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2012-07-18 11:15 AM


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Subject: Half Ironman training - Collegiate Swimmer

All,

A response would be appreciated. I'm looking at getting into triathlons fairly seriously (I'm tired of "training without a purpose") and would like to know what some of the experienced patrons of this site feel would be feasible for racing a Half in late October this year.

I'm about 6'3 185, was a division 1 All American swimmer (male) who has stayed in good shape. My senior year was 2011 and I've cycled pretty regularly since then (as in a weekend 50 miler isn't a challenge). I can swim til the cows come home. Running though... I'm not in as good of shape there, but could run a 5k handily. Never done more than that though.

Could I be ready for a Half in October?

 

It's July 18 now (Though I'm sure that's obvious)



Edited by 20point 2012-07-18 11:15 AM


2012-07-18 11:20 AM
in reply to: #4317917

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Subject: RE: Half Ironman training - Collegiate Swimmer

This forum seems to be littered with threads about people who sign up for triathlons and have no idea how to swim.  You'll be the first person who can nail the swim, but can't run! Wink

I've never done that distance, but I'd think you could pull it off.  Just start running.

2012-07-18 11:21 AM
in reply to: #4317917

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Subject: RE: Half Ironman training - Collegiate Swimmer
Eh, maybe you could be ready in Oct for a HIM.

Not impossible.

Do you already have a bike? Have you been running?

I'll say this, swimmers sometimes a hard time (injury prone) with running . Maybe your youth will be in your favor on this one. Of course, I won't say ALL swimmers have a hard time. Just keep in mind that you are going from a no impact sport to a high impact sport with running. I recall in my USAT coaches clinic them talking about that's why swimmers are more injury prone with regards to running.

I said all of that because you want to ramp up your miles SAFELY (10% per week is the general rule of thumb) to ensure you do not get injured.

Good luck!
2012-07-18 11:21 AM
in reply to: #4317917

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Subject: RE: Half Ironman training - Collegiate Swimmer
It's doable.   Pick up a training plan that concentrates on the run.   Or you could always do the run with the Galloway method, which incorporates walk breaks in the run.
2012-07-18 11:22 AM
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Subject: RE: Half Ironman training - Collegiate Swimmer
Can you do flip turns? Sorry just old BT joke.

My opinion is a big yes. Build up the bike weekely volume up and running over the next 10 weeks by following a plan . You will probably do real well.

I could imagine you will win the swim, and still have a lot in the tank. Your biking is already pretty good..

Work on that run and let us know how it goes
2012-07-18 11:26 AM
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Subject: RE: Half Ironman training - Collegiate Swimmer

KSH - 2012-07-18 12:21 PM  I'll say this, swimmers sometimes a hard time (injury prone) with running

This has been my issue. I have a swimming background and have been plagued with running injuries. I didn't know this was a trend though - is there reasoning behind this?

I definitely second ramping up your mileage safely and possibly using Galloway. Part of training is getting yourself to the starting line healthy. That is a big deal for me as I start to pursue greater distances.



2012-07-18 11:33 AM
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Subject: RE: Half Ironman training - Collegiate Swimmer

Sure you could be "ready".  Depends on what you want to accomplish.  If you just want to finish you can be ready by Oct.

The swim fitness is obviously there.  Get some open water swims in to make sure you're comfy without the nice black line guiding you.  Your bike at 50 miles is good.  Try to get that up 60 and 70 miles for a long ride.  The run, you can adopt a walk run strategy.

x2 to finding a plan that focuses on the run.  Just make sure you ease into it and dont get injured.

2012-07-18 11:40 AM
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Subject: RE: Half Ironman training - Collegiate Swimmer
20point - 2012-07-18 11:15 AM

All,

A response would be appreciated. I'm looking at getting into triathlons fairly seriously (I'm tired of "training without a purpose") and would like to know what some of the experienced patrons of this site feel would be feasible for racing a Half in late October this year.

I'm about 6'3 185, was a division 1 All American swimmer (male) who has stayed in good shape. My senior year was 2011 and I've cycled pretty regularly since then (as in a weekend 50 miler isn't a challenge). I can swim til the cows come home. Running though... I'm not in as good of shape there, but could run a 5k handily. Never done more than that though.

Could I be ready for a Half in October?

