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10k race approach, I have to win
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 2007-06-26 7:45 AM |
Extreme Veteran  1234    West Michigan |  Subject: 10k race approach, I have to winI'm not sure how much information is needed from me in order to get answers to this question. I have a bet with a friend on who will run an upcoming (Saturday 6/30) 10k the fastest. Currently I'm running five times per week, one LSD, one day of speedwork with a weekly total right around 20 miles per week. I only go into Z3 or higher on speed days, otherwise I'm very diligent to stay in Z2. THE QUESTION: What are good race plans for a 10k regarding how hard to go out? I want to run hard but also smart. For example, should I try and stay within Z2 for the first half of the race and then take off? My 5k approach has always been almost like a sprint, I just take off and hold on for the whole race, usually <23 minutes. |
| 2007-06-26 8:05 AM in reply to: #860283 |
Veteran 279 Tucson, AZ | Subject: RE: 10k race approach, I have to win I recentlyy got some race advice from a buddy of mine who runs competitively. His advice to me was, "get in over your head and stay there." |
| 2007-06-26 8:14 AM in reply to: #860283 |
Master 1686 Royersford, PA | Subject: RE: 10k race approach, I have to win For a good 10K I think the first mile and a half you need to conciously try and hold back. I like to break the race down into quarters. First quarter, get a quick break then settle in and try and ignore the people who go out way to fast. Even holding back the adrenelin rush tends to make that first mile go by quick. As you settle in you will start moving steadily forward, then each section start increasing the effort. Another thing to think about are tactical spots (hills, sharp corners, etc.) Timing your efforts to blast the uphill (or downhill) can help put some distance on your buddy and it is a good mental jab, also surging around a sharp turn and opening up a gap while they can't see you can also deflate a competitor. Good luck. And BTW what are the stakes? |
| 2007-06-26 8:20 AM in reply to: #860319 |
Extreme Veteran 1234 West Michigan | Subject: RE: 10k race approach, I have to win southwestmba - 2007-06-26 8:14 AM For a good 10K I think the first mile and a half you need to conciously try and hold back. I like to break the race down into quarters. First quarter, get a quick break then settle in and try and ignore the people who go out way to fast. Even holding back the adrenelin rush tends to make that first mile go by quick. As you settle in you will start moving steadily forward, then each section start increasing the effort. Another thing to think about are tactical spots (hills, sharp corners, etc.) Timing your efforts to blast the uphill (or downhill) can help put some distance on your buddy and it is a good mental jab, also surging around a sharp turn and opening up a gap while they can't see you can also deflate a competitor. Good luck. And BTW what are the stakes? A 12-pack of winner's choice beer and bragging rights forever! I'm not sure if we'll start out together or not but if we do, I was considering trying to hammer him on the hills because nearly 100% of his training is on a treadmill. |
| 2007-06-26 8:27 AM in reply to: #860283 |
Champion 6786 Two seat rocket plane | Subject: RE: 10k race approach, I have to win Sit 5-10 feet behind him the entire race until the last 200-400 yards and sprint around him. Make him set the pace, then bury him at the end. This assumes that you can hold his pace at all. |
| 2007-06-26 8:37 AM in reply to: #860283 |
Coach 10487 Boston, MA | Subject: RE: 10k race approach, I have to win For a 10K you should run as hard as you can! No holding back, no Z2 stuff, just get into your race pace (Z4) and hold the effort throughout. Yes it will be very hard, very challenging and painful but it should also be fun  Oh, and please make sure to warm up thoroughly before the gun goes off |
| 2007-06-26 8:39 AM in reply to: #860348 |
Extreme Veteran 1234 West Michigan | Subject: RE: 10k race approach, I have to win ride_like_u_stole_it - 2007-06-26 8:27 AM Sit 5-10 feet behind him the entire race until the last 200-400 yards and sprint around him. Make him set the pace, then bury him at the end. This assumes that you can hold his pace at all. I actually think he won't be able to hold my pace. And I'm thinking if I held behind him the whole race, even if I won I wouldn't like my time. The whole thing started when my buddy beat me in a 5k recently by five whole seconds and started running his mouth. However I ran with three of my kids and I tried to keep us together as long as I could and we had a blistering 9:42 first mile! In other words I really doubt he can beat me, I'm just trying to determine the best race approach so I can totally destroy him with minimal damage to myself. |
| 2007-06-26 8:54 AM in reply to: #860330 |
