General Discussion Triathlon Talk » "Guy" Pain while in Aero, help? Rss Feed  
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2008-08-26 1:02 AM

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Subject: "Guy" Pain while in Aero, help?

OK, this is way embarrassing since I searched the BT forums and couldn't find any other posts with this issue, but here it goes.  I've been riding a lot lately and I'm trying to get more comfortable in the aero position (I ride a Felt S32).  It seems, though, that after about 5-10 mins in aero position I get a very uncomfortable pain right were the seat hits the perineum (space between the genitalia and the anus).  I've tried moving forward and back on the seat but it doesn't seem to help very much.  I've lost a ton of weight over the last few months and when I was heavier I could ride in aero indefinately with no problems.  No so much any more.  If I get out of aero I can ride for at least 2-3 hrs without the slightest pain (neck, back or otherwise and no chafing).  However, it doesn't do me a lot of good to have a tri bike if I can't capitalize on the aero bars.

Do I need to get a new bike fit?  My last one was about 900 miles/2 yrs ago.  Do I need more padding?  Do I just need to stop whining and ride more?  Any other thoughts? I figured with as large a group as BT has, there's got to be at least one or two people who experienced this before and could help me out.



2008-08-26 4:53 AM
in reply to: #1628004

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Subject: RE: "Guy" Pain while in Aero, help?
2008-08-26 5:02 AM
in reply to: #1628004

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Subject: RE: "Guy" Pain while in Aero, help?
rsqdvr - 2008-08-26 1:02 AM

 

Do I need to get a new bike fit?  My last one was about 900 miles/2 yrs ago.    Do I just need to stop whining and ride more?  Any other thoughts? I figured with as large a group as BT has, there's got to be at least one or two people who experienced this before and could help me out.

If you've only ridden 900 miles in two years you "just need to stop whining and ride more." Time in the saddle will cause you to HTFU quite a bit.

If that doesn't work, have your fit checked, investigate a new saddle like the Adamo.

2008-08-26 5:14 AM
in reply to: #1628004

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Subject: RE: "Guy" Pain while in Aero, help?
You should get a new fit. I know, from first hand experience, that when you lose a great deal of weight, as you did, your geometry changes.
2008-08-26 5:22 AM
in reply to: #1628026

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Subject: RE: "Guy" Pain while in Aero, help?
x2 on the adamo.

I was having the same issues you were before I moved to the adamo. The adamo took a few hundred miles to get used to (sore sit bones) but I can deal with sore sit bones a lot easier then numb junk, but that's just me!

2008-08-26 5:36 AM
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Subject: RE: "Guy" Pain while in Aero, help?

I'm a med student, and we, for a whole one lesson, go through the whole cycling/perineum/saddle topic, so I like to consider myself semi-well versed on it, not first hand though. 

I've got a standard road bike saddle on a standard road bike, and I can't really lean forwards to a standard roadie position, because I'm paranoid as all hell, and it's slightly discomforting, I've got to be as upright as possible... lame. Im getting my bike converted to a tri setup, as much as geometry will allow, which will only make things worse. I've forked out for specialized's tri saddle, with the V cutout. Will be another week until the saddle arrives, so a week + a few days i'll report back how it goes for 45km, 90km and 180km rides.

edit. Numb is different from pain... numb is lack of bloodflow, no worries there. Lie on your arm for a bit and it goes numb, no impending danger from your arm falling off Smile

Contrary to popular belief, pain is not fear leaving the body (in this instance)



Edited by robbo22 2008-08-26 5:40 AM


2008-08-26 7:39 AM
in reply to: #1628004

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Subject: RE: "Guy" Pain while in Aero, help?
The first thing I would try is to drop the nose of your seat. Road bike seats need to be flat. Tri bikes do not.
2008-08-26 8:26 AM
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Subject: RE: "Guy" Pain while in Aero, help?
Changing the saddle is never the correct "immediate solution."  If you have a bad fit on a bike, changing the seat is only going to mask the real problem.  Now if you have had a good real fit to the bike and are still having issues, then a new saddle might be the way to go.
2008-08-26 8:26 AM
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Subject: RE: "Guy" Pain while in Aero, help?

bravo1 - 2008-08-26 8:39 AM The first thing I would try is to drop the nose of your seat. Road bike seats need to be flat. Tri bikes do not.