 

It's July 18 now (Though I'm sure that's obvious)

 

Yes.  You can be ready and then some.  In all liklihood - you will probably be the first out of the water hold your own in the bike, and then finish dead last in the run :D  kidding, kidding - this is all coming from a place of jealousy as everytime I close my eyes I imagine myself to be a 6'3", 185 pound Division I All American swimmer

Again, you'll be fine.  Start running regularly, and start adding distance to your runs.  My guess is that you'll probably want to feel comfortable doing the 13.1 (as in, you can run the 13 miles without feeling like you're about to die) because it sounds like your other two legs will put you in just fine.

Find a race now and register.  It'll be the motivation to keep you going.  

I'd bet on you finishing and doing pretty well.

2012-07-18 11:57 AM
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Subject: RE: Half Ironman training - Collegiate Swimmer
FloridaTriGirl - 2012-07-18 11:26 AM

KSH - 2012-07-18 12:21 PM  I'll say this, swimmers sometimes a hard time (injury prone) with running

This has been my issue. I have a swimming background and have been plagued with running injuries. I didn't know this was a trend though - is there reasoning behind this?

I definitely second ramping up your mileage safely and possibly using Galloway. Part of training is getting yourself to the starting line healthy. That is a big deal for me as I start to pursue greater distances.

Likely from training philosophies being very different in swimming vs running. Understanding how easy "easy" really is. And that the aerobic development could be well ahead of muscles and soft tissue's ability to handle the pounding and loading. Think of it like a strong engine on a weak car frame. All those easy runs help to build up the strength of the frame.

2012-07-18 12:13 PM
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Subject: RE: Half Ironman training - Collegiate Swimmer

Not a single problem at all if all you want to do is finish.  The swim will be simple for you, the bike is doable even at the point you are now....and worse case scenario you walk most of the run (like most people do these days).

Triathlon is not as big a deal as it's made out to be....especially so for top level athletes.

2012-07-18 1:08 PM
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Subject: RE: Half Ironman training - Collegiate Swimmer
Way to go for it 20point.  I'm still swimming in college (one year left) at Notre Dame.  I was just curious where you went.  And i take it from your name that you swam the 50 lol I'd love to hear how it went. Good luck!


2012-07-18 1:09 PM
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Subject: RE: Half Ironman training - Collegiate Swimmer

You're young and fit, and sure you could probably do it tomorrow, though the run would be very very ugly.  By October, it will probably be just kind of ugly.

But you say that you want to get into tris "fairly seriously".  Faking your way through a HIM on a few months of run training is not the best way to go about doing so.  You'd be far better off doing some sprints (starting now) and aim for a couple of late season Olympic distance races as your 'A' races for this year.  Run a ton (but do it properly, especially building mileage -- run training is not like swim training).

2012-07-18 1:33 PM
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Subject: RE: Half Ironman training - Collegiate Swimmer
Experior - 2012-07-18 2:09 PM

You're young and fit, and sure you could probably do it tomorrow, though the run would be very very ugly.  By October, it will probably be just kind of ugly.

But you say that you want to get into tris "fairly seriously".  Faking your way through a HIM on a few months of run training is not the best way to go about doing so.  You'd be far better off doing some sprints (starting now) and aim for a couple of late season Olympic distance races as your 'A' races for this year.  Run a ton (but do it properly, especially building mileage -- run training is not like swim training).

 

I have to echo this. If you will make triathlon a part of your life I would just build up run volume and race shorter distances first. The experience will be very valuable too. I have no doubt you can complete a HIM, but thinking long term, why not wait until you can crush the race with minimal risk of injury?

2012-07-18 1:45 PM
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Subject: RE: Half Ironman training - Collegiate Swimmer

If you choose a HIM training plan, I recommend modifying it to suit your needs.  Because let's face it, most generic plans are not designed with a collegiate swimmer in mind.

YOU know what kind of time you need in the pool in order to maintain your swim fitness.  Start with that and then mold the plan around it.  Emphasize consistent running (not speed work) and you'll be well on your way.

2012-07-18 1:56 PM
in reply to: #4318104


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Subject: RE: Half Ironman training - Collegiate Swimmer
brigby1 - 2012-07-18 12:57 PM
FloridaTriGirl - 2012-07-18 11:26 AM

KSH - 2012-07-18 12:21 PM  I'll say this, swimmers sometimes a hard time (injury prone) with running

This has been my issue. I have a swimming background and have been plagued with running injuries. I didn't know this was a trend though - is there reasoning behind this?

I definitely second ramping up your mileage safely and possibly using Galloway. Part of training is getting yourself to the starting line healthy. That is a big deal for me as I start to pursue greater distances.