Champion 5575 Butler | Subject: RE: 10k race approach, I have to win TriMike - 2007-06-26 8:20 AM If you are going to sit down and drink the beer after todgether you are both winners, just run the race with your buddy and finish in a tie. Isn't that how kids do it today, everyone's a winner!!! Seriously though, I have never run a 10k race but have in training and I would say find a time you want to finish in and try to run a steady pace, just know where you buddy is. If he is in front of you make sure you can keep him in your sights. If he is behind you make sure he is not holding back to catch you at the end.southwestmba - 2007-06-26 8:14 AM For a good 10K I think the first mile and a half you need to conciously try and hold back. I like to break the race down into quarters. First quarter, get a quick break then settle in and try and ignore the people who go out way to fast. Even holding back the adrenelin rush tends to make that first mile go by quick. As you settle in you will start moving steadily forward, then each section start increasing the effort. Another thing to think about are tactical spots (hills, sharp corners, etc.) Timing your efforts to blast the uphill (or downhill) can help put some distance on your buddy and it is a good mental jab, also surging around a sharp turn and opening up a gap while they can't see you can also deflate a competitor. Good luck. And BTW what are the stakes? A 12-pack of winner's choice beer and bragging rights forever! I'm not sure if we'll start out together or not but if we do, I was considering trying to hammer him on the hills because nearly 100% of his training is on a treadmill. |
| 2007-06-26 9:03 AM in reply to: #860283 |
| New user 78 | Subject: RE: 10k race approach, I have to win Stay right behind him. Trip him at the end. Buy your own beer and keep bragging rights forever. Seriously... Just my $.02. Go out with him for the first mile or so if possible to get a feel for his pace. HAMMER him on the first and any subsequent hills (this will demoralize him). Keep a quick turnover on down hills. This should be a good place to put time on him. Keep a strong pace through the next couple of miles and kick his a** over the last 5K. Balls to the wall. |
| 2007-06-26 9:41 AM in reply to: #860283 |
Champion 7547 Albuquerque, New Mexico Bronze member | Subject: RE: 10k race approach, I have to win Go hard. Your best effort should result in hurling at exactly 10.01 K and if he's already there, then you have a target |
| 2007-06-26 9:57 AM in reply to: #860283 |
Expert 844 Denver, Colorado | Subject: RE: 10k race approach, I have to win Race the first mile just behind your Buddy then you'll know his pace. If its slower then you want to go... blow by him and run your pace. You can push it pretty hard for a 10k. Def. get a good warmup in before hand too. |
 2007-06-26 10:00 AM in reply to: #860283 |
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| 2007-06-26 10:01 AM in reply to: #860573 |
| Cycling Guru 15134 Fulton, MD | Subject: RE: 10k race approach, I have to win If you trust in your fitness and want to guarantee a win, then do as was jsut mentioned and shadow your friend until a mile or two to go and then go Zone 5 until the end to ensure the win. Seriously, a 10k is not much of a different approach than a 5k ..... it just hurts for longer! My last 5k I averaged close to 194-ish for my HR with a peak of 201 (and I'm 36, so no spring chicken). A week later my average was 190 in the 10k that I did. |
| 2007-06-26 10:03 AM in reply to: #860283 |
| Giver 18427 | Subject: RE: 10k race approach, I have to win There was an article in Runner's World a few months ago about a "study" (not sure how scientific it was) that looked at whether or not you run faster going out hard or holding back. It concluded that you run faster overall buy going out hard. |
| 2007-06-26 10:14 AM in reply to: #860382 |
| Champion 6786 Two seat rocket plane | Subject: RE: 10k race approach, I have to win TriMike - 2007-06-26 8:39 AM ride_like_u_stole_it - 2007-06-26 8:27 AM Sit 5-10 feet behind him the entire race until the last 200-400 yards and sprint around him. Make him set the pace, then bury him at the end. This assumes that you can hold his pace at all. I actually think he won't be able to hold my pace. And I'm thinking if I held behind him the whole race, even if I won I wouldn't like my time. The whole thing started when my buddy beat me in a 5k recently by five whole seconds and started running his mouth. However I ran with three of my kids and I tried to keep us together as long as I could and we had a blistering 9:42 first mile! In other words I really doubt he can beat me, I'm just trying to determine the best race approach so I can totally destroy him with minimal damage to myself.That's true, but it's easier to taunt him the whole way if you are nearby
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Or you could run ahead and jog in place at the tops of the hills and wait for him to catch up....and repeat.......then invite him to do a little "cool down" run afterwards.....Or maybe wear a clown suit (OK, that's over the top)| 2007-06-26 10:17 AM in reply to: #860382 |
| Elite 3130 | Subject: RE: 10k race approach, I have to win TriMike - 2007-06-26 7:39 AM I actually think he won't be able to hold my pace. And I'm thinking if I held behind him the whole race, even if I won I wouldn't like my time. OK, make up your mind. Is the objective to beat your buddy or set a PR?