Bzzzzzzzzzzt.  Wrong answer.  Care to try again in the lightening round?

2008-08-26 8:29 AM
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Subject: RE: "Guy" Pain while in Aero, help?

To summarize:

Adamo is great.

Then get a bike fit.

Then as Bear said, ride more. You might want to do this first though as your is not alot and will not be a good gauge.  But Definately get a bike fit too.

2008-08-26 8:43 AM
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Subject: RE: "Guy" Pain while in Aero, help?
the bear - 2008-08-26 5:02 AM

rsqdvr - 2008-08-26 1:02 AM

 

Do I need to get a new bike fit?  My last one was about 900 miles/2 yrs ago.    Do I just need to stop whining and ride more?  Any other thoughts? I figured with as large a group as BT has, there's got to be at least one or two people who experienced this before and could help me out.

If you've only ridden 900 miles in two years you "just need to stop whining and ride more." Time in the saddle will cause you to HTFU quite a bit.

If that doesn't work, have your fit checked, investigate a new saddle like the Adamo.



+1

Nothing is going to feel good until you have a few thousand miles on your . That said, the Adamo saddle turned biking into something I enjoy.


2008-08-26 8:53 AM
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Subject: RE: "Guy" Pain while in Aero, help?
Yup - more miles, a better fit, and an Adamo.
2008-08-26 11:00 AM
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Subject: RE: "Guy" Pain while in Aero, help?
Another one for there adamo here.  This saddle was the best cycling investment I've made and that includes the bike.
2008-08-26 11:00 AM
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Subject: RE: "Guy" Pain while in Aero, help?

Ride more, then...

Check your fit, then...

Look at a new saddle.

 

2008-08-26 11:44 AM
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Subject: RE: "Guy" Pain while in Aero, help?
 Adamo here too. Word of caution, the Adamo will feel like riding a 2X4 for a little while. The pain will not be on your perinium though.
2008-08-26 11:57 AM
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Subject: RE: "Guy" Pain while in Aero, help?
Perineum? Don't you mean 'taint'?

No need to get all technical.





2008-08-26 12:58 PM
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Subject: RE: "Guy" Pain while in Aero, help?
bradleyd3 - 2008-08-26 11:57 AM

Perineum? Don't you mean 'taint'?

No need to get all technical.





Damn, beat me to it!

I'd try dropping the nose of the saddle a degree or two. A word of caution, a small change can make a big difference here so don't go nuts.

Buying new shtuff should not be the first thing you do.

When I set my roadie up with aerobars I have to drop the nose of the saddle or my taint hurts. When I take the aerobars off I have to tip the saddle back to level or my arse hurts like hell.
2008-08-26 1:00 PM
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Subject: RE: "Guy" Pain while in Aero, help?

bravo1 - 2008-08-26 8:39 AM The first thing I would try is to drop the nose of your seat. 

x2.  Most road set ups have the saddle flat or slightly tilted up.  But on the aerobars, you will put too much pressure that way.  I don't use an Adamo, though I've heard good things about it.  Since  it does not have a nose jammed up the butt, so to speak, it would work, for around $80.  Or for free, drop the nose a half inch or so, and give it a ride.

2008-08-26 1:58 PM
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Subject: RE: "Guy" Pain while in Aero, help?

I'll have to buck the trend. Rsqdvr says that before he lost the weight he was extemely comfortable in his aero position and saddle now that he's lighter the saddle hurts. If the wieght loss effected  his position by shifting his center of mass I would think it would manifest somewhere besides the seat.

It sounds to me that the relationship between the seat and your area changed when you lost the weight. You may need a wider saddle to distribute your weight differently, because there may be more space down there. I can't recommend a specific saddle but look for flexiblity and not too squishy, not too hard. Nylon flexes more than plastic. Carbon is too stiff.

You know your seat is to stiff if when you hit a bump and it feels like a sharp punch in the taint.