Likely from training philosophies being very different in swimming vs running. Understanding how easy "easy" really is. And that the aerobic development could be well ahead of muscles and soft tissue's ability to handle the pounding and loading. Think of it like a strong engine on a weak car frame. All those easy runs help to build up the strength of the frame.

 

Yeah, makes total sense. That is definitely me! Aerobic development was great but couldn't take the pounding. Now, when I go for an easy run I remind myself that it's not junk miles, it's good to build up muscle/bone strength.

2012-07-18 2:55 PM
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Subject: RE: Half Ironman training - Collegiate Swimmer

So what's your 5K PR?

I think everyone here assumed you suck at running, but with the MONSTER motor of a D1 swimmer a "crappy 5K" to you could be 17:30. 

A D1 all american swimmer no doubt has the motor of a 14 flat 5Ker. 



Edited by cmscat50 2012-07-18 2:56 PM


2012-07-18 3:09 PM
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Subject: RE: Half Ironman training - Collegiate Swimmer

Yes. My guess is that you just haven't stuck with running for any significant amount of time to realize that you don't actually suck at it. Anybody as fit as you can be ready to run a half marathon by October. Given the fact that the swim is not going to impact you all that much, and you're probably capable of pacing yourself and still finding speed on the bike, you'll also be able to run that HM after the swim and bike.

I think you'd probably be able to get yourself in solid enough shape to have a pretty good showing for your debut.

Find a stand alone 12 week HM training plan that feels doable to you and determine how it would feel to complete it while maintaining bike and swim time as well. 

Go for it. 

2012-07-18 4:48 PM
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Subject: RE: Half Ironman training - Collegiate Swimmer
Yes. You'll do just fine. I do recommend training every day tho (even if it is just a 15 min recovery spin or run) to ensure you don't get lazy and take too many days off. I did the same thing for my first half (same exact time frame actually), but I wasn't a great swimmer, had biked less than 100 miles total, and was just barely breaking 20 min for a 5k again after doing some hard speedwork sessions. After 4 months of training every day instead of 3-4 days per week and playing basketball or soccer the rest of the time, I went from barely finishing an Oly to almost breaking 5 hours for the HIM. Part of it does depend on your response to training stimuli, but with your background you should have no problem tearing it up.
2012-07-18 6:11 PM
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Subject: RE: Half Ironman training - Collegiate Swimmer
A HIM is totally doable. I agree with what everyone else has said. I would recommend entering a shorter distance tri prior to the HIM. Also get as many bike miles in, as you can. Also build your run mileage up slowly and possibly get your running gait analyzed. On top of that swim only on recovery days. You are not going to get gains in swimming, that would make it worth your time. Good luck
2012-07-18 6:58 PM
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Subject: RE: Half Ironman training - Collegiate Swimmer

You should totally get a coach. 


With both the serious training mindset of a D1 swimmer as well as the physical accomplishments and gifts required to perform at that level, you can dominate your AG very early on as long as you don't get injured. 

 

Unfortunately, it's guys/gals like you who tend to get lots of stress fractures on the run as your cardio engine >>> your bone acclimation to run impact. 

 

You should seriously consider hiring a coach, even if you're just 'doing this for fun.' Not just to win, but to avoid any season-ending injuries with your massive engine. I suspect that a reasonable coach should have you on the AG podium within 6 months of training in local races, and outright winning your age group in 12-18 months even against guys with years of triathlon racing background. D1 genetics and training mindset is elite, and tougher and more disciplined than the elite division of triathletes. 

2012-07-18 7:27 PM
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Subject: RE: Half Ironman training - Collegiate Swimmer
agarose2000 - 2012-07-18 7:58 PM

You should totally get a coach. 


With both the serious training mindset of a D1 swimmer as well as the physical accomplishments and gifts required to perform at that level, you can dominate your AG very early on as long as you don't get injured. 

 

Unfortunately, it's guys/gals like you who tend to get lots of stress fractures on the run as your cardio engine >>> your bone acclimation to run impact. 

 

You should seriously consider hiring a coach, even if you're just 'doing this for fun.' Not just to win, but to avoid any season-ending injuries with your massive engine. I suspect that a reasonable coach should have you on the AG podium within 6 months of training in local races, and outright winning your age group in 12-18 months even against guys with years of triathlon racing background. D1 genetics and training mindset is elite, and tougher and more disciplined than the elite division of triathletes. 