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| 2007-06-26 10:20 AM in reply to: #860283 |
| Crystal Lake, IL | Subject: RE: 10k race approach, I have to win One thing I always bring up is running hills. If he's a 'mill runner he may not be ready for this. On the downhills lean forward and let gravity accelerate you down the hill. He'll probably waste a lot of effort fighting the hill as he chugs down it. As long as your legs feel ok you will be able to increase your pace without a significant increase in effort. This could be an easy way to put more distance between the two of you and he won't even realize how you are doing it. If you don't already do this when you run, maybe practice it once or twice this week on some hills. |
| 2007-06-26 10:25 AM in reply to: #860283 |
| Extreme Veteran 1234 West Michigan | Subject: RE: 10k race approach, I have to win Thanks for all the good information. I've only run two 10ks in my life and the first one I went way too slow for the first 5k and then had too much left over for the last 5k and my time sucked. The 2nd was actually on a cross country course (two laps of their 5k course) which was great but I thought I went out too hard because towards the end my legs were dead and my lungs were on fire. My time though was 53 something which I was happy with. Based on the feedback I think my approach will be to stay with him for the first mile or so unless it's just way too slow. Then I'll hammer him on the first hill and run as hard as I can the rest of the way. No clown suit but I'll taunt him like a mf'r whenever possible. Friends are great eh? |
| 2007-06-26 10:27 AM in reply to: #860283 |
| Subject: RE: 10k race approach, I have to win I will say this much.... In almost every competitive race, with the elite runners, the pace setter almost NEVER wins. Why? It's hard to do, both physically and mentally. Pace setter has to constantly think about when to go, how fast he's going, who's behind him. Plus, he's breaking the air, and allowing everyone to draft. Even when someone's going for a record, they almost always employ a rabbit to set the pace until the very end. You wanna beat your friend, you need to know how your friend runs. If he's got a killer kick, holding with him may not work. If he's got less stamina than you, your best bet is to either hold with him until about 2 miles out, or try to punish him on the early hills. Another way to mentally break him down is to break contact with him. This works if the course has alot of sections where you can't see very far ahead. If it's a pretty straight course, this is much harder to do. |
| 2007-06-26 10:28 AM in reply to: #860636 |
| Extreme Veteran 1234 West Michigan | Subject: RE: 10k race approach, I have to win ScottoNM - 2007-06-26 10:17 AM TriMike - 2007-06-26 7:39 AM I actually think he won't be able to hold my pace. And I'm thinking if I held behind him the whole race, even if I won I wouldn't like my time. OK, make up your mind. Is the objective to beat your buddy or set a PR?
I didn't say I wanted to PR, just that I know people will check my time and if it's slow they won't know I held out to beat a friend in the race. So to clarify, I want a fast time and at a minimum it has to be faster than his. |
| 2007-06-26 11:10 AM in reply to: #860283 |
| Crystal Lake, IL | Subject: RE: 10k race approach, I have to win A few weeks ago a certain BT'er was all nervous about the swim start to his first HIM. He was talking to people, thinking up scenarios and how he would react. It got to a point that I yelled (across the internet) to this guy who is way bigger than me and swims way faster than me. I believe I can adapt my clear cut and helpful instructions to your situation. Hope this helps. JUST F*CKING RUN!
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| 2007-06-26 12:03 PM in reply to: #860787 |
| Extreme Veteran 490 London | Subject: RE: 10k race approach, I have to win |
| 2007-06-26 12:54 PM in reply to: #860918 |
| Extreme Veteran 1234 West Michigan | Subject: RE: 10k race approach, I have to win Graycat - 2007-06-26 12:03 PM hangloose - 2007-06-26 4:10 PM JUST F*CKING RUN!
Yup, that'd be my advise too I'm on it! |
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