 

 

2008-08-26 2:00 PM
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Subject: RE: "Guy" Pain while in Aero, help?

graceful_dave - 2008-08-26 12:58 PMA word of caution, a small change can make a big difference here so don't go nuts

Yes, that sounds equally painful and to be avoided at all costs.

2008-08-26 2:09 PM
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Subject: RE: "Guy" Pain while in Aero, help?
I will repeat this again very bluntly .... at no point should you ever have your saddle below level.  It doesn't matter if it is a tri bike or a road bike.  The concept of fit and positioning is the same overall regardless.  If you have to do that, your fit is wrong to begin with or even worse, the bike is the wrong size for what you are trying to do with it.


2008-08-26 2:21 PM
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Subject: RE: "Guy" Pain while in Aero, help?

Daremo - 2008-08-26 2:09 PM I will repeat this again very bluntly .... at no point should you ever have your saddle below level

This quote is from the Blackwell Research website (the designer and manufacturer of the Adamo) describing proper installation of the Adamo saddle:

Using the tilt mechanism on the seatpost, adjust the tilt of the saddle for maximum comfort. This will depend significantly on your body angle when in your standard seated position. Sitting up straight may warrant a flatter saddle position (although our tests suggest that you do want some forward tilt on the seat). Riding in a more aerodynamic position (with 30° - 60° body angle) may require further tilt forward for maximum comfort.

2008-08-26 2:26 PM
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Subject: RE: "Guy" Pain while in Aero, help?
DaveH - 2008-08-26 2:21 PM

Daremo - 2008-08-26 2:09 PM I will repeat this again very bluntly .... at no point should you ever have your saddle below level

This quote is from the Blackwell Research website (the designer and manufacturer of the Adamo) describing proper installation of the Adamo saddle:

Using the tilt mechanism on the seatpost, adjust the tilt of the saddle for maximum comfort. This will depend significantly on your body angle when in your standard seated position. Sitting up straight may warrant a flatter saddle position (although our tests suggest that you do want some forward tilt on the seat). Riding in a more aerodynamic position (with 30° - 60° body angle) may require further tilt forward for maximum comfort.

Also from the Installation and Setup Guide:

The Adamo Racing/Road saddle was designed to be ridden in a flat position or even tilted downward anywhere from 1-7 degrees.

2008-08-26 2:32 PM
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Subject: RE: "Guy" Pain while in Aero, help?

Hmmmmmm.  Installation instructions for the Adamo say that.  Can't dispute that fact.

But as a fitter, I would never set anyone up that way, regardless of the saddle choice.  Again, if you have to do that, there is something else inherently wrong with your position or bike sizing.

The simple reason being is that your core and sit bones are no longer supporting you.  You are now calling on your back and shoulders to do some of that balance.  It may be subtle, but it will still cause more fatigue over a long ride and stress a lot of muscles that riding shouldn't.



Edited by Daremo 2008-08-26 2:34 PM
2008-08-26 3:25 PM
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Subject: RE: "Guy" Pain while in Aero, help?
Broompatrol - 2008-08-26 1:58 PM

I'll have to buck the trend. Rsqdvr says that before he lost the weight he was extemely comfortable in his aero position and saddle now that he's lighter the saddle hurts. If the wieght loss effected  his position by shifting his center of mass I would think it would manifest somewhere besides the seat.

It sounds to me that the relationship between the seat and your area changed when you lost the weight. You may need a wider saddle to distribute your weight differently, because there may be more space down there. I can't recommend a specific saddle but look for flexiblity and not too squishy, not too hard. Nylon flexes more than plastic. Carbon is too stiff.

You know your seat is to stiff if when you hit a bump and it feels like a sharp punch in the taint.

Ditto - the fact that the problem manifested itself AFTER losing weight is probably important.  I would definitely play around a little with your current saddle first (adjust the level a little, etc), and be conscious of where your sit-bones are in relation to the padded part of the saddle.

I don't have any experience with the Adamo, but a less expensive saddle like the Trek CRZ (if they still make them) has worked really well for me.

Gotta agree with Daremo on the downward tilt thing though - my personal experience is that a downward tilt puts way too much pressure on your wrists and hands over the course of a ride.  Note that my experience with that was before I added aero-bars to my road bike, so your mileage may vary.

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