I agree with much of this.  Especially the part about working with a coach for the sake of avoiding injury.  As a recent D1 swimmer, you have both the engine and work ethic to hurt yourself very quickly with run training if you try to approach it the way you're accustomed to swim training.  It needs to be almost the exact opposite of what you did with swimming - Instead of almost all hard intervals with a small percentage of easy swimming, starting out running is going to seem like it's almost all easy with a small percentage of hard running.

I also think you can be ready, but building running durability, learning appropriate pacing for a multi-hour race, and learning tri-specific skills should be your focus.



2012-07-18 8:38 PM
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Subject: RE: Half Ironman training - Collegiate Swimmer
TriMyBest - 2012-07-18 8:27 PM
agarose2000 - 2012-07-18 7:58 PM

You should totally get a coach. 


With both the serious training mindset of a D1 swimmer as well as the physical accomplishments and gifts required to perform at that level, you can dominate your AG very early on as long as you don't get injured. 

 

Unfortunately, it's guys/gals like you who tend to get lots of stress fractures on the run as your cardio engine >>> your bone acclimation to run impact. 

 

You should seriously consider hiring a coach, even if you're just 'doing this for fun.' Not just to win, but to avoid any season-ending injuries with your massive engine. I suspect that a reasonable coach should have you on the AG podium within 6 months of training in local races, and outright winning your age group in 12-18 months even against guys with years of triathlon racing background. D1 genetics and training mindset is elite, and tougher and more disciplined than the elite division of triathletes. 

I agree with much of this.  Especially the part about working with a coach for the sake of avoiding injury.  As a recent D1 swimmer, you have both the engine and work ethic to hurt yourself very quickly with run training if you try to approach it the way you're accustomed to swim training.  It needs to be almost the exact opposite of what you did with swimming - Instead of almost all hard intervals with a small percentage of easy swimming, starting out running is going to seem like it's almost all easy with a small percentage of hard running.

I also think you can be ready, but building running durability, learning appropriate pacing for a multi-hour race, and learning tri-specific skills should be your focus.

I kind of disagree.

DIII swimmer here, now a triathlete. 

You do need to start running slowly and for short distances. Build gradually. If you're anything like me, it will not come easily - and you won't love it at first

I don't think you need a coach just yet, you just need to build your running base slowly. Find a proven plan intended for new runners - one where you look at the first week and think it is easy - and stick to it. Listen to your body - you know it well. 

And, once more for emphasis: Build slowly and gradually.

And have fun being the in the front of the pack coming out of the water

2012-07-19 1:46 PM
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Subject: RE: Half Ironman training - Collegiate Swimmer

I will also concur that you can definitely do it. You already have the swim. You already have the bike. However, don't plan on being a fast runner for this race. Maybe in another year or two but not for this one.

You have the ability in that cardio-wise you are set for all 3 disciplines. However being a cyclist and a swimmer your bones and soft tissues are not strong enough to handle the stress YET. It takes time to increase your bone density and strengthen the soft tissues while avoiding injury. Youth and fitness are on your side but I would give it a minimum of 6-12mo before you really start trying to build speed.

I would build mileage slowly and not worry about speed. Maintain your swim which should be relatively easy for you. Work really hard on your bike and only do easy runs with a focus on getting distance. This will be your first race and there will be many new things to experience during the process. Plan on getting through it healthy and having fun and give yourself time to work on winning so that you can avoid injury

2012-07-19 2:08 PM
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Subject: RE: Half Ironman training - Collegiate Swimmer

As an All American D1 swimmer you are not simply a beginner athlete or triathlete.  You have the background and discipline to do quite well, right out of the box.  I've seen it numerous times.  I recently saw a D1 swimmer about your age with zero multi sport training in the past two years come in second and only lose overall to a pro.  

The advice you are getting here isn't for athletes of your calibre, it is for us aging geezers who are just beginning.  You are in a whole different class of athlete.  

As swimmers we stink at running as a general rule.  The good thing for you is that you will crush everyone in the swim so you can devote your training to the other two sports.  You will have multi minute advantage coming out of the water so use that to your benefit.  

2012-07-19 10:18 PM
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Subject: RE: Half Ironman training - Collegiate Swimmer
An old swimmer here that never has been able to run. Take it easy on the running and work your way up slowly. Doing a half should be a piece of cake as long as you avoid injury. All of the swimmers I know seem to have poor form in addition to the loading issues already discussed. Have a running coach check your stride and gate early on. Checking your form now might keep you from entering the swim bike and walk event later in life.
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