15655 | Subject: RE: I can't decide on bikes, advice please. I bought my son's 2010 P2 with Ultegra and Adamo saddle and X-lab wing for 1800.00 in 2011. I sold the saddle and x-lab for 100.00 each. That being said.....it looks like a nice, well kept bike with some very nice components......it's worth what you will pay for it. You would have zero problem selling the seat and x-lab and even the pedals of you like another brand. That 2010 is a nice bike, component wise....offer what you are comfortable with and stand firm. Keep in mind....once you take possession of that new bike it won't be worth much more than the used bike you are looking at...... just saying. Edited by Left Brain 2014-01-30 10:28 AM |
| 2014-01-30 10:31 AM in reply to: Left Brain |
| 87 | Subject: RE: I can't decide on bikes, advice please. Originally posted by Left Brain I bought my son's 2010 P2 with Ultegra and Adamo saddle and X-lab wing for 1800.00 in 2011. I sold the saddle and x-lab for 100.00 each. That being said.....it looks like a nice, well kept bike with some very nice components......it's worth what you will pay for it. You would have zero problem selling the seat and x-lab and even the pedals of you like another brand. That 2010 is a nice bike, component wise....offer what you are comfortable with and stand firm. Keep in mind....once you take possession of that new bike it won't be worth much more than the used bike you are looking at...... just saying. Brain that's where I'm hesitant too. It's like my car. As soon as I drove it off I immediately lost value of the car. Ugh I can't decide. I'm going to the shop today to ride both to see if I truly notice a difference between the 2 bikes. The shop has both the old and new P2's! |
| 2014-01-30 10:34 AM in reply to: ErikTaylor |
Pro 15655 | Subject: RE: I can't decide on bikes, advice please. Originally posted by ErikTaylor Originally posted by Left Brain Brain that's where I'm hesitant too. It's like my car. As soon as I drove it off I immediately lost value of the car. Ugh I can't decide. I'm going to the shop today to ride both to see if I truly notice a difference between the 2 bikes. The shop has both the old and new P2's! I bought my son's 2010 P2 with Ultegra and Adamo saddle and X-lab wing for 1800.00 in 2011. I sold the saddle and x-lab for 100.00 each. That being said.....it looks like a nice, well kept bike with some very nice components......it's worth what you will pay for it. You would have zero problem selling the seat and x-lab and even the pedals of you like another brand. That 2010 is a nice bike, component wise....offer what you are comfortable with and stand firm. Keep in mind....once you take possession of that new bike it won't be worth much more than the used bike you are looking at...... just saying. I wouldn't let warranty play into it......those bike don't break unless you break them, and then warranty probably won't cover it anyway. It's not a car, there really isn't much that go wrong with a bike. You won't be out anything by making an offer on the 2010. |
| 2014-01-30 10:50 AM in reply to: Left Brain |
| 87 | Subject: RE: I can't decide on bikes, advice please. Yea I'm going to send him an email. I'm working up used prices on eBay now. |
| 2014-01-30 11:11 AM in reply to: ErikTaylor |
Member 1748 Exton, PA | Subject: RE: I can't decide on bikes, advice please. Just remember that if this guy is asking $2200 and won't accept less then $2000. there are plenty out there that may be asking $1800- $2000 that will accept $1400-$1500. |
| 2014-01-30 11:12 AM in reply to: ErikTaylor |
| 87 | Subject: RE: I can't decide on bikes, advice please. This is what I wrote and I think it was nice but firm as well. Hey ____, I'm going to text you here in a minute to read this email I'm writing because it's a lot easier than texting all of this. I've been doing tons of research on the bike, the components, etc. I've also posted a thread online to see what other triathletes thought of the deal and they all have said I'm over paying by quite a bit, which left me curious to do my own research. ____ says that his shop is selling brand new 2013 P2's for $2,000 to blow them out the door since the very new P2 just came into the stores as of yesterday. The brand new P2's with the new frame are selling for $2,800. He wants me to come up and test ride both bikes to see which I like better, but the bottom line is it comes down to budget. Please understand I'm a broke college student with a part time job trying to get into Tri's. I know it doesn't matter to you as you have the goods, but I'm sure we've all been there. So, with that said, I went to eBay to see what older P2's are selling for. If you go to the completed listings (in other words what they sold for) then you should be able to pull these up: An unused one (stock) 2010 with Ultegra sold for $1600 A brand new 2012 sold for $1900 A used 2010 with carbon wheels sold for $1850 A used 2013 full ultegra sold for $1900 and a few used ones sold for maybe $1500 Then I broke it down my components. These numbers are an average of sold components. So here are the numbers as follows: DA 7900- $875 Average Zipp- $165 Average ISM- $115 Average Sonic Wing- $70 Average So that equates to $1,226. That means that the frame (based on asking) is at $1,000 which I think is a little high. The other triathletes say I should offer between $1,500-$1,600 since it is a 4 year old bike and the fact that last years model brand new are $2,000 at the store. With the bike being ridden 500-1000 miles I think I should pay less than new, especially with it being an older frame. I do understand you have a bunch of cash in the components, but as things get older they depreciate as I'm sure I don't have to tell you that. I'm not going to offer what I'm being told to offer because that's a considerable difference from your asking. If you could accept $1,800 for the bike that would make me feel better, and it's close to your asking price and give you a little extra cash instead of a bike sitting around not being used. Please let me know what you think. I hope I'm not offending as that is certainly NOT my intentions. |
| 2014-01-30 11:19 AM in reply to: 0 |
Pro 6582 Melbourne FL Gold member | Subject: RE: I can't decide on bikes, advice please. Originally posted by ErikTaylor Yea I'm going to send him an email. I'm working up used prices on eBay now. Add for another reference here's a loaded 2012 P2 with crank based Powermeter for $3k (with stock wheels). If I were willing to spend $2800 and this bike would fit me I'd go with this one (with some negotiation) as the PM is something I really want right now.Updated the link... Edited by Donto 2014-01-30 11:22 AM |
| 2014-01-30 11:20 AM in reply to: Donto |
| 87 | Subject: RE: I can't decide on bikes, advice please. Thank you. I'll be sure to include that! |
| 2014-01-30 3:56 PM in reply to: ErikTaylor |
| 87 | Subject: RE: I can't decide on bikes, advice please. We confirmed he received my offer and he's thinking about it. Thanks a lot for learning me on used bike value. I know he wasn't purposefully trying to take me to the cleaners, but just recouping his investment, which is understandable. With that said I'm still heading up to the LBS today to ride both. I'll post my impressions on the new one. |
| 2014-01-30 6:44 PM in reply to: 0 |
| 87 | Subject: RE: I can't decide on bikes, advice please. Well I rode the New P2... it's awesome! However, I road the "classic" P2 and it's awesome too. I didn't notice much of a difference. However I'm sure over 100 miles I'd save some time with the new P2. The LBS said they would sell it for $2,700 and every $400 I spend I get $25 back. So in reality it would cost me $2,700 OTD. Plus I'd save $75 on fitting so it would be $2,875 fit OTD. So the differences would be (granted the seller accepted my offer): Used P2- $2,050 OTD Fit New P2- $2,875 OTD Fit However with the new P2 I still wouldn't have the necessities such as: Pedals, Hydration, Storage, ISM saddle which I will need (noticed a ton of pressure in my den of desire area, which would be another $250 or so just to ride. So in reality it'll cost over $1,000 extra for the P2 Edited by ErikTaylor 2014-01-30 6:51 PM |
| 2014-01-30 7:01 PM in reply to: 0 |
Pro 15655 | Subject: RE: I can't decide on bikes, advice please. Originally posted by ErikTaylor Well I rode the New P2... it's awesome! However, I road the "classic" P2 and it's awesome too. I didn't notice much of a difference. However I'm sure over 100 miles I'd save some time with the new P2. The LBS said they would sell it for $2,700 and every $400 I spend I get $25 back. So in reality it would cost me $2,700 OTD. Plus I'd save $75 on fitting so it would be $2,875 fit OTD. So the differences would be (granted the seller accepted my offer): Used P2- $2,050 OTD Fit New P2- $2,875 OTD Fit However with the new P2 I still wouldn't have the necessities such as: Pedals, Hydration, Storage, ISM saddle which I will need (noticed a ton of pressure in my den of desire area, which would be another $250 or so just to ride. So in reality it'll cost over $1,000 extra for the P2 Just curious how you figure that? Like I said, my kid rides a 2010 P2.......twice I have offered to buy him a new bike......he's not having it and will likely ride his 2010 until the wheels fall off. I would bet you'd not have any faster times with the newer bike. You can pay a lot of entry fees with the$1000+ you will save once you have to accessorize the new bike. Good luck with your purchase no matter which way you go! We have 3 tri bike, 3 road bikes, and a mtn bike....al caron and well appointed except the mtn. bike. I didn't buy any of them new.....I saved well over 5500.00 Edited by Left Brain 2014-01-30 7:04 PM |
| 2014-01-30 7:03 PM in reply to: ErikTaylor |
| Subject: RE: I can't decide on bikes, advice please. Originally posted by ErikTaylor However with the new P2 I still wouldn't have the necessities such as: Pedals, Hydration, Storage, ISM saddle which I will need (noticed a ton of pressure in my den of desire area, which would be another $250 or so just to ride. So in reality it'll cost over $1,000 extra for the P2 I have a 2007 P2. On it, I have Shimano R540 pedals which cost me $30, a used ISM saddle (good condition) that cost me $100, two metal bottle cages, one zip tied between the aero bars which cost me around $11 for both, a bento box and saddle bag that cost me around $30 total. So total...less than $200. |
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